# How in the blue fuck has Neil Young gotten as far as he has? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 29, 2003, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000 "2003-04-29T21:05:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Already\_in\_Use](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a9adbd/32.png) [@Already\_in\_Use](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Already_in_Use)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2003, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/21 "2003-04-29T22:41:31Z")
Man oh man, I just can’t start my day without hearing a little John Ashcroft! I just wake up and say, “OK, **Already** , what will it be today – ‘Let the Eagle Soar’ or ‘Blessed Be That City?’” Such a lyrical genius too – “But just buildin’ up your body / With kung-fu and karate / Ain’t no ticket to a bright eternity!” You can’t dance to it, but I think that was the plan. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Payton\_s\_Servant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3da27b/32.png) [@Payton\_s\_Servant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Payton_s_Servant)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2003, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/22 "2003-04-29T23:12:14Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Fingolfin \* > **he is a killer guitar player.** Actually, he’s a really primative player, better at making _noise_ then _music_ with the guitar, but it works fairly well for him. ---
**Author:** ![Duke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e8c25b/32.png) [@Duke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2003, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/23 "2003-04-29T23:19:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Fingolfin \* > \*\*[looks at FranticMad] > > Is that the dude from **The Verve**? \*\* Actually, considering this part of his post: > [@](#): > > I heard him only once and I will never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never get the memory of that quavering desecration of wind out of my mind. I think he really _could_ be talking about **John** Ashcroft! 😛 ---
**Author:** ![TigoleBitties](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cab0a1/32.png) [@TigoleBitties](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TigoleBitties)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2003, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/24 "2003-04-29T23:36:10Z")
God help us if you hear Tom Waits To that end, I say music is in the ear of the beholder. And you can piss on Neil all you like, because frankly, he does not and more than likely would not give a shit. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2003, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/25 "2003-04-29T23:38:16Z")
Let’t get one thing straight here at least. While I agree with some above that Neil Young’s voice is an acquired taste, and I agree with others who have tremendous respect for his writing, he does NOT, **bernse** sing out of tune. His pitch is nearly perfect–just listen to the sharp harmonies of Crosby Stills Nash and Young if you doubt it. What you object to is not his pitch, but the quality, the texture, the tone, the timbre, whatever, of his voice. ---
**Author:** ![Reeder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Reeder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reeder)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2003, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/26 "2003-04-29T23:38:53Z")
Outside of **Southern Man** his music is great! It’s not the voice that makes the music nor really the singing talent. It’s the fact that it comes from the heart. And it shows. ---
**Author:** ![FranticMad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c68b51/32.png) [@FranticMad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FranticMad)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2003, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/27 "2003-04-29T23:46:27Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Already in Use \* > \*\*“But just buildin’ up your body / With kung-fu and karate / Ain’t no ticket to a bright eternity!” > \*\* Stop, stop, STOP! I can’t TAKE IT. I confess, I’ll be your toe slave, just No More Ashcroft please… sob ---
**Author:** ![Duke\_of\_Rat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Duke\_of\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke_of_Rat)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2003, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/28 "2003-04-30T00:30:48Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bernse \* > \*\*Absolutely. But if that is the case, why do all of his “popular” songs appear to be sung out of tune? > Well, what I consider a fairly broad cross section, really. > > My CD collection has a lot of 80-90s light and heavy rock, light listening (IE-Roger Whittiker) and Classical (Mozart, J.S Bach, Bethoveen, etc) > > Question (since I am obviously not a Neil Young fan): Does he sing that badly on purpose? \*\* I’ve always said that as long as Neil Young could make it as a singer, there was always hope for me. Now you have gone and smashed my dreams. Thanks a lot!! Of course I can’t play guitar, either. Of course, Slim Whitman sold lots of albums (and destroyed the Martians!) so who can say what’s good music. ---
**Author:** ![Anita\_Vacation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Anita\_Vacation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anita_Vacation)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2003, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/29 "2003-04-30T00:44:20Z")
Neil Young is the master of Garage Rock. It’s a very primitive sound - if his voice was perfect the music would lose its power. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2003, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/30 "2003-04-30T01:40:02Z")
**lissener** has it right: Neil Young can definitely carry a tune, stay in key, hit the right notes; I too lack the musical vocabulary to say exactly what’s different and unfinished about Neil’s voice, but it ain’t that. Listen to “Don’t Let It Bring You Down” (if Ray Bradbury had been a singer-songwriter, he might’ve written something like that) or “Cowgirl in the Sand”, both off of _Four-Way Street_, and you’ll see what I mean. Damn, I love his stuff from the '60s and '70s, from “Mr. Soul” on up to “Powderfinger”. After that, he gets a bit more sporadic, but he’s still worth listening to. ---
**Author:** ![Flamsterette\_X](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/41988e/32.png) [@Flamsterette\_X](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flamsterette_X)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2003, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/31 "2003-04-30T02:20:30Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Skerri_ > \*\*[looks at FranticMad] > > Is that the dude from The Verve? \*\* No, that’s **Richard** Ashcroft. Since I know nothing about John Ashcroft, I’ll stay out of that side discussion. But as for Neil Young, I agree that he is a true living legend, and furthermore that his voice is very good and unique. So I respectfully disagree with **bernse** as well. F\_X ---
**Author:** ![bernse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a9a28c/32.png) [@bernse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bernse)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2003, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/32 "2003-04-30T02:28:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by lissener \* > \*\*Let’t get one thing straight here at least. While I agree with some above that Neil Young’s voice is an acquired taste, and I agree with others who have tremendous respect for his writing, he does NOT, **bernse** sing out of tune. His pitch is nearly perfect–just listen to the sharp harmonies of Crosby Stills Nash and Young if you doubt it. What you object to is not his pitch, but the quality, the texture, the tone, the timbre, whatever, of his voice. \*\* Of course, you realize that you are going to force me to really listen to his music next time I hear it on the radio. Alas, it is a sacrifice I am willing to take (barely) for fighting ignorance, to see if I am the one spreading it and if he is, indeed, **in key**. ---
**Author:** ![FranticMad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c68b51/32.png) [@FranticMad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FranticMad)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2003, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/33 "2003-04-30T02:49:10Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Flamsterette\_X \* > **No, that’s Richard Ashcroft. Since I know nothing about John Ashcroft…** John Ashcroft is our Attorney General. I apologize to every eardrum that hears this (you must be able to run activex controls for this site) oh my god sorry to all listen [to this](http://www.symbolman.com/corpabuse.html) if you dare (I cannot be held responsible for medical bills or psychotherapy required as a result of listening to it) ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2003, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/34 "2003-04-30T02:55:20Z")
Bernse, Neil Young’s Harvest Moon is a wonderful song. While you can fault Neil Young’s ability to run the do-re-mi scales the song stands alone as a beautiful and evocative song. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2003, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/35 "2003-04-30T03:35:09Z")
There are two kinds of singers in this world. The first kind is technically proficient. Perhaps even to a virtuouso level. They can hit the high, high notes. They have perfect pitch and breath control. They’ve got _chops_. Fitting into this category would be a lot of female warblers like Celine Dion, Mariah Carey, Linda Ronstadt, and whoever happens to be winning on _American Idol_ this week. Then there are those singers who have voices that can tear your heart out. They just drip emotion. They don’t have to be particularly good at hitting notes, and they don’t have to have range. What they have to have is a voice that fits the emotional content of the song they are singing. This category would include Neil Young, Bob Dylan, Janice Joplin, Eric Clapton, John Prine, Warren Zevon, Tom Waits, Robert Johnson, etc. I know which group I’d rather listen to. Then there are a handful of truly gifted singers who have both the technical ability and the ability to emote with their voices. Ella Fitzgerald. Billie Holliday. Pavarotti. Sometimes, Burton Cummings (although he uses his voice to highlight many crappy songs). Michael Bolton (ditto, in spades). Hitting notes accurately is just one aspect of vocal craft. Then, there are the singers that are just godawful and should be beaten to death with the next microphone they go near. I’m looking at you, Kris Kristofferson. You write great songs - shut up and let someone else sing them. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2003, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/36 "2003-04-30T03:48:39Z")
While trying to keep my temper under control, all I can add right now is that **lissener** is aptly named. Now, everyone go out and get a copy of “Ragged Glory” and play it louder than anything you have ever played before and some things become clear… * * * Never kiss an animal who can lick it’s own ass. ---
**Author:** ![fizgig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/f04885/32.png) [@fizgig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fizgig)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2003, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/37 "2003-04-30T03:58:36Z")
I like NY’s voice. However his wife can’t sing for shit. I wish she wouldn’t insist on singing backup at his concerts. I like the fragile, off-key quality of the vocals on songs like “Needle and the Damage Done.” It works better than if it was some smooth, perfect voice. ---
**Author:** ![LordVor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/90ced4/32.png) [@LordVor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LordVor)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2003, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/38 "2003-04-30T04:20:32Z")
IMHO, **Sam** ’s got it right. Far too much pop and “adult contemporary” music, and a depressingly increasing amount of country, shows absolutely no emotional range. It’s happy little triumphant ditties and power ballads. Technically, it’s pitch-perfect, but it’s just missing something. Neil Young’s voice fits his songs perfectly. He often sounds like he’s being painfully hit with something large, but it’s on songs that are supposed to show pain, show hurt…he’s got such a range on the dark emotions. His sad resignation in “Needle”, his mournful loneliness in “Man needs a Maid”, his uncontrolled fury in “Rockin’ in the Free World”. His voice matches his songs, at least the very best ones. I will admit that every song is not a perfect match, but some of his songs are just perfect. Another example that hasn’t been mentioned yet in the realm of doing the most with your vocal talents is Johnny Cash. The man can’t hit more than 5 notes, but when his 80 year-old ass covered “Hurt” last year he made Trent Reznor sound like a poser. -lv ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2003, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/39 "2003-04-30T06:13:29Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Payton’s Servant \* > \*\*Actually, he’s a really primative player, better at making _noise_ then _music_ with the guitar, but it works fairly well for him. \*\* even you are being generous at this point. he is a spectacularly _bad_ guitarist as well as a bad singer. Still, I have enjoyed some of his stuff. A tribute, I suppose, to his songwriting. ---
**Author:** ![buttonjockey308](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bcef8e/32.png) [@buttonjockey308](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buttonjockey308)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2003, 8:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000/40 "2003-04-30T08:01:14Z")
All of these people, Young, Dylan, Hendrix, were all young idealistic schmucks at one point in their lives, and they managed, through all the dung tossed at them by the industry, to escape on the other side to become legends. Neil Young SOUNDS like a bag of cats in a clothes dryer, but his writing and his message is out-bloody-standing. Same deal with Dylan, he’s been taking the same shit for 35 years, but you’ll hardly find a song with more socio-political punch than Subterranian Homesick Blues, or even Blowin’ in the Wind for that matter. End result is, Young made it because he sold records. A-Ha didn’t. You do the math. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-in-the-blue-fuck-has-neil-young-gotten-as-far-as-he-has/172000.md?page=3)