# How is Black-ish faring with black folks? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [November 3, 2014, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493 "2014-11-03T12:02:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/41 "2014-11-04T18:39:25Z")
I thought she was a surgeon too but Wikipedia says anesthesiologist, with a cite to an episode. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/42 "2014-11-04T18:44:02Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > I wouldn’t, and neither would the characters. They work for their money; their money doesn’t work for them. So? You can still work for your money and be “rich.” The step beyond that is “wealthy,” which I would agree they are not. It’s like with Modern Family… Mitch and Cam: Middle Class Phil and Claire: Rich Jay and Gloria: Wealthy ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/43 "2014-11-04T18:47:33Z")
Phil and Claire? No way they’re rich. Solid middle class. He’s a realtor. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/44 "2014-11-04T18:50:49Z")
Weeell, maybe in the earlier seasons. If the closet company made Jay wealthy and with Claire planning to run it when he’s done plus all the sales she seems to be doing, they’re probably sitting pretty, uh, pretty. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/45 "2014-11-04T18:53:09Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > So? You can still work for your money and be “rich.” The step beyond that is “wealthy,” which I would agree they are not. It’s like with Modern Family… > > Mitch and Cam: Middle Class > Phil and Claire: Rich > Jay and Gloria: Wealthy Phil & Claire can’t afford a third car. They didn’t fly first class on the trip home from Australia. Claire gives Lily hand-me-downs from Alex, with the clear implication that some of those were hand-me-downs from what’s-her-name, the non-pretty daughter. Phil worries about money when he’s gone a month without selling a house. He feels it necessary to hide a thousand dollars cash in the house in case of an emergency. The Dunphys are not rich; they’re middle-class. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/46 "2014-11-04T18:55:54Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > I wouldn’t, and neither would the characters. They work for their money; their money doesn’t work for them. And in the execreble the Tracee Ellis Ross character – Bo? – worries about the hit to their income and lifestyle if the Anthony Anderson character loses his job. They are likely the Top 5% of income earners in the US. That’s rich, not middle class. Otherwise, the middle class ain’t so middle. ---
**Author:** ![Dorjan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dorjan/32/12440_2.png) [@Dorjan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dorjan)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/47 "2014-11-04T18:56:46Z")
> [@Onomatopoeia](#): > > I initially thought anesthesiologist as well, but didn’t the wife have blood on her hands (surgical gloves) when her daughter walked in during one scene, or am I misremembering? She’s an ER surgeon, but there is a scene where she explains what she does to her daughter in the OR, and it’s the role of anesthesiologist. I chalked it up to a mix-up or ignorance on the writer’s part. ---
**Author:** ![Dorjan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dorjan/32/12440_2.png) [@Dorjan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dorjan)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/48 "2014-11-04T19:01:27Z")
> [@Onomatopoeia](#): > > I realize that this is not at all the point of this thread, and not to be a dick, but are you sure you know what you’re talking about in this regard? My wife and I are both medical professionals and I am a partner in my business and, based on gross income alone, I consider us (possibly) upper-middle class, but at the least definitely solidly middle class. > > There have been a number of threads in the past on what constitutes middle class, upper middle class, etc… that we probably should not rehash here, but we can certainly begin a new thread to discuss it further, if you want. You are medical professionals, but are you surgeons? And the business that you are a partner in, is it a multi-million dollar advertising firm? No disrespect, but there’s levels to this. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/49 "2014-11-04T19:09:35Z")
I had almost forgotten, but didn’t the main character’s advertising firm win the contract for the City of Los Angeles ad campaign? That’s kind of a major thing. He’s more Don Draper than middle management. ---
**Author:** ![Dorjan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dorjan/32/12440_2.png) [@Dorjan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dorjan)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/50 "2014-11-04T19:11:43Z")
He’s a partner, his name is on the wall. He IS a Don Draper. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/51 "2014-11-04T19:20:00Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > They are likely the Top 5% of income earners in the US. Where are you getting that, given that there are multiple on-screen indications of their limited funds? ---
**Author:** ![Misnomer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/misnomer/32/14897_2.png) [@Misnomer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Misnomer)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/52 "2014-11-04T19:22:17Z")
> [@Onomatopoeia](#): > > I initially thought anesthesiologist as well, but didn’t the wife have blood on her hands (surgical gloves) when her daughter walked in during one scene, or am I misremembering? > [@Asimovian](#): > > You aren’t misremembering. I remember that scene, but I think I chalked the blood up to her helping out during an emergency (and I wouldn’t be able to distinguish surgical gloves from generic hospital gloves: I’ve seen/worn the latter many times, but never the former). I figured it was an “all hands on deck” thing. Apparently, though… > [@Dorjan](#): > > She’s an ER surgeon, but there is a scene where she explains what she does to her daughter in the OR, and it’s the role of anesthesiologist. I chalked it up to a mix-up or ignorance on the writer’s part. Most likely. Maybe the character started out as an anesthesiologist and then the writers decided/realized that wasn’t sexy enough, or something. ---
**Author:** ![Onomatopoeia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/onomatopoeia/32/4145_2.png) [@Onomatopoeia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Onomatopoeia)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/53 "2014-11-04T19:24:52Z")
> [@Dorjan](#): > > You are medical professionals, but are you surgeons? And the business that you are a partner in, is it a multi-million dollar advertising firm? No disrespect, but there’s levels to this. We are not surgeons, so you have me there, and although my company provides services to the medical field and is not an advertising firm it is a multi-million dollar business. Don’t get me wrong, I do pretty well financially. I have absolutely nothing to complain about (although I still do), but I am not so well-off that I would consider myself much more than solidly middle class or, as I said earlier, perhaps upper-middle. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/54 "2014-11-04T19:29:59Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Phil & Claire can’t afford a third car. They didn’t fly first class on the trip home from Australia. Claire gives Lily hand-me-downs from Alex, with the clear implication that some of those were hand-me-downs from what’s-her-name, the non-pretty daughter. Phil worries about money when he’s gone a month without selling a house. He feels it necessary to hide a thousand dollars cash in the house in case of an emergency. Phil and Claire have more toys than an FAO Schwartz. They’re frugal in some areas, but in others they absolutely flaunt their wealth. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/55 "2014-11-04T19:32:27Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Where are you getting that, given that there are multiple on-screen indications of their limited funds? Top 5% income starts at $168,000. A doctor easily makes that. An executive VP easily makes that. How are they not? Look at their house! Look at the cars they drive. It looks like they live in an affluent area - look at the high school Junior goes to. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/56 "2014-11-04T20:33:48Z")
Sorry, but $168k in LA doesn’t even sniff “rich”. Their house isn’t huge (though it is pretty), and Claire drives a Toyota minivan. They scream middle class. ---
**Author:** ![Onomatopoeia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/onomatopoeia/32/4145_2.png) [@Onomatopoeia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Onomatopoeia)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/57 "2014-11-04T20:36:29Z")
> [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > Sorry, but $168k in LA doesn’t even sniff “rich”. Their house isn’t huge (though it is pretty), and Claire drives a Toyota minivan. They scream middle class. Yep, I was going to say this. My wife and I make well over $168K and, trust me, we are no where near rich. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/58 "2014-11-04T20:40:11Z")
Do each of you make over $168k? And as said, if middle class covers people who make more than 5% of annual income and over 5 times the medium income in this country, then the term is entirely meaningless. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/59 "2014-11-04T20:45:53Z")
Here’s wiki on “Upper Middle Class” > **[Upper middle class](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Upper_middle_class)** > > In sociology, the upper middle class is the social group constituted by higher status members of the middle class. This is in contrast to the term lower middle class, which is used for the group at the opposite end of the middle-class stratum, and to the broader term middle class. There is considerable debate as to how the upper middle class might be defined. According to sociologist Max Weber, the upper middle class consists of well-educated professionals with postgraduate degrees and comfortabl... > [@](#): > > Sociologists Dennis Gilbert, Willam Thompson and Joseph Hickey estimate the upper middle class to constitute roughly 15% of the population. Using the 15% figure one may conclude that the **American upper middle class consists, strictly in an income sense, of professionals with personal incomes in excess of $62,500, who commonly reside in households with six figure incomes.[1][5][8][11] The difference between personal and household income can be explained by considering that 76% of households with incomes exceeding $90,000 (the top 20%) had two or more income earners.**[8] > > Note that the above income thresholds may vary greatly based on region due to significant differences in average income based on region and urban, suburban, or rural development. In more expensive suburbs, the threshold for the top 15% of income earners may be much higher. For example, in 2006 the ten highest income counties had median household incomes of $85,000 compared to a national average of about $50,000. Note, the ten highest income counties had medium household incomes of $85,000. I’m betting the household income of the family in Black-ish is definitely over $300,000 and probably closer to $400,000. ---
**Author:** ![Onomatopoeia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/onomatopoeia/32/4145_2.png) [@Onomatopoeia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Onomatopoeia)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493/60 "2014-11-04T20:55:57Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > Do each of you make over $168k? I do. My wife makes somewhat, but not much, less than that. > [@ISiddiqui](#): > > And as said, if middle class covers people who make more than 5% of annual income and over 5 times the \*\*medium \*\*income in this country, then the term is entirely meaningless. I believe you meant ‘median’. Bolding mine. Anyway, middle class covers a pretty wide swath of an income range, with subclasses within it, eg, lower-middle, middle, upper-middle, etc… Also, I think the class one find oneself in is determined by more factors than solely by income. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-black-ish-faring-with-black-folks/703493.md?page=4)