# How is genocide defined, with an emphasis on cultural genocide? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 13, 2021, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198 "2021-06-13T23:23:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/181 "2021-06-18T13:28:37Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > Right, and nothing I said that you quoted, remotely suggested I had any issue with raising awareness of genocide. You _read that into it_ , you are so many layers deep into toxic, deliberate misreading of anyone who doesn’t circle jerk with you and say the exact same, slack jawed zero thought bullshit you say, that you literally don’t ever realize that you’re just adding words into discussions that have never been spoken, and making assumptions about things unsaid. You are a piece of trash dishonest debater. You’re not debating at all. You’ve got no response to issues that I and others have raised; all you want to do here is to call people names, and you can’t even be creative about that. For you to claim that it’s others who are being dishonest debaters is laughable. I’m glad to see that there are other voices in this thread who are trying to teach and/or to learn. > [@mistymage](#): > > My Band has a Treaty from 1837. Thanks very much for bringing info to the thread, @mistymage. I’m living on [Canandaigua Treaty](https://ganondagan.org/Learning/Canandaigua-Treaty) land. And the Haudenosaunee are very much not gone from here; as very many others are not gone from ancestral lands. To suggest that the solution to problems on the reservations is to disperse their residents around the country is to suggest trying to finish the evil work of cultural genocide. @Martin_Hyde, no wonder you keep making excuses for the perpetrators; you agree with them. Either that, or you’re so ignorant of the relation between place and culture and the function of communities in culture that you’re incapable of understanding what you’re recommending: but by this point, that has to be willful ignorance, not naivety. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/182 "2021-06-18T14:01:00Z")
My, my, you _do_ seem particularly invested in issues of intelligence, mine and your own. Yet still remain too dumb to understand what the quotation marks around “think” meant. What _is_ it with you racists and your fetish for asserting your supposed intellectual superiority and then tripping all over your own feet in the execution? ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/183 "2021-06-18T14:03:31Z")
🤣 good comedy. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/184 "2021-06-18T14:33:10Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > I don’t disagree with that, but I also think the existing native Americans might care more about actually seeing quality of life improvements. Those objectives aren’t mutually exclusive. Native Americans, or any other oppressed people, can simultaneously seek recognition of their past wrongs and remediation of their present wrongs. > [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > One thing I find fairly shitty about the left in general is it spends way more effort on these wonky intellectual college educated discussion about history, pushing for greater recognition in academia etc for past bad things but seems to drum up way less energy into actually dealing with present day issues relating to these people Huh? It’s pretty much only “the left” that is putting energy into “actually dealing with present day issues relating to these people”. Standing with Native Americans for environmental protection of their lands? The left. Working to increase representation of Native Americans in all spheres from politics and academia to STEM professions, etc.? The left. Supporting better healthcare and mental health care for Native communities? The left. And so on and so on. It’s kind of hilarious how right-wingers complain about “the left” being such “bleeding-heart” “nanny-staters” who spend too much of “other people’s tax money” “coddling” the disadvantaged, and then turn right around and complain about “the left” not coddling the disadvantaged enough. ---
**Author:** ![mistymage](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mistymage/32/459_2.png) [@mistymage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mistymage)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/185 "2021-06-18T15:10:16Z")
I usually just giggle and scroll on by grammar errors but FFS! It’s Native Americans. My father, who was born in the USA and was fully German American, was a native American. My mother, who was born in the USA and was almost fully Ojibwe, was a Native American. That one letter capitalized means quite a bit. Not capitalizing the “N” means quite a bit, as well. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/186 "2021-06-18T15:11:29Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > 🤣 good comedy. TL:D - - oh, waitaminute, that one’s okay. Most of the rest of your stuff, though…WHOOF! ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/187 "2021-06-18T15:13:51Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Those objectives aren’t mutually exclusive. Native Americans, or any other oppressed people, can simultaneously seek recognition of their past wrongs and remediation of their present wrongs. Why would you think they are mutually exclusive? ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/188 "2021-06-18T15:16:11Z")
I don’t. Which I thought was made adequately clear by my saying, in one of the sentences that you quoted, “Those objectives aren’t mutually exclusive”. Well! Glad we got that cleared up. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/189 "2021-06-18T15:22:35Z")
Oh I guess I was confused. You were the only one who even brought up that they might be mutually exclusive, so I was unsure why you would have done that when no one else had. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/190 "2021-06-18T15:24:35Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > Oh I guess I was confused. Looks that way. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/191 "2021-06-18T15:25:23Z")
Yea, you’re the only one that is confused here. The rest of us can clearly see the bullshit you’re spewing. I loved the bit about “encouraging” folks to leave the Rez, and then saying the treaty gives too much land because the number of people on the Rez is so small, so let’s ignore the treaty and take it back. Classic. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/192 "2021-06-18T15:29:20Z")
I did not say the “treaty” (actually hundreds of treaties, but your base stupidity probably obscured that fact in your mind) “gives too much land because the number of people on the Rez is so small.” What I said is that obviously full adherence to every treaty we ever signed with any Native tribe would cede over much of the land of the United States to the ~2m or so living Native Americans, which isn’t a realistic proposition. Plus, they have no right to most of the land, it was taken from them by force and they were unable to stop it. Ergo my comment on right of conquest–that is how most countries were built. @Euphonious_Polemic only purpose on these boards is to lie about what other people say because he is too stupid to actually have thoughts of his own on any topic. Remember when directly confronted with previous lies and said to provide proof to support them, he never provided any. This person is a self-admitted liar. ---
**Author:** ![mistymage](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mistymage/32/459_2.png) [@mistymage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mistymage)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/193 "2021-06-18T15:33:46Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > it was taken from them by force and they were unable to stop it That’s not what the Treaties were about in many cases. [http://treatiesmatter.org/exhibit/welcome](http://treatiesmatter.org/exhibit/welcome) ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/194 "2021-06-18T15:35:31Z")
It would be impossible to generalize about every treaty ever signed with the various tribes. Many of them did deal with land rights. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/195 "2021-06-18T16:36:06Z")
Keep telling us about your storied career changing the urinal soaps in government building skippy. Not only do you excuse past cultural genocide; You have some excellent plans to do some more of it in the future. You just keep doing you. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/196 "2021-06-18T17:01:09Z")
I like the silly ad hominem about my previous career (of which all I noted is in a single post, that I have a lot of experience following rules.) The career I mentioned and have mentioned elsewhere in the past is having been a logistics officer in the U.S. Army, which many of my jobs involved needing to adhere closely to a complex set of rules and work with contracts etc. I didn’t change out urinal soaps, but nor would I be ashamed if I had. What a silly line of attack. Just further piling on evidence of how intrinsically worthless you are. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/197 "2021-06-18T17:30:43Z")
- Their culture does not fit with modern (your) sensibilities. - Therefore, encourage them to leave it. Assimilate them into your (better) culture - When there are fewer of them on the land; - Take the land back (the little that still remains to them) - Profit! Just own your position, and stop being such a little pissant about it. Nobody gives a shit about your “career” such as it is. I’m sure you love your complex rules, and expect everyone else to follow what you say. Tough shit. Welcome to the real world sweetheart. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/198 "2021-06-18T17:39:15Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > The career I mentioned and have mentioned elsewhere in the past is having been a logistics officer in the U.S. Army That’s not “a career in government”, liar. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/199 "2021-06-18T17:48:35Z")
It’s by definition that very thing. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2021, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198/200 "2021-06-18T17:49:15Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > - Their culture does not fit with modern (your) sensibilities. > - Therefore, encourage them to leave it. Assimilate them into your (better) culture > - When there are fewer of them on the land; > - Take the land back (the little that still remains to them) > - Profit! > > Just own your position, and stop being such a little pissant about it. Nobody gives a shit about your “career” such as it is. I’m sure you love your complex rules, and expect everyone else to follow what you say. Tough shit. Welcome to the real world sweetheart. “Just your own position” right after posting a bullet list of things I haven’t said. More lies and lies by a known liar, who appears to have one purpose on this forum: lying. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-genocide-defined-with-an-emphasis-on-cultural-genocide/944198.md?page=11)