Full stop here, indeed you are not the OP. I was dealing with the definition later, I looked second at the attempt at identifying genocide. Regardless if you responded in a stupid way to a native American by minimizing why they were targets of forced sterilizations or about failing to take forced sterilizations as part of what genocide can be, you do respond with lots of ignorance.
Just saying.
[Moderating]
Here’s a helpful hint. The more time you spend trying to find the line, the more the line moves in your direction. Dial it way the fuck back.
No warning issued. Yet.
[/Moderating]
Its amusing and horrifying at the same time that board members flagellate themselves about so-called cultural genocide that happened decades ago when they happily turn a blind eye to cultural genocide that is happening at this moment. The government of China is trying to destroy the culture and religion of the Uyghur people in the far western province of Xinyiang.
Are we organizing boycotts of Chinese products and demanding disinvestment? Are we demanding that our governments isolate the PRC the same way that we isolated South Africa?
Well, no. That would require actual effort and it could result in risk. We tolerate (rightly so) a poster here who spouts the PRC party line while masking themself as a normal poster. It also strokes our egos for thinking that we are right thinking and progressive but it does nothing to fight the evils that are occurring right now under our noses.
If the actions of the Canadian government were an actual genocide then the current actions of the Chinese government are a superduper genocide.
More amusing is that you missed that on the Critical Race Theory treads I pointed at CRT scholars also looking at that and condemning China’s authorities behavior towards the Uighurs.
More amusement: the right-winger governors in some states just ignored what Critical Race Theory is doing regarding the abuses in China when they decided to ban CRT and similar teaching in high schools and universities. Meaning that also the teaching of what you complain here is banned too in several red states.
Aah, another denialist.
And I wonder if there’s even the slightest distinction in your mind between a genocide your own society commits versus one another society does?
Well, yes, actually. There are many active movements to hold the PRC accountable.
You are such an obvious troll.
Words have specific meaning. A genocide is a state sponsored action to murder every single individual of a specific group. While the actions of the Canadian government and the Catholic Church were an attempt to forcibly assimilate Native children there was no attempt to intentionally murder them or their parents. Your attempts to link this to actual genocide is wrongheaded and intellectually lazy.
I disagree, but let’s pretend you’re right…
That’s not the meaning of genocide. It’s not the meaning the inventor of the word intended, it’s not how the international community defines it, it’s not how the victims understand it, it’s not the definition most historians and sociologists use.
It’s a definition that only serves denialists of particular genocides. It has a meaning, that it conveys very clearly : “I am desperately flailing for any excuse not to own up to what was done here”
So you continue to show you are a denialist.
You make many claims yet present no supporting evidence. Your a good troll but not yet a great one. Keep practicing the dark art.
So, are you saying that Hitler just chose the wrong way to solve the ‘’‘Jewish Problem’‘’?
We can all read the Wiki on genocide, which has already been linked in this thread.
Not that I think you’ve actually read this thread. You just smelled that a racist chum was shitting himself in public, and decided you wanted some of that action for yourself.
That’s bait.
And that’s hardly subtle, when coming from an obvious racist.
And you keep spreading the news Mr Troll. You could up your game by injecting a bit of humor from time to time.
I’ve had two overt “that made me laugh” comments in the last couple days. I’m doing just fine on the humour front, thanks.
Don’t need advice from a clown on how to be funny. Because everyone know clowns aren’t funny, just pathetic.
As I pointed out, your trolling is very amusing. It demonstrates that you are not only an ignorant in the subject, but also an ignorant of what other posters like me said about the Uyghurs before.
It’s not even very good baiting.
This one is a special brand of sad little fucking idiot.
Ya know what? If someone was simply arguing that the word “cultural” was extraneous, I could understand. As in someone saying, “Folks, you don’t need the word “cultural” because the UN’s legal definition of genocide is forcibly transferring children from one group to another group. That’s genocide, period.”
That’s not what I saw happening in that thread. The only reason I can see is that the argument was used to minimize the suffering of indigenous people. Then you have to wonder what is the purpose. Love of the historical Canadian government? Love of the Catholic Church? Racism? I like to troll what I’m going to define as the toxic libs of this board? All or some of the above?
I hope I’m not hijacking the thread, but I think this is where Critical Race Theory comes in (I’m still learning). When powerful elements play the “troll the libs” card, they easily get lib-haters on board. The lib-haters may not be personally racist. However, their hate for libs makes them support media or politicians who are playing into this. The end result is that there is political pushback in finding justice for these poor kids and their families/descendants and makes it more likely for this to happen in the future. It also helps people ignore the causes of indigenous people’s current struggles, so they continue to struggle.
This seems like an excellent example of systematic racism works. Critical Race Theory is simply a method for keeping an eye out for these types of examples that are all over the place.
While I’m willing to entertain this notion, it’s an unnecessary out. The Venn diagram shows an overwhelming overlap here.
Note this isn’t about conservatives per se but the subset who aren’t merely conservative but actively anti-[progressive/minority/LBTGQ/etc]. The “pwn the libtards” crowd are defined by what they hate, not what they support.
I know the conversation has moved past this (at least in this thread) for the most part. However, even if we accept the strict definition here that these actions taken are not genocide, I think they can be argued as worse than simply departing the children.
Getting to go back home isn’t necessary the reward it may seem at first. You go spend hours of your day being indoctrinated and taught about the “right” way to live, about the “right” history and facts, that the way your family and tribe/band/etc live is wrong, troublesome, the reason why things are bad. That you just need to become a good little white for the government (or church or whomever). And then you get sent back to your home. I think that’s pretty messed up. And it’s not as if their parents and family are going to have as much time and resources to counteract what the government schools are doing.
Or your forced to go to a boarding school, except for the holidays. What a power move by the government. Because whose holidays are these? Are they holy days of the Native people? December 25th or whatever October/November day Thanksgiving falls on, Halloween, the 1st or4th of July. What group celebrated those originally? Which Native people started those? And again you’re spending all your time in an environment meant to remove the native-ness from these children and then send them off for a day or week or whatever to what? Enjoy these people you hardly know any more and infrequently see, a culture and place that may be more foreign to you than the white one. Being taunted with what could have beens and if onlys?
I’m not convinced that just because they don’t fall under the strict definition of genocide Martin Hyde gives that these day schools and holiday visits are any better.
I’m sure a great many would rather live on better land, especially reservation lands that are sometimes table scraps. Iirc some groups had to move several times before white settlers and the US government found some land they really didn’t want this time (we swear). But there are going to be other interests and priorities for people too. Like how important their history and culture and way of life are to them, and to keep alive as best they can. Something like a small, fragile culture that many groups have can depend on keeping a community together. Even if they’re no longer being forced to not speak their tribal/indigenous language language, many languages of Native American people are nearly extinct, if they’re not already. (And that’s just one thing that I believe matters to the world. The knowledge of these unique languages is good for linguistics as a whole, not just the speakers of it, imo)
How much harder would it be to maintain a culture when it’s members are scattered around the world? So much is fading in the world and has been. Regional accents are generally being lost because of the reach of radio and TV already.
You make mention of being on land for 5 generations, why can’t Native people also have an investment in their land, even if it’s far from their historical lands. It’s theirs.
You bring up very good points, and I’d like to get back to those points, if possible.
I was thinking along the same lines. If, instead of learning traditional ways, how to hunt or to work the lands, they are being educated in the white man’s ways, what good do they do going back to their land and community? Rather than spending that time working in their community, improving it and learning it, they were off being at best “educated” and in many cases abused or worse.
The thing is the original context of this discussion no one said that placing the children in the schools was not bad, or that it was good. Instead there was a group of people who were basically “challenging each other” to see who could get as far from history and fact as possible in bashing whitey, and when given a very mild corrective in the form of contextual information being supplied, those people got angry and created fields of strawmen and lies to talk about.
You are 100% correct that sending the kids to these schools was bad behavior.
Would you like to cite this claim, or admit that you are a liar?
Why do you misrepresent other posters in this way?
Here is @omenran, trying to have a productive discussion, and you are just here to whine and whinge about how everyone didn’t fall down and agree with everything that you said, proclaim you to be the best, and worship the ground beneath your feet.
Everyone knows what you are, and what you are really here for. Please keep posting.