# How is this animal cruelty? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 9, 2004, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778 "2004-09-09T13:12:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Cubsfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Cubsfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cubsfan)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/1 "2004-09-09T13:12:45Z")
[http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/09/09/shooting.dog.ap/index.html](http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/09/09/shooting.dog.ap/index.html) Sure, funny story. Puppy shoots guy who trys to shoot puppy. ha ha. Anyway, In the story they say that the guy was charged with felony animal cruelty for putting down a bunch of puppies that he couldn’t find a home for and probably didn’t want. Since when is this animal cruelty? How is this different then when the pound puts them down? I think it’s a kneejerk reaction to a fairly typical operation in rural areas. What do you think? ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/2 "2004-09-09T13:56:03Z")
Here’s a synopsis of the [Felony Animal Cruelty Law](http://www.petroglyphsnm.org/ac_regs/fac.html). [quote] Exemptions to the law that remain in effect include hunting, fishing, trapping, falconry, **veterinary medicine,** rodent or pest control, the treatment of farm animals (when in accordance with accepted animal husbandry practices), rodeo practices, intermediate handlers, carriers and exhibitors, and related activities. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/3 "2004-09-09T13:58:54Z")
It does seem like a pretty arbitrary law. I’m not a fan of putting down animals by shooting, but against the law? I don’t think it should be. ---
**Author:** ![Stonebow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed8c4c/32.png) [@Stonebow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stonebow)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/4 "2004-09-09T14:42:07Z")
Thing is, while it might have been justified, and even humane, under these circumstances, as a rule, we just don’t want people shooting animals in their back yards. Heck, aside from the fact that we can’t be sure of how humanely they are killed, there are all sorts of issues with disposing of the body as a public health issue. So this guy pays the price. So long as there was a free, convenient method available to him for disposing of the dogs, I don’t feel too bad about it. Likely he’ll just get a slap on the wrist for it (and that’s as it should be, i think). ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/5 "2004-09-09T15:52:44Z")
> [@Stinkpalm](#): > > Sure, funny story. Puppy shoots guy who trys to shoot puppy. ha ha. […] What do you think? I think this is why we need to let the assault weapons ban expire. 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![MysteryFellow63427](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e4f/32.png) [@MysteryFellow63427](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MysteryFellow63427)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/6 "2004-09-09T15:57:02Z")
**Stonebow** , do you think he should be charged with a felony rather than a misdemeanor? I agree with much of what you said, but a felony charge seems excessive if the dogs were not made to suffer. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/7 "2004-09-09T16:03:36Z")
> [@the story](#): > > Deputies found three of the puppies in a shallow grave outside Bradford’s home, said sheriff’s Sgt. Ted Roy. > > The other four appeared to be in good health and were taken by Escambia County Animal Control, which planned to make them available for adoption. Rather than shooting them, why didn’t he turn the puppies over to Animal Control or a local shelter in the first place? At least then they’d have a chance at adoption. ---
**Author:** ![Rufus\_Xavier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/eada6e/32.png) [@Rufus\_Xavier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rufus_Xavier)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/8 "2004-09-09T16:27:41Z")
> [@Stonebow](#): > > Likely he’ll just get a slap on the wrist for it (and that’s as it should be, i think). Talk about cruel and unusual. He already got shot in the wrist, how much suffering can one man endure? 😉 What I want to know is, why isn’t the puppy being charged with assault with a deadly weapon? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![cichlidiot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f9b8f/32.png) [@cichlidiot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cichlidiot)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/9 "2004-09-09T16:34:44Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > Rather than shooting them, why didn’t he turn the puppies over to Animal Control or a local shelter in the first place? At least then they’d have a chance at adoption. I’d guess he didn’t want to pay the fee, by taking them to the shelter or having them picked up. From the Escambia County [shelter](http://www.co.escambia.fl.us/departments/animal_control/AnimalShelterFeesandCharges.php): > [@](#): > > Service Fees: > > Service Call - pickup owner’s animal $25.00 > > Service Charges - > > Live animal brought to shelter for euthanasia $15.00 This was a reason I was given all the time when people wanted to bring in puppies or kittens. Though we didn’t take them, people were constantly dumping them off outside the store. It’s more expensive here to have the shelter take a litter than have a pet spayed or neutered, so I never really understood it. As to the OP, a felony charge does seem overly harsh. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/10 "2004-09-09T16:47:33Z")
> [@Rufus Xavier](#): > > What I want to know is, why isn’t the puppy being charged with assault with a deadly weapon? 😃 Given that this was the second group of puppies, this is obviously self-defense. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/11 "2004-09-09T16:55:22Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#): > > Here’s a synopsis of the [Felony Animal Cruelty Law](http://www.petroglyphsnm.org/ac_regs/fac.html). > > Exemptions to the law that remain in effect include hunting, fishing, trapping, falconry, **veterinary medicine,** rodent or pest control, the treatment of farm animals (when in accordance with accepted animal husbandry practices), rodeo practices, intermediate handlers, carriers and exhibitors, and related activities. Please pardon a correction: That is New Mexico’s animal cruelty law. The incident took place in Florida. Florida’s animal cruelty statutes may be found [here](http://www.flsenate.gov/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=Ch0828/titl0828.htm). ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/12 "2004-09-09T17:06:11Z")
As for the OP, count me among the puzzled. This is pretty much a standard way of putting down animals in rural areas (though it does sound like the guy wasn’t very efficient about it, and I do fault him for that). It’s not a pleasant thing, but if unwanted animals are let loose to go feral and breed, you wind up with a much worse situation. (Ask any cattle owner who’s had his calves run down and killed by feral dog packs.) At worst, the guy should get a misdemeanor charge, IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/13 "2004-09-09T17:12:39Z")
> [@](#): > > do you think he should be charged with a felony rather than a misdemeanor? I agree with much of what you said, but a felony charge seems excessive if the dogs were not made to suffer. Wasn’t there a story recently about a guy trying to kill puppies with a shovel? Would that be felonious animal cruelty? I mean a good whack to the head should kill a puppy pretty easily. Other than lethal injection (and that is only supposition), is there really a humane way to kill animals, or humans for that matter? The guy is a fool of the highest caliber. He could have saved himself loads of shit by getting his dog fixed to start with. Since he didn’t do that, he could have paid $15 per dog to be rid of hs ‘problem’. He didn’t want to do that either - he probably could have found a dog rescue group who would take them with no questions. He did none of these. Instead he holds them in his hand and tries to shoot them :smack: I’m guessing that the idiot wasn’t big on thinking things through to begin with. All I know is that I am putting my foot down and refusing to allow Goliath to get that concealed carry permit. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/14 "2004-09-09T21:09:57Z")
I agree that this is both standard practice in rural area’s and also humane. The irony is that because of all the attention he drew to himself, the puppies will surely get adopted. He probably could have sold them for high dollars if they had managed to shoot him in the ass. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/15 "2004-09-09T21:15:28Z")
> [@spoke-](#): > > Please pardon a correction: That is New Mexico’s animal cruelty law. The incident took place in Florida. Florida’s animal cruelty statutes may be found [here](http://www.flsenate.gov/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=Ch0828/titl0828.htm). Oops. My bad. I thought, since it was a felony, it was a federal law and therefore nationwide. ---
**Author:** ![Bytegeist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9dc877/32.png) [@Bytegeist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bytegeist)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/16 "2004-09-09T22:22:03Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#): > > …I thought, since it was a felony, it was a federal law and therefore nationwide. You do realize that felonies aren’t federal in general, right? ---
**Author:** ![Lissa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85f322/32.png) [@Lissa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lissa)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2004, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/17 "2004-09-10T03:21:19Z")
> [@Adam Yax](#): > > The guy is a fool of the highest caliber. He could have saved himself loads of shit by getting his dog fixed to start with. Since he didn’t do that, he could have paid $15 per dog to be rid of hs ‘problem’. He didn’t want to do that either - he probably could have found a dog rescue group who would take them with no questions. He did none of these. Instead he holds them in his hand and tries to shoot them I’m guessing that the idiot wasn’t big on thinking things through to begin with. I live in a rural area. (The largest nearby city is one of about 20,000.) I’ve seen this happen many times around here. I don’t know if it’s a “country” mindset, but it seems to be relatively common in these parts. It wouldn’t even occur to most folks around here to take unwanted pups to the Pound. They’d see it as a twenty minute drive, plus a dump fee when they can just simply take care of it out back with a shotgun. They see it as better that these things are taken care of at home-- almost a weird sense of family duty or responsibility. Sadly, shooting the dog the one-size-fits-all solution to a lot of pet problems around here. Rather than take an ill or injured dog to the vet, they “put it out of its misery” out back. It’s accepted around here-- sort of a circle of life thing. I personally find it abhorrent, but most people I know wouldn’t. ---
**Author:** ![antechinus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/fbc32d/32.png) [@antechinus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antechinus)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2004, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/18 "2004-09-10T04:17:28Z")
How is shooting a dog any different than shooting 'roos or rabbits (or bears and deer - whatever you shoot in the US)? Did he try to shoot them in town? ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2004, 10:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/19 "2004-09-10T10:00:16Z")
I don’t see this as animal cruelty. Those shot die quickly and painlessly. From what I’ve heard, this isn’t all that uncommon in rural areas. ---
**Author:** ![sugaree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cc9497/32.png) [@sugaree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sugaree)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2004, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778/20 "2004-09-10T11:05:00Z")
Count me as one who doesn’t find shooting animals to be abhorrent. When I was younger, a kitten crawled into the car engine from below, and had his front paws amputated. My stepfather ran inside, loaded a gun, and shot him. It was a quick end. To have him euthenized by a vet would have entailed a car ride to a scary, unfamiliar place with a lobby filled with strange cats and dogs, followed by a wait on a cold metal table, and then some people would have come in and jabbed him with needles. If the accident happened in the evening or on a Sunday, it would take time to even find a vet. How is dragging out the death more humane? > [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > At least then they’d have a chance at adoption. While all signs indicate that this guy is a slack-jawed yokel of Cletesque proportions, maybe he was aware of just how slim a chance the pups had of adoption. I believe that somewhere between half and three quarters of animals at shelters that practice euthanization are killed instead of adopted. Puppies and kittens have a greater chance of being adopted, but often, if a shelter takes in 7 animals, it must put down 7 others in order to make space. > [@adam yax](#): > > he probably could have found a dog rescue group who would take them with no questions. Rescue groups and no-kill shelters have limited resources. Whenever I try to place a stray, I end up calling number after number until and I find a place that has an opening, if I find a place that has an opening. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-is-this-animal-cruelty/263778.md?page=2)