How long to die from puncture?

[KarlGauss]

@Blake

. . . A blow that simply compresses carotid artery or the ventricle, even without causing any blood loss, can case unconsciousness due to blood pressure increases.

I’m gonna quibble with both examples here. If anything, damage to the ventricle (main heart pumping chamber for those who may not know the word) leads to low blood pressure; through one of direct damage to the pump, arrhythmia, or cardiac tamponade. And, in addition to a stroke which would have no large effect on BP, carotid injury would lead to low heart rate or blood loss, both of which would tend to lower BP.

[md2000]

Speaking of Hollywood, I think it was in the original Lonesome Dove series - they had the good guy trapped behind his dead horse. The bad guys are standing just out of range, and see his bullets hit the dust not far in front. One starts dancing and taunting him, so our hero loads up a round, aims up at about a 45 degree angle, and - plop - the taunter ends up with a bullet hole in the belly. Cut to scenes of drunken carousing as the rest of them live it up around the campfire safely out of range, as the stupid target practice guy dies slowly and in agony. For good measure, every so often one of the other guys kicks him to justify their bad guy credentials. By morning, he’s dead.

Also - When JPII was shot in the Vatican square, then rushed him to hospital where a concern was infection from multiple punctures of the intestines.

Lots of people are shot or stabbed and survive. It depends on the promptness of medical attention, luck or skill in the initial wound placement, as mentioned above. Like being hit on the head and going unconscious, it does not work as simple as Hollywood wants us to believe.

[Chessic_Sense]

@Blake

@opmike

In what instance would (has) blood loss lead to unconsciousness in a quarter of a second?

It can happen where the carotid artery or some of the other major arteries are severed. In order to ensure the correct blood flow to the brain, the body has a reflex in place to ensure that measures the blood pressure in the carotid artery. If the pressure drops too low the reflex causes unconsciousness in an attempt to get the brain below the level of the heart and maintain pressure.

If the artery is severed the sudden loss of pressure can trigger the reflex and cause an almost instant loss of consciousness.

I’ve both caused this and been a victim of this. The former happened while practicing the rear naked choke hold in Army basic training. The latter happened when my brother came home from basic training and jokingly demonstrated being “part of the club” by choking me out. I hit the floor in less than a second and didn’t wake up for another…well, I don’t know. I was unconscious. 10 seconds, maybe?

Anyway, the point is Blake’s contention of “almost instant” is quite accurate.

[Folacin]

Thanks to all for the great discussion - particularly drachillix for the real world anecdotes.

And, of course, if people didn’t generally fall over dead immediately, the whole plan would be ruined when the element of surprise is lost.

[MLS]

Try reading about the near-assassination of Ronald Reagan. He very nearly died, but walked into the hospital.

[Hermitian]

@Leo_Bloom

I read an article somewhere that if you simply keep the projectile in the wound the survival rate is significantly increased.

Yea, but its much cooler to rip the arrow out your own chest and stab a couple of orcs to death with it.

[VOW]

Gut shot used to be universally known as fatal. If you didn’t bleed to death from a chest wound, it could heal. But gut shot typically means the intestinal contents contaminate the abdominal cavity, leading to peritonitis, gangrene, and death.

A slow, PAINFUL death. Some gut shot victims were known to take their own lives, to avoid the inevitable.
~VOW

[Lust4Life]

@Blake

It depends entirely on what damage is done. There is no other possible answer.

An abdominal wound that cuts through a kidney can cause unconsciousness within a second, death in less than a minute. A wound that only damages an empty stomach can heal completely with no medical treatment at all. A chest wound that severs one of the major veins supplying the heart is going to be real nasty. A wound that leaves an open channel to the thoracic cavity can cause both lungs to collapse within a minute and death within 5 minutes.

An important point to realise is that “falls over and dies” is not the same as “falls over dead”. Kidney damage, for example, can cause near-instantaneous unconsciousness because its screws up blood pressure control. A blow to the diaphragm can cause a person to drop immediately due to breathing difficulties. It may take an hour to die from such wounds, but the person will fall over immediately and never regain consciousness. From a movie perspective the difference between “falls over dead” and “falls over and dies” is non-existent.

Incapacitated is such a vague term that the second question is almost impossible to answer.If you get stabbed in the abdomen and suffer more than superficial muscle/skin damage you will be almost certainly be doubled over in pain and have difficulty breathing. In that sense you will be incapacitated. Even though fully conscious and able to speak, tend to your own wounds and so forth. You won’t be running around much. If you’ve ever been struck hard enough to have the wind knocked out of you, you know the type of sensation that a stab wound to the stomach is going to cause.

Good post.

[RockTheVote]

@Chessic_Sense

I’ve both caused this and been a victim of this. The former happened while practicing the rear naked choke hold in Army basic training. The latter happened when my brother came home from basic training and jokingly demonstrated being “part of the club” by choking me out. I hit the floor in less than a second and didn’t wake up for another…well, I don’t know. I was unconscious. 10 seconds, maybe?

Anyway, the point is Blake’s contention of “almost instant” is quite accurate.

You didn’t get choked to sleep in one second. 7-9 seconds before unconsciousness sets in due to collapsing the carotid arteries. It’s not instantaneous.

[Toy_varen]

@The_Hamster_King

I’ve heard that taking an arrow in the knee can have some pretty nasty long-term effects.

I saw what you did there.