First off, anyone who thinks “Both sides are equally bad.” is unwilling to actually think about the issue.
The debt ceiling is about money we’ve already allocated, it isn’t about new spending. The way things have worked in congress is the debt ceiling was routinely passed. Some members would vote against it, knowing that there were enough votes for it to pass, to make a political point.
Now, however, the lying scumbags on the right are literally threatening to destroy the US economy if they don’t get some other, unrelated stuff they want.
This isn’t a vote as a political symbol, this is saying, “I will shoot this entire family in the fucking head if we don’t have pizza tonight.” It is an insane, cowardly, ignorant thing to do, and it’s possible because the people on the right elected ignorant, insane cowards in the last election.
**xtisme **asks about concessions the Dems have made. Dems don’t think any spending should be cut in the short term. The very fact that they are entertaining the concept in return for tax increases is a huge concession. But the only adults in this equation are the Dem leadership and Boehner who has the unfortunate job of being a sane person on a boat full of gibbering monkeys.
Yeah, as far as I can tell, the Democrats, despite controlling the White House and Senate, aren’t asking for any concessions as compared to the status quo. They’re negotiating to have to give up as little as possible. Because, as mentioned, this is basically a hostage negotiation. They’re trying to get the ransom as low as possible.
How is it the government’s fault that the private sector isn’t hiring right now? Or are you saying the government should stop spending on itself and start spending on the private sector? Smells like socialism if you ask me. I thought the almighty free market was supposed to self-correct in cases like these- the losers die off and someone else buys up the remains. And government stays far away from the whole process.
Also, the economy is down but OMG the government keeps hiring people! What a horrible thing to do when there are no jobs!
The government is not a household. If government can only spend money when economic times are good, that would be a great incentive for an opposing political party to ensure the economy was always bad, wouldn’t it?
How many thousands of people does this put out of work and onto the streets? Do you really want a few more tens of thousands of unemployed, angry citizens with easy access to guns and literally nothing to lose wandering your neighborhood? Bringing the troops back home brings back several thousand more people (who could really ruin your day if they wanted to) who won’t have jobs waiting for them on US soil. Think about it. What do troops do when there is no war? They sit around polishing their guns waiting for one. And the government (and by extension you through taxes) are paying them to do this. That is, unless you’d care to lay them off…
The Obama administration has made plenty of cuts. You may have heard of certain legislation regarding health care that will save your nation billions upon billions of dollars over the next 10-20 years? Legislation that forces every citizen to buy from the private sector and inject their dollars into the economy?
Did you not see the news articles about how America’s debt rating would go from AAA (best) to D (worst) literally overnight if the debt ceiling isn’t raised? Just like missing a payment on a credit card, the interest rates will go through the roof. It has nothing to do with politics. You say you want the government to save money so why do you want them to default? Paying their debts on time saves money!
You are wrong on that point, a lot of rich people will be CONSIDERABLY less rich if the debt ceiling is not raised. And a lot of people will see their retirement funds go into the tank, as T-bills were once considered a safe investment. Our only hope is that the insanely risk-taking wing of the Republican Party will not be overwhelmed by the insanely stupid wing of the Republican Party when it is time for the inevitable back-down. Or we are ALL sunk. What worries me is that a seemingly intelligent fellow like Xtisme cannot see this for what it is. How many others are there out there like him? God knows there are enough idiots out there who will fall for the Republican line that it was all just politics and the Democrats were as much if not more at fault than they, if they bring the economy down. But if smart guys like Xtisme fall for it, the Repubs just might get away with it … and that may be what they are counting on.
The rich have money in various currencies and homes in other countries. Their investments would eventually pay off and they would be even farther above the rest of the people.
They are saying no. They will not agree to tax raises. Boner is a good employee.
Can someone explain how cutting social security will affect our deficit situation at all? I’m missing the step between cutting benefits and it somehow cutting our budget. I’m willing to be informed.
And how can they justify this? Oh right, political score for the Pubs if the world economy tanks on Obama’s watch. After all the GOP’s top goal isn’t to improve anything or help the economy, but to make Obama a one-termer. And protect the interests of the rich.
This blatant move to protect the rich, in the face of *$4 trillion in cuts *offered by Obama, may actually just backfire on Boehner Co… *If *the Dems have the wherewithal to publicize the living fuck out of this skullduggery. Congressional Republicans don’t give one rat’s hairy ass about helping the middle class or poor or the economy. And this is the proof. They swept into office with the pledge to cut government spending. And now that Obama has moved significantly to the right and offered to cut government spending to the tune of $4 trillion over 10 years, these hypocrites move the goalposts. And threaten to default the US to boot.
ETA: nate, it won’t. This is yet another example of Obama negotiating with terrorists in order to get this passed in order to raise the debt ceiling in order to keep the economy from tanking worldwide.
Legarde the new IMF head has explained the destruction of our economy will ripple across the world. That would indicate that financial pros across the world agree the Repubs are playing with dynamite.
Right! It started with Democrat Woodrow Wilson when the US government turned the control of our monetary system over to a private corporation. The US has been plundered ever since, and now is bankrupt.
Does it make sense to raise the debt ceiling without really drastic cuts in spending? Soon we will be spending more than we take in. Sure, we can print more money since it is the world standard. But what happens when enough foreign countries say they will use some other currency? Then we lose that edge, and everything will increase in price by a very hefty percent.
You don’t mention that the cuts are in the future, but the tax increases are now. It is a tired Democrat trick. When the time comes for the cuts to kick in, you will see smoke and mirrors, accounting tricks to claim the 4 trillion cuts, but you won’t notice any real reduction in government spending.
Anyway, I doubt, unless we get a good handle on spending that our economy will survive 10 more years. If one European country defaults (Greece?), there could easily be a domino effect. I hear Spain, Portugal, and Ireland are pretty vulnerable right now too. And what about Mexico? Doesn’t Mexico owe US $800 billion or more? The government there is shaky because of the drug wars that are morphing into a civil war. Our house of cards is shaking now and it wouldn’t take much to bring it down.
I do hope it doesn’t happen, but it very well could.
Refresh my memory. Isn’t Obama the man who (through Obamacare) plans to take $500 billion away from Medicare? I’m on Medicare and don’t relish the prospect of trying to find a doctor who will work for what Medicare will be willing to pay. In fact, since about 40% of doctors say that when Obamacare is implemented, they will retire or do something else, I may not be able to find a doctor at all. Millions more patients, and fewer doctors. That sounds like a plan!
You can’t balance this on the backs of the rich. There are not enough of them even if you took 100%. I don’t want it balanced on the backs of the middle class or the seniors, so the only acceptable plan is to simply stop spending so much. That is what I have to do when my expenses begin to exceed my inncome.
What do you think? I think there is not a single federal bureaucracy that couldn’t function just as well with 20% fewer employees. Let attrition bring the number of government employees down to that level. It wouldn’t take long.
As to the OP, it appears that the GOP’s version of compromise is to have come to the table at all. So, I think they’re prepared to torch the economy for political gain.
Obamacare reforms and cuts the wildly wasteful Medicare Advantage program and fills the Medicare Part D donut hole, saving money but nevertheless resulting in an net increase in benefits for the average Medicare beneficiary. In all likelihood, Obamacare will save you money.
I assume this was not intended to be a factual statement?
Paragraph one. That is exactly the problem. Govt did not stay out of the process, it bailed out banks, insurance companies, auto manufacturers, etc, and still did not eliminate the two entities that did more to cause the housing bubble than any other, Fanny Mae and Freddy Mac.
Paragraph five. You must be smokin’ somethin’ if you think Obamacare will save money. It just ain’t gonna happen.
Last paragraph. There is enough income to pay the interest on the national debt. Default is a bogey man the Democrats are using to scare everybody. What can be done is to pay the interest and fund those essential functions of government. Let the non-essential things slide for a little bit. It probably wouldn’t last more than a week or so. What is magic about Aug. 2, 2011?
Hey Gonzo! I thought this was supposed to be a civil discussion! Your continual use of the insulting term “tea baggers” to refer to the tea party people is disgusting. If you don’t know what a tea bagger is, ask any queer!:mad:
I know what a Tea Bagger is. But that is what they called themselves. I must assume they are so smart, they could do no wrong. They know how to run the world, I must respect their perfection.
Millions more patients, and fewer doctors. That sounds like a plan!