# How many admirals in the US Navy? How many ships **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 15, 2009, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528 "2009-08-15T16:16:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/21 "2009-08-17T05:09:38Z")
In theory, we should only have one admiral for each capital ship, plus one Fleet Admiral (in wartime) and one Chief of Staff. We have 11 aircraft carriers, 14 SSBNs, and we could generously include the US Navy’s 12 amphibious assault ships, too. If we have all the 216 allowable Admirals currently serving, then we have 177 extras (actually, 178, since we don’t have an Admiral of the Fleet at the moment, and haven’t since Admiral Halsey died). ---
**Author:** ![Notassmartasithought](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c0e974/32.png) [@Notassmartasithought](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Notassmartasithought)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 5:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/22 "2009-08-17T05:51:29Z")
My take is that within the legal restrictions, the Navy will have as many admirals as possible, in order to keep the folks they want who might retire if they didn’t make admiral rank. I think it’s fair to allow the Navy to keep as many as it deems “the best” as possible. I don’t care about the ships/admiral ratio. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/23 "2009-08-17T06:02:16Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > In theory, we should only have one admiral for each capital ship, plus one Fleet Admiral (in wartime) and one Chief of Staff. > > We have 11 aircraft carriers, 14 SSBNs, and we could generously include the US Navy’s 12 amphibious assault ships, too. > > If we have all the 216 allowable Admirals currently serving, then we have 177 extras (actually, 178, since we don’t have an Admiral of the Fleet at the moment, and haven’t since Admiral Halsey died). Do you have a cite for each capital ship having an admiral? I don’t recall ever hearing that one. If there are 11 aircraft carriers (I thought it was more, like 14 or 15), then I would assume there are 11 carrier battle groups, and it would make sense for an admiral to lead a battle group. But there used to be whole fleets of battleships, and before that dreadnaughts, and before that ships of the line… Surely not every one of them needed an admiral. What would be the point of having captains? ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/24 "2009-08-17T12:30:58Z")
Right. **Cap** ital ships get a **Cap** tain (full O6 grade) in command. If said Capital ship is also the\*\* flag\*\*ship (different thing!) of a fleet, squadron, etc, it may then get a Flag Officer (or merely a senior Captain as small-c “commodore” if it’s a small number). As someone mentioned before: Out of 216 allotted billets for Flag Officers (of ALL grades) there are up to 9 for 4-stars, up to (35 - [number of 4-stars]) for 3-stars and some 180 or so for Rear Admirals (one and two). And not all need be filled at all times. You have so many at that level because one and two star grades are where you put all your senior managers, heads of districts, commanders of installations, heads of branches, etc. Same deal with 1- and 2- star generals in the land forces. The 3- and 4- star ranks go with specific posts at the major national and global command levels. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/25 "2009-08-17T13:25:31Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > Do you have a cite for each capital ship having an admiral? I don’t recall ever hearing that one. If there are 11 aircraft carriers (I thought it was more, like 14 or 15), then I would assume there are 11 carrier battle groups, and it would make sense for an admiral to lead a battle group. But there used to be whole fleets of battleships, and before that dreadnaughts, and before that ships of the line… Surely not every one of them needed an admiral. What would be the point of having captains? I can’t find one. I just know that’s how it works in the Royal Navy (or is supposed to - the RN has “admiral inflation” too). I assumed the USN followed the same (theoretical) system. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/26 "2009-08-17T15:00:11Z")
I read a book on the history of the Royal Yacht _Britannia_ recently; the commanding officer was almost always a rear admiral, IIRC, during her service from 1954-1997. **RNATB** , there’s no reason why there could only be two fleet admirals in the U.S. Navy during wartime. During WW2 we had four: Leahy, King, Nimitz and Halsey. There has been none since Nimitz died (Halsey died in 1959; Nimitz seven years later). ---
**Author:** ![MarcusF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/67e7ee/32.png) [@MarcusF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MarcusF)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/27 "2009-08-17T15:23:13Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I can’t find one. I just know that’s how it works in the Royal Navy (or is supposed to - the RN has “admiral inflation” too). I assumed the USN followed the same (theoretical) system. Not sure where you get that from for the Royal Navy. I have not seen any suggestion that there was a one to one link between the number of fleets or flotillas and hence flagships (as \*\*Boyo Jim \*\*points out “capital ships” means the major fighting vessels whether battleships, carriers, or submarines) and the number of serving admirals. There have always been Admirals serving ashore at major bases and in the Admiralty/Ministry of Defense. ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/28 "2009-08-17T15:55:07Z")
> [@IAmNotSpartacus](#): > > Yeah, I was just looking for the Arizona and other sunken ships, didn’t even dawn on me to look for the Constitution, which is a very special and unique ship in itself. Curiously (or not-- this _is_ the Navy we’re talking about) the [USS Intrepid](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Intrepid_(CV-11)) does not appear to be on the list > > From the remarks: > THE SECRETARY OF THE NAVY (J. WILLIAM MIDDENDORF, II) DIRECTED THE RECLASSIFICATION OF USS CONSTITUTION FROM “IX 21” TO “NONE” EFFECTIVE 1 SEPTEMBER 1975. SHE IS LISTED ON THE NAVAL VESSEL REGISTER (NVR) AS A COMMISSIONED SHIP AND BY NAME ONLY. CONSTITUTION IS LISTED ON THE NATIONAL REGISTER OF HISTORIC PLACES, REFER ENCE NO. 66000789 AND DESIGNATED A NATIONAL HISTORIC LANDMARK ON 12/19/1960. Why should the Intrepid still be on the list? It’s been decommissioned, and sold off. It’s a private museum now, not run by the Navy at all. Whereas the Constitution is still run by the Navy - all the people running the tours on it are regular Navy, and it’s got a [Navy commander](http://www.history.navy.mil/ussconstitution/CaptainandCrew.htm) as its skipper and everything. Not to slight the Intrepid at all - I was there back in April and it’s an amazing ship and museum. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/29 "2009-08-17T18:19:30Z")
> [@muldoonthief](#): > > … the Constitution is still run by the Navy - all the people running the tours on it are regular Navy, and it’s got a [Navy commander](http://www.history.navy.mil/ussconstitution/CaptainandCrew.htm) as its skipper and everything… Hey, dig the red waistcoats! Are those the master chiefs? ---
**Author:** ![Sean\_Factotum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/50afbb/32.png) [@Sean\_Factotum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sean_Factotum)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/30 "2009-08-17T20:04:58Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Hey, dig the red waistcoats! Are those the master chiefs? The one guy they show in the red waistcoat on the front page, the Command Senior Chief (job title), is a Senior Chief (rank). Usually the highest ranked enlisted is the Command Master Chief - I wonder why the title has been changed on this ship? ---
**Author:** ![MonkeyMensch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@MonkeyMensch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MonkeyMensch)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/31 "2009-08-17T20:12:04Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > In theory, we should only have one admiral for each capital ship, plus one Fleet Admiral (in wartime) and one Chief of Staff. > … Yikes! The Navy has a Chief of Staff? Somebody must have shot the CNO and brought in an Army general!🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Yesterdog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/d07c76/32.png) [@Yesterdog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yesterdog)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/32 "2009-08-17T22:42:20Z")
Pick up an issue of procedings magazine (the specific issue is the yearly naval review or similar). They have the pictures and job titles of all the admirals. Free and open source. ---
**Author:** ![Billdo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/billdo/32/315_2.png) [@Billdo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Billdo)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2009, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/33 "2009-08-18T16:39:20Z")
Or, even easier, the Navy website has [List with links to Bios](http://www.navy.mil/navydata/bios/bio_list.asp) for each of its Flag Officers. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2009, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/34 "2009-08-18T17:45:44Z")
> [@Billdo](#): > > Or, even easier, the Navy website has [List with links to Bios](http://www.navy.mil/navydata/bios/bio_list.asp) for each of its Flag Officers. Well, that throw’s Polycarp’s information into question. There are 301 admirals listed on this bio page. And of the top 20 links on the list, all are active. I was thinking maybe some were retired, but I haven’t hit any yet, and I’m not gonna go through the whole list. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2009, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/35 "2009-08-18T18:01:14Z")
[This guy](http://www.navy.mil/navydata/bios/navybio.asp?bioID=464) is listed as a Rear Admiral (Select). What does the (Select) mean? ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2009, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/36 "2009-08-18T18:03:09Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > [This guy](http://www.navy.mil/navydata/bios/navybio.asp?bioID=464) is listed as a Rear Admiral (Select). What does the (Select) mean? It means that his name has been put in for promotion but it has not yet been approved (rubber stamped) by Congress yet. ---
**Author:** ![robby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robby/32/11048_2.png) [@robby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robby)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2009, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/37 "2009-08-18T18:19:15Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > Well, that throw’s Polycarp’s information into question. There are 301 admirals listed on this bio page. > > And of the top 20 links on the list, all are active. I was thinking maybe some were retired, but I haven’t hit any yet, and I’m not gonna go through the whole list. 1. Admiral Roughead (Chief of Naval Operations) is listed separately up at the top. The list also includes a few admirals listed as Rear Admiral (Select), indicating that they have not yet been formally promoted. Also, some of the listed officers may be in the U.S. Navy Reserve. **Really Not All That Bright** , while the commissioned ships make up the “tip of the spear” for the U.S. Navy, there are many other facilities and installations that must be managed and led, including training facilities, maintenance depots, etc. The U.S. Navy also has one of the larger air forces in the world. The U.S. Navy has 332,000 personnel, 280 ships, and 3,700 aircraft. There are just a few hundred admirals. Realize, too, that most commissioned officers never make Captain (O-6), and most Captains never make flag rank. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2009, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/38 "2009-08-18T18:36:51Z")
It does indeed appear if the Navy has more admirals than ships, which if nothing else brings the humor factor up a notch. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2009, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/39 "2009-08-18T23:15:16Z")
Roughead is a great name for a flag officer. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2009, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528/40 "2009-08-19T13:04:31Z")
I wonder how many frocked Rear Admirals (Lower Half) there are. Those are individuals whose actual rank is Captain but wearing and serving in the rank of RALH. IIRC, federal law also limits the number of officers who may be frocked. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-admirals-in-the-us-navy-how-many-ships/506528.md?page=3)