# How many jobs has Obama saved? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 27, 2010, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653 "2010-01-27T16:13:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2010, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/1 "2010-01-27T16:13:29Z")
Assuming there is a factual answer but then again, this may very will turn into a GD and get moved. Ever since the errors on the government website that tracks job creations were discovered (like congressional districts and zip codes that don’t exist), I’ve noticed Obama backing away from specific numbers and instead referring to millions and millions. 1. Is there an official nubmer of jobs created/saved from the stimulus money? 2. Is there a criteria to designate a job as saved? For example, GM got a ton of money. Is now every GM job considered saved? 3. Due to the errors in the report and the President now using soft numbers, does the government even know how many jobs were created or saved by the stimulus money? ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2010, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/2 "2010-01-27T16:44:40Z")
The obvious answer is that nobody can produce an exact, precise number because you can’t test against a hypothetical world in which the stimulus didn’t exist. One area where you could get a somewhat precise figure would be in state government jobs (teachers, etc.) that were due to be terminated but were not when the federal stimulus money came in. My sister-in-law is this category. As far as claims, the White House claimed 640,000 jobs, as I’m sure you know. It has since pulled back some of those (maybe 10%) due to what it considers unlikely claims by reporting agencies. Also, as I’m sure you know, more than a third of the stimulus was a tax cut, not government spending. Only 27% was direct spending aimed at saving or creating jobs. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2010, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/3 "2010-01-27T17:04:31Z")
The [CBO claims between 600,000 and 1.2 million as of December.](http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=aJI_OZwQHz_U) > [@](#): > > The nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office said the $787 billion stimulus package approved in February lowered the nation’s unemployment rate by between 0.3 and 0.9 percentage points while boosting the economy by between 1.2 percent and 3.2 percent. The analysis also found that three-quarters of the money provided in the stimulus had yet to be funneled into the economy by the end of September. I think that’s as close to a GQ answer as your likely to get. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2010, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/4 "2010-01-27T17:12:20Z")
From here: [http://www.recovery.gov/News/featured/Pages/Calculator.aspx](http://www.recovery.gov/News/featured/Pages/Calculator.aspx) > [@Recovery.gov](#): > > The Math > > If a normal full-time schedule is 40 hours a week, multiply 40 hours x 52 weeks = 2,080 Total Hours per year > Divide 2,080 Total Hours by 4 to equal 520 regular quarterly hours. > If two full-time employees each worked 520 hours (1,040 hours) for the quarter and another half-time employee worked 260 hours, the Total Hours for the three employees is 1300 (520 + 520 + 260 = 1300). > Divide 1300 by 520 to equal 2.5 Recovery funded jobs during that quarter. Our reporting was due 1/15/10, but there was an extension granted across the board until 1/22/10 (but late reports would be marked “late”). I’d imagine numbers for the last quarter will be available soon. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2010, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/5 "2010-01-27T17:15:54Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > The [CBO claims between 600,000 and 1.2 million as of December.](http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=aJI_OZwQHz_U) > > I think that’s as close to a GQ answer as your likely to get. And the Obama administration seems [more or less in agreement](http://money.cnn.com/2010/01/26/news/economy/stimulus_jobs_questions/index.htm). ---
**Author:** ![Dandmb50](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ba9def/32.png) [@Dandmb50](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dandmb50)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/6 "2010-01-28T15:29:03Z")
Saved is ambiguous did you mean saved or created? Because 1000’s have been saved I’m sure but only created about 48. Not very exciting. ---
**Author:** ![sweeteviljesus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/898d66/32.png) [@sweeteviljesus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sweeteviljesus)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/7 "2010-01-28T16:22:39Z")
> [@](#): > > The nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office said the $787 billion stimulus package approved in February lowered the nation’s unemployment rate by between 0.3 and 0.9 percentage points while boosting the economy by between 1.2 percent and 3.2 percent. The analysis also found that three-quarters of the money provided in the stimulus had yet to be funneled into the economy by the end of September. Does the 1.2-3.2% mean that much increase to the GDP? If so, how much is that in dollars? Thanks, Rob ---
**Author:** ![The\_Great\_Philosopher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3ec8ea/32.png) [@The\_Great\_Philosopher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Great_Philosopher)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/8 "2010-01-28T18:44:45Z")
PolitiFact analysed Obama’s claim that he “saved or created nearly 150,000 jobs” in his first 100 days with the stimulus bill, and they decided it was Barely True, because while it’s possible and there’s anecdotal evidence for it, that figure is effectively based on guesses made by the White House itself about where unemployment would have been. Bottom line is, it’s almost impossible to know. [http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2009/jun/02/obamas-jobs-claim-just-guess-timate/](http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2009/jun/02/obamas-jobs-claim-just-guess-timate/) ---
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/9 "2010-01-28T18:59:04Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > The [CBO claims between 600,000 and 1.2 million as of December.](http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=aJI_OZwQHz_U) > > I think that’s as close to a GQ answer as your likely to get. That means that each job saved/created cost 1 million bucks. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/10 "2010-01-28T19:02:46Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > \*\*How many jobs has Obama saved? \*\* I was going to say **one** if gets re-elected but then I remembered the politicians he stumped for who went down in flames. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/11 "2010-01-28T20:46:13Z")
> [@Dandmb50](#): > > Saved is ambiguous did you mean saved or created? Because 1000’s have been saved I’m sure but only created about 48. Not very exciting. Pretty damn exciting if it’s YOUR job he saved, isn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/12 "2010-01-28T21:17:20Z")
> [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](#): > > That means that each job saved/created cost 1 million bucks. You can’t put a monetary value on jobs. I’ll take mine in the form of a check please. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/13 "2010-01-28T22:29:17Z")
> [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](#): > > That means that each job saved/created cost 1 million bucks. Only a quarter of the Stimulus money has been spent, 200E9/1E6=200E3. So more like 200k per job. Plus the calculation is a little more complicated, some of the money spent comes back in the form of increased tax revenue, and if you spend a billion dollars reinforcing a bridge, while obviously a sizable chunk of that money goes to building materials and directly to jobs, you also get a fixed bridge you won’t have to put money into later. ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/14 "2010-01-28T23:07:10Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > Only a quarter of the Stimulus money has been spent, 200E9/1E6=200E3. So more like 200k per job. > > Plus the calculation is a little more complicated, some of the money spent comes back in the form of increased tax revenue, and if you spend a billion dollars reinforcing a bridge, while obviously a sizable chunk of that money goes to building materials and directly to jobs, you also get a fixed bridge you won’t have to put money into later. I’m not sure if you considered the fact that $288 billion of the stimulus was tax cuts in your calculation. Or that large portions went to Medicaid funding ($87 billion), unemployment benefits ($40 billion), and food stamps ($20 billion). Obviously large portions of the infrastructure expenses ($80 billion) went to material costs, not worker’s salaries. ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/15 "2010-01-28T23:13:29Z")
> [@sweeteviljesus](#): > > Does the 1.2-3.2% mean that much increase to the GDP? If so, how much is that in dollars? That is generally the measure used, but I can’t be sure that it is in that particular report. If so, those numbers (based on 2008 GDP) would be $173 - $460 billion. The CBO report also claimed that only 25% of the $787 billion has entered the economy ($200 billion or so). So, that range could either be called a minor failure or a pretty solid success (surprise!). ---
**Author:** ![Markxxx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5daacb/32.png) [@Markxxx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Markxxx)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/16 "2010-01-28T23:19:05Z")
You also have to balance jobs saved against those lost. Sure if you loan the bank money, those might be jobs saved. But all the banks did was cut off credit to small businesses, which went out of business. So thus by saving the big banks, small guys got cut off. Now there’s no questions to save the big banks was a LOT more helpful than helping the little guys but you also have to minus out all jobs lost by keeping on jobs saved. You also have to minus out jobs potentially created. Suppose the government hadn’t bailed out GM. Now I’ll make up these numbers so you get my point. Let’s say a million jobs were saved. But had the government allowed GM to go down, undoubtedly some of those workers would’ve found jobs at other companies that were able to create jobs by the lack of competition. So let’s say the potential was 10,000 new jobs created by lack of competition. You have to minus the 10,000 not created from the million jobs saved for a net of 990,000 As you can see, statistics can easily be manipulated to get any answer you desire. ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/17 "2010-01-28T23:28:03Z")
> [@Markxxx](#): > > You also have to balance jobs saved against those lost. Sure if you loan the bank money, those might be jobs saved. But all the banks did was cut off credit to small businesses, which went out of business. So thus by saving the big banks, small guys got cut off. > > Now there’s no questions to save the big banks was a LOT more helpful than helping the little guys but you also have to minus out all jobs lost by keeping on jobs saved. > > You also have to minus out jobs potentially created. Suppose the government hadn’t bailed out GM. Now I’ll make up these numbers so you get my point. Let’s say a million jobs were saved. But had the government allowed GM to go down, undoubtedly some of those workers would’ve found jobs at other companies that were able to create jobs by the lack of competition. So let’s say the potential was 10,000 new jobs created by lack of competition. You have to minus the 10,000 not created from the million jobs saved for a net of 990,000 > > As you can see, statistics can easily be manipulated to get any answer you desire. Yes, as soon as you incorporate TARP or the GM bailout the question is much more difficult to answer (not that considering only the stimulus is easy, as we’ve seen in this thread). However, since TARP was passed by Bush and GM was bailed out by both Bush and Obama, I didn’t really consider them germane to the question of how many jobs Obama has saved. ---
**Author:** ![Digital\_Stimulus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@Digital\_Stimulus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Digital_Stimulus)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/18 "2010-01-28T23:28:18Z")
> [@Markxxx](#): > > You also have to balance jobs saved against those lost… FYI: you’re conflating the stimulus, TARP, and the auto bailouts, which is done _way_ too often. Most of the replies thus far have been about the stimulus, not the bailouts. Not that that affects your point about manipulating stats… ---
**Author:** ![The\_Great\_Philosopher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3ec8ea/32.png) [@The\_Great\_Philosopher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Great_Philosopher)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2010, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-jobs-has-obama-saved/526653/19 "2010-01-28T23:36:13Z")
> [@Digital\_Stimulus](#): > > FYI: you’re conflating the stimulus, TARP, and the auto bailouts, which is done _way_ too often. Most of the replies thus far have been about the stimulus, not the bailouts. True, although the auto bailouts were funded through TARP so it’s probably fair enough to conflate those two.