# How many Marvel/DC villains would retire or be forced to retire in the event of a villain takeover? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** comic-books-manga\ **Created:** [October 18, 2023, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751 "2023-10-18T14:09:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Pavelb1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/439d5e/32.png) [@Pavelb1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pavelb1)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2023, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/21 "2023-10-19T23:31:41Z")
Oh yeah, DC has good ones. I think Deathstroke is also American ---
**Author:** ![Asuka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@Asuka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asuka)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2023, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/22 "2023-10-19T23:48:04Z")
I mean there’s a bunch of mid-tier American villains in Marvel. General Thunderbolt Ross, Juggernaut, most of the Spider-Man villains, Kingpin. Kingpin might be the most powerful but he’s no Lex Luthor. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/23 "2023-10-20T01:51:44Z")
Well, some of the top US villains could qualify on various technicalities. Specifically Ultron (Comic or MCU version) and the Sentinels are sentient creatures ‘born’ in the US. As is Hank Pym for another technicality. And the Maker (alt Reed Richards) is a truly terrifying villain. All American to one degree or another. But most of the big bads in Marvel are, as pointed out, from another nation, or much more commonly, another race, dimension, or planet. ---
**Author:** ![anny\_m](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/96bed5/32.png) [@anny\_m](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anny_m)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/24 "2023-10-20T03:13:01Z")
I hope you enjoy _Hench_. I really liked it. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/25 "2023-10-20T03:34:06Z")
> [@Pavelb1](#): > > How the heck do Magneto and Red Skull co-exist as leaders?? I feel like Doom would have little use for Red Skull also… Around 1989-1990, Marvel had an event called Acts of Vengeance where Loki hatched a plot to destory the Avengers and part of his plan involves having villains go off and fight heroes they wouldn’t normally fight. So you’d have someone like Graviton, an Avengers villain, squaring off against the likes of Spider-Man. Red Skull and Magneto were part of the plot, but they ended up not being able to get along for some reason… ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/26 "2023-10-20T05:25:43Z")
For those who want slightly more info than Odesio hints at: > **[Magneto Hates The Red Skull More Than Captain America Ever Will](https://screenrant.com/red-skull-magneto-hates-captain-america/)** > > Magneto hates Red Skull more than anyone. Although, TBH, I prefer how the live action Magneto deals with those who torture those he holds dear. But I’m a terrible person. ---
**Author:** ![Asuka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@Asuka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asuka)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/27 "2023-10-20T05:34:20Z")
Could Magneto defeat Dr. Doom? Those are always the two most OP villains I usually see regularly in Marvel comics. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/28 "2023-10-20T05:46:51Z")
Since Dr. Doom is clad in metal armor I would think Magneto would have little trouble beating him in a fight. (IIRC Magneto can manipulate any metal, not just ferrous metals.) ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/29 "2023-10-20T06:01:36Z")
Eh, how Magnetos powers work, and their magnitude changes all the damn time. Same for Doom. In terms of raw power, yeah, I agree that if Magneto basically mugs Doom while he’s out having a donut, sure, likely a win for Magneto. But… Magneto and ego are a given, and a moment’s pause (and we are talking about the comic universe, not a realistic version of ours) and Doom Escapes via any of his many tricks (magic, hyper-intellect/inventions, or his frikkin’ TIME MACHINE). And once he gets away, he can use all of the above to beat Magneto effortlessly, right up until the laws of the comic book universe make sure Magneto can escape as well. Buuut, back to the OP, in a universe where the heroes are dead and gone, would you want to be a standard Spider-Man level of supervillain when the big guns above no longer have anyone to distract them? Hell no, you keep you head down and get a job! It’s one thing to rob the First National Bank, quite another to rob First Nation Bank of Doom “In Doom We Trust, All Others Pay Cash!”. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/30 "2023-10-20T13:23:00Z")
> [@ParallelLines](#): > > Doom Escapes via any of his many tricks (magic, hyper-intellect/inventions, or his frikkin’ TIME MACHINE). Magneto has also displayed the “tech soopa-genius” ability, including building a time machine. So it’s basically whether magic and a tin suit outweighs Magneto’s very OP mutant abilities. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/31 "2023-10-20T13:48:59Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Other company, but Lex Luthor is American. He’s also proven to be a good leader, under the right circumstances. Way back in the 1960s he saved the planet Lexor and maintained it for a long time. This page gives more of his Good Deeds > **[Lex Luthor's Most Wholesome Moments In Comics](https://screenrant.com/lex-luthor-most-wholesome-moments-dc-comics/#saved-lexor)** > > Lex Luthor may be one of the most famous villains in comics, but Superman's nemesis has had his heroic moments, too. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/32 "2023-10-20T18:37:36Z")
As I said, Magneto, his powers, and their magnitude change all the damn time. Historically, any super tech he’s had has been lent/gifted to him (for example, his access to the High Evolutionary) - but I wouldn’t say it, or super intellect, have been part of his core story - unlike Doom, which has been challenging Richards as an intellectual equal since his earliest days. But, again, comic logic and continuity are not exactly logical. 🙂 Saying X will win vs Y has everything to do with the writers intent of the moment rather than anything else. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/33 "2023-10-20T19:03:51Z")
> [@Pavelb1](#): > > How the heck do Magneto and Red Skull co-exist as leaders? Not well. > **[https://preview.redd.it/81oeors4f1x21.jpg?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp...](https://preview.redd.it/81oeors4f1x21.jpg?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=f6def8e349a5815837ac1c598a7016956c1ccb8d)** ---
**Author:** ![Pavelb1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/439d5e/32.png) [@Pavelb1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pavelb1)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/34 "2023-10-20T19:05:51Z")
Exactly. Iron Man beats Magneto with a ‘non-ferrous suit’ easily…until some writer remembers just about everything has a magnetic field. AND Magneto can create force-fields that stop Cyclops beams, so they certainly stop some dumb Not-Iron Man suit. ---
**Author:** ![Asuka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@Asuka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asuka)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/35 "2023-10-20T21:26:39Z")
I’ve always seen that panel but curious how he escaped. Doesn’t he have supersoldier serum in him? I imagine he’d eventually wall jump his way to the top. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/36 "2023-10-20T21:34:46Z")
Not to say the movies are canon but remember Magneto completely dominates Wolverine because of Wolverine’s adamantium bones. I assume adamantium is non-ferrous. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/37 "2023-10-20T21:41:30Z")
> [@Asuka](#): > > I’ve always seen that panel but curious how he escaped. One of his henchmen, Crossbones, finds him. I don’t recall how they justified Crossbones finding the shelter, though. > [@](#): > > Doesn’t he have supersoldier serum in him? I imagine he’d eventually wall jump his way to the top. Not in the comics. That was an MCU thing. At one point, he transferred his consciousness into a clone of Steve Rogers, but that didn’t last. ---
**Author:** ![mbh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@mbh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mbh)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/38 "2023-10-20T22:06:36Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > I assume adamantium is non-ferrous. In the comics, adamantium is a ferrous compound. Wolverine never stops trying, but never quite reaches Magneto. Although he did nick his helmet once. ---
**Author:** ![Asuka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@Asuka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asuka)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2023, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/39 "2023-10-20T23:56:47Z")
Ahh, I VAGUELY remember Red Skull in the comics having a Nazi version of the super soldier formula that was inferior to the American one but still let him go toe to toe with Captain America in hand to hand combat, but that may have been a What If story. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2023, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751/40 "2023-10-21T00:32:25Z")
> [@mbh](#): > > In the comics, adamantium is a ferrous compound. Wolverine never stops trying, but never quite reaches Magneto. Although he did nick his helmet once. Which eventually leads to a sequence where Magneto finally did to Wolverine that anyone knowing their circumstances would have done within the first, or at the very latest, SECOND encounter. He rips the adamantium off Wolvie’s bones. Although I’d have just fused all his bones together, so that he would be locked in place forever. Bringing us right back to Comic Logic vs Rationality. 🙂 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-marvel-dc-villains-would-retire-or-be-forced-to-retire-in-the-event-of-a-villain-takeover/991751.md?page=3)