# How many Reps (and which ones) would it take to break this logjam? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 25, 2023, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682 "2023-09-25T18:02:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2023, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/1 "2023-09-25T18:02:48Z")
From my calculations, if 5 Republican congress people switch to Independent and caucused with the Dems, they could have a new speaker and get government moving again, avoid a shutdown, etc. Do I have that right? 222R-213D, if five move, it becomes 217R-218D. Wouldn’t that completely defang the lunatic caucus? It’s not like a Dem-controlled congress could do whatever they want – the Senate would still bottle up lots of legislation. Are there five representatives willing to prevent a government shutdown, fund the military, and show that the US can actually be governed? Any suggestions for the five? I’ll choose George Santos for one – maybe he just lied when he said he was a Republican. ETA: I meant to mention that Moody’s is threatening to downgrade the US if there’s a shutdown. Crazy stuff. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2023, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/2 "2023-09-25T18:24:51Z")
Which Republicans do you think have even the remotest possibility of leaving the party? They’ve refused to stand up to Trump, wouldnt vote to impeach Trump, contine to support him, and have done NOTHING to rein in the extremists in their party. If an insurrection, 2 impeachments, 4 indictments, a race to dictatorial authoritarianism, and clear mental instability won’t move the meter, a possible shutdown wont make a lick of difference to them. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2023, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/3 "2023-09-25T18:29:24Z")
Plus, how many independents have been elected recently to the House? Election is just a year away. They would be kissing their seats good-bye. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2023, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/4 "2023-09-25T19:00:47Z")
I suppose they could just become Democrats. That happened with one of the Dems elected to the House recently – he became a Republican. It just seems like the House is even less governable than expected, and I would hope that there are 5 members that would put the country over their own career. I guess not. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2023, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/5 "2023-09-25T19:38:33Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > That happened with one of the Dems elected to the House recently – he became a Republican. Elected to the House? Are you thinking of the Dallas mayor? ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2023, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/6 "2023-09-25T19:45:22Z")
You’d have to give such Republicans some sort of strong personal reward and incentive to defect. I don’t see any incentive the D’s would offer. By jumping ship, these Republicans could never win office as an (R) again, but there is no reason for Democratic voters to vote for them when they could vote for the (D) candidate. So they’d lose everything and gain little. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2023, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/7 "2023-09-25T19:46:11Z")
I was thinking of NJ Republican Jeff Van Drew who was elected to his seat as a Democrat and switched parties. > [@Velocity](#): > > So they’d lose everything and gain little. They would gain a properly funded military, a country with a stronger credit rating, a working House. I’m not saying that a representative from a deep red district does this, but there are still more than 5 close districts where the people may be happier with a government that works and could reward their Rep for that. Santos took over from a Democrat, for example, right? Or, maybe it was due to redistricting that made the seat competitive, but it was definitely competitive. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2023, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/8 "2023-09-25T19:56:05Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > > [@Velocity](#): > > > > So they’d lose everything and gain little. > > They would gain a properly funded military, a country with a stronger credit rating, a working House. So how much CASH MONEY would those things put in their personal pockets? Because that’s what it’s all about - _show me the money_! ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2023, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/9 "2023-09-25T19:58:45Z")
I guess I’m finding it hard to accept that, out of 222 House members, there aren’t five that are willing to do something to make the government functional. ETA: OK, I know there have been shutdowns in the past, but that was due to the House and Senate not agreeing, or Congress and the president not agreeing. In the case, the House itself can’t get out of its own way because of the lunatic fringe. If I were a member of the House, I wouldn’t want to be associated with the likes of MTG and Boebert, and I definitely wouldn’t want to be held hostage by those or, shudder, Gaetz. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2023, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/10 "2023-09-25T20:14:34Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > hey’ve refused to stand up to Trump, wouldnt vote to impeach Trump, No less than ten GOPers voted to Impeach. Now sure, many are no longer in Congress (2 still serve), but that shows that you can get a handful of Republicans. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2023, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/11 "2023-09-25T20:45:34Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > They would gain a properly funded military, a country with a stronger credit rating, a working House. And would they get a medal for that? What they’d get is being renounced by the other Republicans, loss of campaign contributions and the inevitable primary challenges from red meat Republicans. All that for the privilege of getting, at best, a budget for one year, or more likely, a continuing resolution for a few months. At least they can all join Liz Cheney out on Integrity Island. ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2023, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/12 "2023-09-26T01:14:40Z")
Stop trying to make the Moderate Republican Revolt happen. It’s not going to happen. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2023, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/13 "2023-09-26T01:29:19Z")
The funny thing is that there are tons of Republican pundits that have revolted. Some of them weren’t even that moderate, but they are just disgusted by the current party antics. Well, I guess the party will just become a circular firing squad, and all of America can pay the price. ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2023, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/14 "2023-09-26T02:09:51Z")
> [@flurb](#): > > Stop trying to make the Moderate Republican Revolt happen. It’s not going to happen # Moderate Republicans plot last-ditch shutdown plan with Democrats [https://thehill.com/homenews/house/4222537-moderate-republicans-plot-last-ditch-shutdown-plan-with-democrats/](https://thehill.com/homenews/house/4222537-moderate-republicans-plot-last-ditch-shutdown-plan-with-democrats/) ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2023, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/15 "2023-09-26T02:21:08Z")
Republican “moderates” always grumble and gripe and threaten that, by gosh, they have half a mind to go work a deal with the Democrats to get things done! But I’ll believe it when I see them actually force a vote on a discharge petition over McCarthy’s objection. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2023, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/16 "2023-09-26T02:52:15Z")
A discharge petition isn’t going to happen. It has to stay in committee for 30 days before it can be voted on. ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2023, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/17 "2023-09-26T03:17:36Z")
The Democrats already have a discharge petition filed on a debt limit bill from back when it looked like that was going to be needed. I won’t pretend to be an authority on House procedure, but my understanding is that they can swap in a continuing resolution to fund the federal government for that bill and – should the discharge petition attain the necessary number of signatures – it would be seven legislative days before it would ripen and be eligible for the floor. The Speaker would then have to schedule a vote within two days. That would still mean a government shutdown since the current fiscal year ends on Saturday. And they need five Republican signatures on the discharge petition, which they will find nearly impossible to get. ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2023, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/18 "2023-09-26T21:26:16Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > Do I have that right? 222R-213D, if five move, it becomes 217R-218D. You don’t have these numbers right. There are currently two house vacancies. Dave Cicilline (D-RI) resigned May 31, 2023. There is a special election to replace him scheduled November 7, 2023. Chris Stewart (R-UT) resigned September 15, 2023. No special election scheduled yet. These even out so five flippers would still be required, but I thought it might relieve some later confusion when inevitably during these negotiations we’ll hear the phrase, “Can they get to 217?” and now you’ll know why it’s not 218. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2023, 10:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/19 "2023-09-27T10:16:00Z")
Thanks for the detail! I imagine both of those seats remain safe for their parties, whenever they’re filled. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2023, 10:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682/20 "2023-09-27T10:38:48Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > I guess I’m finding it hard to accept that, out of 222 House members, there aren’t five that are willing to do something to make the government functional. When I was a kid and first learned about [Edgar Cayce](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edgar_Cayce), I argued with my mom that telepathy had to be real: with so many people claiming it, they couldn’t _all_ be liars! It was only when I was older that I realized two things: 1. Some of them could be deeply mistaken 2. If telepathy didn’t exist, then “being mistaken” or “being a liar” was a prerequisite for making the claim. At this point, “being mistaken” or “being a scam artist” is a prerequisite for being a Republican house member. If you’re not willing to put up with insane nonsense, you’ve chosen a different calling. This is a self-selected group, and their selection criteria are _terrible_. I can absolutely believe that there aren’t five members of this insane clown posse willing to be sane. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-reps-and-which-ones-would-it-take-to-break-this-logjam/990682.md?page=2)