# How many (US) cities have all 4 major sports? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 7, 2004, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-us-cities-have-all-4-major-sports/253883 "2004-07-07T00:57:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![stpauler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@stpauler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stpauler)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-us-cities-have-all-4-major-sports/253883/41 "2004-07-07T19:35:45Z")
> [@cmkeller](#): > > wolfman: > > In addition to Denver and Philadelphia, I believe all of Atlanta’s, Chicago’s, Minneapolis’s and Detroit’s teams play within their respective city’s limits. The Wild (NHL) technically play in St Paul, but considering that we share a border with Minneapolis and the term “Twin Cities”, one could really argue that it’s pretty much the same city. ---
**Author:** ![wolfman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a8b319/32.png) [@wolfman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfman)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-us-cities-have-all-4-major-sports/253883/42 "2004-07-07T19:41:11Z")
I forgot the Lions moved from Pontiac so Detroit’s good now. And the judges say none of this Twin City stuff so Bye-bye Minneapolis. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![plnnr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@plnnr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/plnnr)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-us-cities-have-all-4-major-sports/253883/43 "2004-07-07T19:47:10Z")
> [@Splanky](#): > > If you’re willing to count Baltimore and D.C. as one Metropolitan area, we have the Orioles, Ravens/Redskins, Wizards, and Capitals. I’m a life-long O’s fan, but I’d still LOVE, LOVE, LOVE to see baseball in Washington DC again. You’d have to love the Senators. ---
**Author:** ![Lamar\_Mundane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85f322/32.png) [@Lamar\_Mundane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamar_Mundane)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-us-cities-have-all-4-major-sports/253883/44 "2004-07-07T20:10:35Z")
> [@Philster](#): > > In Philadelphia, **all four teams actually play in Philadelphia** …and all within a three block radius. I think we have a winner. Coors Field in Denver is about a mile or two from Mile High Stadium. The Pepsi Center is right across the highway from Mile High. Does Philly have soccer? Denver has Div. 1 college hockey (DU), but I think thats it. You have to go to Boulder (30 miles) or Colorado Springs (Air Force Acadeny - 50 miles) to get Div 1 football or basketball. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-us-cities-have-all-4-major-sports/253883/45 "2004-07-07T20:28:39Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Seattle - No hockey team No baseball team, either. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![RogueRacer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/7ab992/32.png) [@RogueRacer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RogueRacer)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-us-cities-have-all-4-major-sports/253883/46 "2004-07-07T21:32:10Z")
> [@Really Not All That Bright](#): > > The Cardinals play at Sun Devil Stadium, which is in Tempe, not Phoenix. > > Let’s expand this a bit… does any team have the _five_ biggest US sports? (add soccerball, IOW): > > There are only ten MLS teams, and only New England/Boston, NYC, and Chicago still appear to qualify. [hijack] Since when is soccer the fifth biggest sport in the US? What are you using to determine that? According to [this site](http://www.kenn.com/soccer/mlstv2.html), for 2002 MLS got a .8 average rating on network television and a .19 for cable. Total attendance was [2,215,019](http://www.infoplease.com/ipsa/A0905686.html), which is actually down from [five years ago](http://www.infoplease.com/ipsa/A0111682.html). Let’s compare that to the WNBA (professional women’s basketball). [Total attendance](http://womensbasketballonline.com/wnba/attendance/attendance02.PDF) for 2002 was 2,362,412. Granted, the number of games and teams in the league are different. To be fair, their average attendance is down. I haven’t found one cite for the year in question, but doing some searching showed the WNBA getting around a 1.4 network and .5 on cable. Most of these stories talked about woeful ratings. What does this say about MLS? That was an extreme example. The bigger sports like PGA golf and NASCAR completely dwarf MLS in the US. NASCAR can draw over a 4 rating on cable. [mini GQ-sized rant] I could go on with the stats, but I think I’ve at least showed some backing for my point. My point is that in spite of hearing how soccer is the “next big thing” since I was in elementary school, it’s nowhere near the “big four” in sports. MLS’s popularity in the US is closer to WNBA and arena football than the big four. [/mini rant] [/hijack] ---
**Author:** ![Jenaroph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Jenaroph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jenaroph)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-us-cities-have-all-4-major-sports/253883/47 "2004-07-08T02:15:20Z")
> [@cmkeller](#): > > In addition to Denver and Philadelphia, I believe all of Atlanta’s, Chicago’s, Minneapolis’s and Detroit’s teams play within their respective city’s limits. Scratch off Detroit - while the Lions have returned from Pontiac, the Pistons play in Auburn Hills. ---
**Author:** ![Splanky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b2d939/32.png) [@Splanky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Splanky)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-us-cities-have-all-4-major-sports/253883/48 "2004-07-08T05:11:46Z")
> [@plnnr](#): > > I’m a life-long O’s fan, but I’d still LOVE, LOVE, LOVE to see baseball in Washington DC again. You’d have to love the Senators. Me too- as far as the argument that it will hurt the O’s fan base, it seems like both cities are doing fine having their own football team. I heard that O’Malley supports D.C. getting a baseball team- we’ll see in the next few years how it plays out. There’s also the D.C. United, so D.C./Baltimore may qualify for the “Big 5” unless you’re a purist and all teams have to be within the city limits. ---
**Author:** ![SmackFu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/53a042/32.png) [@SmackFu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmackFu)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-us-cities-have-all-4-major-sports/253883/49 "2004-07-08T05:28:44Z")
So if you add NASCAR, RickJay’s list drops to: Chicago - Chicagoland Speedway Detroit - Michigan Int’l Speedway Dallas - Texas Motor Speedway Atlanta - Atlanta Motor Speedway Phoenix - Phoenix Int’l Raceway Miami - Homestead-Miami Speedway Some of those may not be very close though, I was just guessing. ---
**Author:** ![yabob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yabob/32/2821_2.png) [@yabob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yabob)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-us-cities-have-all-4-major-sports/253883/50 "2004-07-08T05:41:05Z")
> [@SmackFu](#): > > So if you add NASCAR, RickJay’s list drops to: > > Chicago - Chicagoland Speedway > Detroit - Michigan Int’l Speedway > Dallas - Texas Motor Speedway > Atlanta - Atlanta Motor Speedway > Phoenix - Phoenix Int’l Raceway > Miami - Homestead-Miami Speedway > > Some of those may not be very close though, I was just guessing. If you think it’s close enough, Infineon Raceway (Sears Point) for the SF Bay Area (It’s in Sonoma). ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 6:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-us-cities-have-all-4-major-sports/253883/51 "2004-07-08T06:49:04Z")
> [@RogueRacer](#): > > Since when is soccer the fifth biggest sport in the US? What are you using to determine that? > > …for 2002 MLS got a .8 average rating on network television and a .19 for cable. > > …WNBA (professional women’s basketball)…around a 1.4 network and .5 on cable. Most of these stories talked about woeful ratings. What does this say about MLS? > > That was an extreme example. The bigger sports like PGA golf and NASCAR completely dwarf MLS in the US. NASCAR can draw over a 4 rating on cable. > > [mini GQ-sized rant] > I could go on with the stats, but I think I’ve at least showed some backing for my point. My point is that in spite of hearing how soccer is the “next big thing” since I was in elementary school, it’s nowhere near the “big four” in sports. MLS’s popularity in the US is closer to WNBA and arena football than the big four. > [/mini rant] hehheh, be careful about your comparisons. By your logic, (and pretty much everybody else’s logic), the NHL does not qualify for the “big four”. The real “big four” is one of two things: The “big three”, or the NFL, MLB, NBA, and NASCAR. There isn’t really much offense and defense in NASCAR, so I don’t consider it a sport, but at least everybody is on the field at the same time, so it’s much better than golf for being a true sport. IMHO, both are closer to competition than sport. Back to the OP, if you don’t count the NY football teams, citing them as really being Jersey teams, then you have to count Jersey. Wait…does New Jersey have an MLB team? ---
**Author:** ![Philster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/13edae/32.png) [@Philster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Philster)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-us-cities-have-all-4-major-sports/253883/52 "2004-07-08T13:37:15Z")
NJ = No baseball. Why soccer as fifth? Arena football is televised on a national station (NBC?) Philly has five biggies within a 2-3 block radius. In addition, just north of Philly is the Pocono Raceway on the NASCAR cicruit, and just south is Dover Downs (The Monster Mile) on the Nascar circuit. North Jersey (the NY Suburbs), has Jets, Giants, Devils and Nets. ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-us-cities-have-all-4-major-sports/253883/53 "2004-07-08T14:20:41Z")
Well, if you’re going to put the Giants and Jets in the New Jersey column, then New York doesn’t qualify as having all of the “big four.” Even though they play in New Jersey, both the Giants and Jets identify themselves as New York teams…I think you have to put them in the New York column. Or lump all the New York-New Jersey teams together, as we’ve been doing for San Francisco-Oakland. ---
**Author:** ![RogueRacer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/7ab992/32.png) [@RogueRacer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RogueRacer)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-us-cities-have-all-4-major-sports/253883/54 "2004-07-08T14:50:38Z")
> [@Ellis Dee](#): > > hehheh, be careful about your comparisons. By your logic, (and pretty much everybody else’s logic), the NHL does not qualify for the “big four”. I completely agree. Given my user name, I kind of felt that if I sold racing very hard in my other post, I would lose credibility. If you get right down to it though, there is the NFL and all the rest. The NFL is way ahead of the other three. Surprisingly, as I was looking up the numbers for the last post, I saw some things that said that NASCAR was at least holding up ok against NFL games (in head to head events). NASCAR’s prerace shows were actually beating some of CBS’s pregame shows. Fox’s pregame show beat both of them fairly handily though. ---
**Author:** ![David\_Simmons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9de053/32.png) [@David\_Simmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_Simmons)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-us-cities-have-all-4-major-sports/253883/55 "2004-07-08T15:16:30Z")
> [@KGS](#): > > Well, on the other side of the coin, Los Angeles is definitely the largest city _without_ all four major sports – we’ve got two teams each in baseball, basketball, and hockey, and we’ve even got a major NASCAR Nextel Cup circuit. But both of our football teams moved away over a decade ago. > > Funny thing is, nobody seems to care. And good for Angelenos. If the corporate or other well-heeled owners want a team in Los Angeles, let them finance it themselves. ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-us-cities-have-all-4-major-sports/253883/56 "2004-07-08T15:24:22Z")
Re: “four major sports.” No one means to be putting down NASCAR, or, for that matter, golf, tennis or other sports which have a major following. The difference is that Major League Baseball, NFL Football (and CFL Football in Canadian cities), NHL Hockey and NBA Basketball are the major American _team_ sports. Since they’re team sports, they are identified with the city they’re located in (or near), unlike the individual sports, which, popular though they might be, do not necessarily have a regional identification. At a NASCAR track, no one racer is considered the “home” participant. There was once a “team tennis” league, but that went over even worse than Major League Soccer. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-many-us-cities-have-all-4-major-sports/253883.md?page=2)