# How much human experience would a Jesus actually get? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 23, 2010, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174 "2010-01-23T23:53:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/41 "2010-01-26T00:25:56Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Sacrificed to sin? Sacrificed to the rules? > > Maybe you need to stop and actually think about your religious beliefs for some time. You seem to be just repeating slogans. > > Start with this: do you believe God is all-powerful? Yes or no. Look, I’m not trying to convert you or even persuade you. I’m just offering some information about a particular point of view. I’ve tried to have a friendly conversation, but you’ve been consistently dismissive, hostile, and rude. I don’t need to spend any more time trying to communicate with someone who won’t engage and who won’t offer me the minimal courtesy of a civil tone. You win; I’m out. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/42 "2010-01-26T00:43:30Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > So, let me see if I’ve got this right. > > Non-acceptance of Jesus = doomed > Acceptance of Jesus = fluffy bunnies and chocolate rivers > > This should be a no-brainer, really. We’re not going to do Pascal’s Wager _again_ are we? ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/43 "2010-01-26T01:25:11Z")
> [@smiling\_bandit](#): > > Sacrificed to himself, even.Remember that God is absolute justice as well as mercy. He cannot or will not excuse the slightest flaw or imperfection. You or may not like being a Littrle Nemo (humans in general seems to inevitably despise what they are while tremendously overly proud of pretending to be what they are not). God, however, will not toelrate you being less than the perfect Little Nemo. And either you must submit to his making you perfect, or you must eventually flee from his grace. There is no third option. It amy be that you simply don’t want to be a Little Nemo: you’d rather be an Obama or a Brad Pitt or a Donald Trump. Well, tough: he didn’t ask you, you won’t makem a good one anyway, and you’re probably overestimating how good or happy those people are,and even if you weren’t, you’ve set your sights pretty low. The greatest of all humanity now is darn near nothing compared to what we will become. A Lincoln or an Aristotle or a Ghandi are nothing compared to the Saints. Heck, the Saints int heir mortal lives are nothing comapred to the Saints. The perfect **begbert2** is a refined skeptic who feels perfectly justified in not giving any god an inch of unearned slack. He’s also lazy, sloppy, egotistical, immoral, and quite rude (especially to children and babies). What? You disagree? In that case you’re saying that there’s an ideal of perfection that I should be attaining - an ideal that’s clearly shared with **Little Nemo** and Obama and Brad Pitt and Donald Trump and the Saints and the Cardinals. (We know the ideal is a shared ideal because absent that we’d all have separate bibles, and absent separate bibles we can’t even _aspire_ for this supposed varying perfection because whe don’t even know what different things we’re each supposed to be doing.) So yeah - this paragraph makes no sense whatsoever. Either we’re all supposed to be God and not be us, or we’re fine as we are, warts and dirt and all. On the upside - I don’t want to be in the company of any God who would make things worse for me if I chose not to be in the God’s company, so no matter how it turns out I’m going to come out fine. > [@smiling\_bandit](#): > > And we have no right to be, less to be anything in particular, much less to become something which could only make us unhappy. Now, it is not in His nature to force us to be good. He could perhaps well do this in theory. But he does not or cannot (and with Him, the difference is irrelevant) simply make us good. It might make us happy, but it would displease him. To do so would be a terrible crime, and ultiamtely destroy the very geratest thing about us: our ability to chose. He wants us to choose good, but if he made us do so, we would become either marrionettes or slaves. So is God a marrionette or a slave? > [@smiling\_bandit](#): > > However, for reasons we don’t ourselves know (but many have speculated upon), He does allow Satan to tempt us. And the devil makes it very hard for us to be what we should be instead of following a fashion, or the feeling of the times, or even our worse whims. Because of this, men were subjectd to death. There’s some dispute over whether physical death (as well as disease and illness) came about because we polluted our universe, or whether that’s the spiritual death we die over time as we become more and more monstrous and less and less human. it could be both (and yes, time is no objection here to Christians; the consequences of the Fall need not antedate the Fall). What? There’s no dispute at all. Things were great in the garden of eden, then God was disobeyed (with a rather trivial offense) and then God started laying down punishments and curses left and right, resulting in the trouble-filled world we have now. In other words, God did it - that’s the creation myth here, not us “polluting our universe” or somesuch nonsense. > [@smiling\_bandit](#): > > Now, this is where Jesus comes in. We made many moral mistakes. Regardless of original sin or not, each and every one of us has offended against justice numerous times. Jesus talked, quite frankly, as if he were the one we sinned against. He claimed the power to forgive _all_ sins, everywhere. We do not think he was exaggerating in the slightest. In coming to earth as a man, he mixed his divine essence with our mortal flesh - yes, every man, woman, and child who has tasted the Body and Blood of Christ has a glimpse of the divine creator within. A REAL god could forgive _without_ jumping through the hoops. Heck, even _I_ can forgive a person without getting a transfusion from them and poking myself with a pin. > [@smiling\_bandit](#): > > And he also died for us. Now, a great deal of theology has been written about this, and I’m not going to try and answer the dispute here. There are a lot of theories about how Christ did it. What Christians all believe is that in dying, Jesus undertook a repentence that humans could not do. He said in effect, “You are not strong enough to repent, therefore I shall do it for you.” > > Now, some people woudl say that we have sinned and violated God’s perfect law that we owed him an infinite debt and Jesus offered to pay it for us (C. S. Lewis said he once thought this was rather silly, but later on realized that however simple it sounds it’s a pretty logical conclusion) . Some would say that Jesus, being both God and Man, was able to shoulder our sins. Other might argue that by literally dying for humankind, Jesus washed their sins away. What we all agree on is that it did work. For certain values of “we all”. Others of us aren’t as impressed by a god that gets mired in and tied up in his own self-made beaurocracy. A better God wouldn’t have made stupid rules in the first place if he was going to have to go and poke loopholes in them - as if a rule that’s been ventilated by loopholes is somehow more meaningful than a rule that never existed. Of course, that’s not as large a problem as one who uses his forgiveness as a cudgel to manipulate people. So, am I forgiven? God’s already “bought” my debt (from himself, apparently) - is really he going to forgive it, or hang onto it and try to use it to manipulate my behavior with conditional “forgiveness”? 'Cause if that’s what’s happening, I’m exactly as much in debt and enslaved and imprisoned and punished as I was before he made himself bleed to satisfy his own bloodlust. > [@smiling\_bandit](#): > > Now, the problem here is that each and every Christian theology has some slightly different ideas about it all. And furthermore, most Christians has siome mor or less muddled mix of these ideas. Probably most people aren’t going to study the theology, even though they probably should. But you can’t argue against people with a child’s idea of Christianity without looking (and for that mater, basically ebcoming) an odler bully who taunts a child with his simple ideas of arithmatic. You may be quite decent at multiplication with a caluclator in hand, but the child may know _everything_ right about addition without any electronic aids. No doubt he’ll learn about multiplication eventually. In the meantime, you may be racing ahead and trying trickier math than you can really handle and all the while feeling how superior you are, not because of any innate advantage, but because of what has been handed to you. “Your math and logic are stupid (because they disagree with my childish theology)” is all I get out of this. Was there another point? Speaking of math, C.S.'s infinite debt thing is a math error - quite literally on a par with dividing by zero. It does sound pretty logical during the narrow window between being intruduced to mathematical infinities and understanding them, though. ---
**Author:** ![Triskadecamus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b19c9b/32.png) [@Triskadecamus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Triskadecamus)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/44 "2010-01-26T14:34:11Z")
The question rests upon the unstated assumption that the life of Jesus was intended as a learning experience for God. Perhaps He had some other purpose in mind. Tris ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/45 "2010-01-26T14:35:34Z")
> [@Triskadecamus](#): > > The question rests upon the unstated assumption that the life of Jesus was intended as a learning experience for God. > > Perhaps He had some other purpose in mind. > > Tris Slumming, perhaps? ---
**Author:** ![Triskadecamus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b19c9b/32.png) [@Triskadecamus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Triskadecamus)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/46 "2010-01-26T14:49:03Z")
Well, giving a substantive reply to a hemi-demi-semi-snark, slumming would fall into the broad category of learning experiences. Tris ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/47 "2010-01-26T14:53:27Z")
> [@Triskadecamus](#): > > Well, giving a substantive reply to a hemi-demi-semi-snark, slumming would fall into the broad category of learning experiences. > > Tris Actually, it wasn’t a snark. Another reason people slum is to show firsthand that the “lower classes” aren’t worthy of Enlightenment. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/48 "2010-01-26T14:57:39Z")
My point is simply that even method acting is still acting. It’s not genuinely becoming. ---
**Author:** ![Triskadecamus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b19c9b/32.png) [@Triskadecamus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Triskadecamus)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/49 "2010-01-26T15:12:03Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > My point is simply that even method acting is still acting. It’s not genuinely becoming. But still, this rests on the presumption that His experience, whether acting, slumming, or exploring is the reason for becoming a human, and living a human life, or approximating a human life, or shamming a human life, or creating an illusion of human life, or whatever you are assuming He is doing. My point is that it might not be about what is in it for Him at all. There could be some other underlying purpose in the birth, life, and death of the savior of man. When I play peekaboo with my infant child, I am never in doubt at all that he still exists when I hide my eyes. He might well not be aware of that odd fact of reality, that unperceived objects continue to exist. I might not have been aware that he did not have that concept. He certainly doesn’t know that I do have it. But you know what? That isn’t why I play peekaboo with my infant child. Tris ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/50 "2010-01-26T15:17:37Z")
> [@Triskadecamus](#): > > When I play peekaboo with my infant child, I am never in doubt at all that he still exists when I hide my eyes. He might well not be aware of that odd fact of reality, that unperceived objects continue to exist. I might not have been aware that he did not have that concept. He certainly doesn’t know that I do have it. But you know what? That isn’t why I play peekaboo with my infant child. > > Tris God is just playing with us? He knows that his time on Earth is just a little excursion and that he is in no real trouble, but he’d like us to believe that he is experiencing agony, pain and doubt? ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/51 "2010-01-26T15:26:04Z")
> [@Triskadecamus](#): > > But still, this rests on the presumption that His experience, whether acting, slumming, or exploring is the reason for becoming a human, and living a human life, or approximating a human life, or shamming a human life, or creating an illusion of human life, or whatever you are assuming He is doing. Because every Christian theology I’ve ever seen says that he became human. And I’m saying that no, Jesus wasn’t human because a human doesn’t know what’s going to happen tomorrow. It has nothing to do with whether he learned anything. It has to do with whether he was human. Just as George Clooney dressing like a janitor and mopping a floor doesn’t make George Clooney a janitor, Jesus dressing like a human doesn’t make Jesus human, let alone “fully human.” On your resume, you can’t put that you were a doctor just because you played one on TV. It doesn’t matter whether you had to learn something to play a doctor on TV, or if you already knew everything there was to know about playing a doctor on TV–you still were never a doctor. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/52 "2010-01-26T15:38:59Z")
If you voluntarily put yourself into a situation that makes you uncomfortable and/or causes pain, and you have a guaranteed escape(a “safe word”, if you will), then you are not participating in Real Life-you are having an S&M session. ---
**Author:** ![Triskadecamus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b19c9b/32.png) [@Triskadecamus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Triskadecamus)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/53 "2010-01-26T16:15:05Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > God is just playing with us? He knows that his time on Earth is just a little excursion and that he is in no real trouble, but he’d like us to believe that he is experiencing agony, pain and doubt? From the point of view of an infinite god, of trillions upon trillions of worlds, with unknowable numbers of souls, over billions of years, every thing about you is fairly small, in every aspect of its existence, and significance, yes. If that is the experience you gain from it, then from your perspective God is a petty, mean, and dishonest monster. Other outlooks are possible. Tris ---
**Author:** ![Triskadecamus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b19c9b/32.png) [@Triskadecamus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Triskadecamus)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/54 "2010-01-26T16:27:31Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > Because every Christian theology I’ve ever seen says that he became human. And I’m saying that no, Jesus wasn’t human because a human doesn’t know what’s going to happen tomorrow. I do understand the dichotomy. I simply don’t think it is . . . significant. I don’t find it unreasonable that God could in fact experience true human life. You could not have his perceptions, and do so, nor could I. I find projecting human limits onto God to be an interesting paradox when considering God projecting human limits onto himself. Very confusing to consider, if you are human. It might be easier to understand if you were God. But, in either case it doesn’t seem to me to be a very important part of the story. I am not part of a particular sect, or theological tradition, so I cannot speak to the doctrinal consequences of it all, but the human side of the events seem more important. The birth and life, death, resurrection, and true humanity of the Lord are not philosophical events, they are miracles of faith, and love. Of course, that requires that God is God, and Christ is God made man. If it didn’t happen, then none of it matters at all. If it did, then the fact that it would be impossible for humans to accomplish seems unsurprising. Tris ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/55 "2010-01-26T16:31:05Z")
> [@Triskadecamus](#): > > From the point of view of an infinite god, of trillions upon trillions of worlds, with unknowable numbers of souls, over billions of years, every thing about you is fairly small, in every aspect of its existence, and significance, yes. > > If that is the experience you gain from it, then from your perspective God is a petty, mean, and dishonest monster. Other outlooks are possible. > > Tris Yes they are. And without evidence, _all_ outlooks are nothing but guesses and/or wishful thinking. ---
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/56 "2010-01-26T16:37:38Z")
> [@Triskadecamus](#): > > But, in either case it doesn’t seem to me to be a very important part of the story. I am not part of a particular sect, or theological tradition, so I cannot speak to the doctrinal consequences of it all, but the human side of the events seem more important. The birth and life, death, resurrection, and true humanity of the Lord are not philosophical events, they are miracles of faith, and love. Of course, that requires that God is God, and Christ is God made man. If it didn’t happen, then none of it matters at all. If it did, then the fact that it would be impossible for humans to accomplish seems unsurprising. I don’t understand. If these events are miracles, then it seems to me that we should say that they are not inevitable or expected even given the unique situation Jesus was in. That is to say, we should not expect that a son of God should live the way he did, die and be reborn, and so on, and that these things are, for such a being, just as much a miracle as if they occurred to any average human. On that basis, that it would be impossible for humans doesn’t seem to be affected by the matter (or affect in turn) in terms of likelihood or reasonablity. It’s no more or less surprising that humans could not accomplish those things, with that as a given. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/57 "2010-01-26T16:45:06Z")
> [@Triskadecamus](#): > > I am not part of a particular sect, or theological tradition, so I cannot speak to the doctrinal consequences of it all, but the human side of the events seem more important. I’m talking about the human side of the events. It didn’t exist. There was God as God and there was God as Actor. Just as George Clooney knows he gets to stop being a janitor once the cameras stop, Jesus knew that he got to go back to (really just continue) being a god. That changes everything. No matter how method the actor, no matter how deeply they feel the role, no matter how much suffering they emulate, they aren’t the role. You have to take away all of it, all extra information, all extra virtue, all extra confidence, in order to be a schlub like the rest of us. If you can’t do that, you didn’t live as a human. When we hunger, we don’t get to create food from nothing. We don’t get to raise people from the dead or heal the sick. We don’t get to know when we will die and why and what happens next and what our purpose is. That’s supposed to be what makes faith so special. ---
**Author:** ![Triskadecamus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b19c9b/32.png) [@Triskadecamus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Triskadecamus)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/58 "2010-01-26T16:53:21Z")
> [@Revenant\_Threshold](#): > > I don’t understand. If these events are miracles, then it seems to me that we should say that they are not inevitable or expected even given the unique situation Jesus was in. That is to say, we should not expect that a son of God should live the way he did, die and be reborn, and so on, and that these things are, for such a being, just as much a miracle as if they occurred to any average human. On that basis, that it would be impossible for humans doesn’t seem to be affected by the matter (or affect in turn) in terms of likelihood or reasonablity. It’s no more or less surprising that humans could not accomplish those things, with that as a given. Whew. I turned my head almost all the way around following that. 🙂 Uh, I think miracles are different from God’s perspective than from mine. I have fairly strong suspicions that God has a different view of even the most simple, and mundane thing than I do. I don’t know exactly how they are different, but somehow, I feel that they are still miracles even for him. I find the entire realm of matters related to God to be unlikely, and unreasonable. I happen to have faith that they are true, not understanding of the details of how they came about. I have the exact same appreciation of my own life. It is really not that atypical of humans as a group but I don’t understand it, either. Tris ---
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/59 "2010-01-26T17:00:17Z")
> [@Triskadecamus](#): > > Whew. I turned my head almost all the way around following that. 🙂 Apologies. Looking back on it, even I find it hard to read. 🙂 The basic idea I was trying to get at was essentially that if we consider some of the things that Jesus did to be miracles, then we are essentially saying that he required divine intercession to the same extent that you or I would require in order to do those things. That being a son of God, or whatever term would most accurately sum up Jesus’ unique situation, is not in and of itself enough to allow him to do what he did without divine aid. Which in turn would mean that we can’t attribute those miracles to that difference between Jesus and ourselves; that those things which are considered miracles performed by him can’t be used to exalt him. > [@](#): > > Uh, I think miracles are different from God’s perspective than from mine. I have fairly strong suspicions that God has a different view of even the most simple, and mundane thing than I do. I don’t know exactly how they are different, but somehow, I feel that they are still miracles even for him. Then I suppose the question is; what makes those things more unworthy of respect or reverence than the resurrection, for example? Assuming that they are, of course, which isn’t necessarily a given. ---
**Author:** ![Triskadecamus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b19c9b/32.png) [@Triskadecamus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Triskadecamus)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174/60 "2010-01-26T17:05:11Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > No matter how method the actor, no matter how deeply they feel the role, no matter how much suffering they emulate, they aren’t the role. You have to take away all of it, all extra information, all extra virtue, all extra confidence, in order to be a schlub like the rest of us. If you can’t do that, you didn’t live as a human. It does give me a lot to think about. I suppose defining what it is to be human is the crux of it, not what it is to be God. How much faith would Jesus need to accept his human life without divine foreknowledge, and how much miraculous foreknowledge would make him not human? Is Jesus actively making the fish eat a shekel and jump into Peter’s net, or simply having faith that telling Peter to be as a fisherman to solve the problems of a fisherman will allow Peter to experience his miracle? Is the feeding of the multitudes a specific creation on the spot, or faith that God will provide, born out by subsequent events? How much vision must a man have, to stop being a man? I have no answer to that. Tris [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-human-experience-would-a-jesus-actually-get/526174.md?page=4)