# How much of the Russian hack was the Democrats fault? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [July 22, 2018, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385 "2018-07-22T19:50:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 5:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/21 "2018-07-23T05:56:23Z")
I know right-wing memes don’t need to make any sense, but what does Alex Jones say is the _reason_ Obama wanted to help Trump win the election? Did he regret ever making Hillary his Sec’y State and wanted to poke his finger in her eye? Did he feel beholden to the Russian bank that financed his student loan at Harvard Law School? Don’t tell me it was a pee-pee tape! ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/22 "2018-07-23T11:46:59Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > Can you stay on topic? The Democrats have invested a ton of time with this Russia Business. Sadly you must amidst the origin of the problems are theirs. In the same way that the FBI investigations into the Mafia are the origin of organized crime? > [@](#): > > Obama, by the way, was caught on a hot microphone, telling Putin he’ll have more flexibility once the election was over. Ponder what that meant. It meant that Obama was acknowledging that during election campaigns some people will take what are perfectly normal and innocuous statements by their political opponents and graft a new false narrative onto them in order to pretend that those statements mean something more sinister. And not only during campaigns - see for example Hillary Clinton’s “What difference does it make?” statement, which was represented by her opponents as meaning the opposite of what it actually meant. It’s unfortunate that this level of dishonest discourse permeates our political system but unfortunately one encounters all sorts of unscrupulous propagandists these days. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/23 "2018-07-23T14:13:06Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > Odd, I have not seen this mentioned much in the press until recently. > > Obama said Trump’s rigged election claim " whining before the game’s even over ". Shockingly he told his cyber election chief to stand down during an attack by the Russians. And Obama knew there were attacks. Clearly, he did not do enough for cyber defense. > > Then we have Hilary Clinton private server and devices, where confidential and top secret information was sent and hacked. > > So if the Russians obtained information, we need to remember how they did it and on whose watch they did it in. So this, if true (and as far as I can tell it isn’t), the Trump administration need do nothing on this issue going forward, is that correct? ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/24 "2018-07-23T14:14:28Z")
Seriously, guy, I literally created a thread for you regarding topics like this. I even referenced you in the OP: [https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=858713](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=858713) ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/25 "2018-07-23T14:30:49Z")
Actually **JohnT** , _I_ literally [created a thread](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=859006) for **Silver lining** _for this exact topic_, but I guess there were too many facts in it for him to bother wading into. We even had a surprise appearance by **Magiver** expressing the same nonsensical confusion between the hacked DNC servers in 2016 and the non-hacked Clinton email server pre-2013. What say you **Silver lining** , are you too chickenshit to actually engage with facts on this topic? The thread is still waiting for you. ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_lining](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aca169/32.png) [@Silver\_lining](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_lining)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/26 "2018-07-23T14:31:17Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally Posted by Silver lining > Odd, I have not seen this mentioned much in the press until recently. > > Obama said Trump’s rigged election claim " whining before the game’s even over ". Shockingly he told his cyber election chief to stand down during an attack by the Russians. And Obama knew there were attacks. Clearly, he did not do enough for cyber defense. > > Then we have Hilary Clinton private server and devices, where confidential and top secret information was sent and hacked. > > So if the Russians obtained information, we need to remember how they did it and on whose watch they did it in. > [@El\_Kabong](#): > > So this, if true (and as far as I can tell it isn’t), the Trump administration need do nothing on this issue going forward, is that correct? Just pointing out this Russia tried to influence our election business starts with the Dem’s. It was on their watch. Are these facts too uncomfortable to talk about here? When I see humor replies with zero rebuttals, the answer would be yes. Obama and Clinton are to blame. As for what is Trump is doing with defense, he has increased the budget overall. How much of an increase in cybersecurity is an unknown, I’d have to check to see if such information is available. I think it will be safe to say he’ll never order he security chief to stand down while being hacked. That’s now part of Obama’s legacy. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/27 "2018-07-23T14:36:34Z")
Of course he won’t… he fired his top cybersecurity person in May and has not replaced him. Seriously, do you not know this? > **[White House Eliminates Cybersecurity Coordinator Role (Published 2018)](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/15/technology/white-house-cybersecurity.html)** > > The coordinator organized the defense of government computer networks and critical infrastructure. Can’t order a person to stand down if that person does not exist! ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/28 "2018-07-23T14:40:17Z")
No need to issue a stand down order against an attack if you just continue to state that the attack isn’t happening either, despite everyone with a brain saying it still is. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/29 "2018-07-23T14:41:36Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Of course he won’t… he fired his top cybersecurity person in May and has not replaced him. > > Seriously, do you not know this? > > [https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/15/technology/white-house-cybersecurity.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/15/technology/white-house-cybersecurity.html) > > Can’t order a person to stand down if that person does not exist! You made the mistake of thinking silver lining needs any facts for his selective outrage. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/30 "2018-07-23T15:14:15Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > …Then we have Hilary Clinton private server and devices, where confidential and top secret information was sent and hacked. > … Please provide a cite that her server was hacked. Thank you. Or, provided it in the GQ thread if you’d rather: [https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=859187](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=859187) ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/31 "2018-07-23T15:28:37Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > Actually **JohnT** , _I_ literally [created a thread](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=859006) for **Silver lining** _for this exact topic_, but I guess there were too many facts in it for him to bother wading into. We even had a surprise appearance by **Magiver** expressing the same nonsensical confusion between the hacked DNC servers in 2016 and the non-hacked Clinton email server pre-2013. > > What say you **Silver lining** , are you too chickenshit to actually engage with facts on this topic? The thread is still waiting for you. That is exactly enough of that sort of nonsense, steronz. Anything else of a similar nature, by anyone, will be cause for…unpleasantness. You know where the Pit is. Use it if you must. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/32 "2018-07-23T15:46:12Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > Just pointing out this Russia tried to influence our election business starts with the Dem’s. It was on their watch. Are these facts too uncomfortable to talk about here? When I see humor replies with zero rebuttals, the answer would be yes. Obama and Clinton are to blame. You are right. Obama and Clinton are to blame. So? ---
**Author:** ![rock\_party](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e19b73/32.png) [@rock\_party](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rock_party)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/33 "2018-07-23T15:51:30Z")
Putin told Trump they didn’t meddle and Trump says he believes him. But now it should be known that IF they did meddle, it was that wennie Obama’s fault. Oh and it’s all a witch hunt. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/34 "2018-07-23T16:16:51Z")
And there was No. Collusion. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/35 "2018-07-23T16:25:23Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > Just pointing out this Russia tried to influence our election business starts with the Dem’s. It was on their watch. Are these facts too uncomfortable to talk about here? When I see humor replies with zero rebuttals, the answer would be yes. Obama and Clinton are to blame. > > As for what is Trump is doing with defense, he has increased the budget overall. How much of an increase in cybersecurity is an unknown, I’d have to check to see if such information is available. I think it will be safe to say he’ll never order he security chief to stand down while being hacked. That’s now part of Obama’s legacy. Can you explain Trump’s positions on this issue? He appears to believe two mutually exclusive things: 1. Russia did not interfere in the elections 2. Obama is to blame for Russia interfering in the elections Also, you seem to embrace #2 and deny #1. Can we agree that Trump is wrong on #1? ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/36 "2018-07-23T16:37:15Z")
I think Trump did backpedal and admit that it was Russia. Or someone else. ---
**Author:** ![YamatoTwinkie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/cc9497/32.png) [@YamatoTwinkie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YamatoTwinkie)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/37 "2018-07-23T17:11:20Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > Obama, by the way, was caught on a hot microphone, telling Putin he’ll have more flexibility once the election was over. Ponder what that meant. Can you at least get the names of the two people involved in the “hot mic” incident correct? > **[Microphone Catches a Candid Obama (Published 2012)](https://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/27/us/politics/obama-caught-on-microphone-telling-medvedev-of-flexibility.html)** > > President Obama was caught by a live microphone as he told President Dmitri A. Medvedev of Russia that he would have “more flexibility” to negotiate on missile defense after the November election. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/38 "2018-07-23T17:22:05Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > Just pointing out this Russia tried to influence our election business starts with the Dem’s. It was on their watch. Are these facts too uncomfortable to talk about here? When I see humor replies with zero rebuttals, the answer would be yes. Obama and Clinton are to blame. > > As for what is Trump is doing with defense, he has increased the budget overall. How much of an increase in cybersecurity is an unknown, I’d have to check to see if such information is available. I think it will be safe to say he’ll never order he security chief to stand down while being hacked. That’s now part of Obama’s legacy. Firstly, “stand down” in this case apparently meant “do not launch an all-out cyber war against Russia at this time”, not “do nothing whatsoever about it” as you seem to imply. Cite: > **[Susan Rice reportedly told the White House cyber team to 'knock it off' when...](https://www.businessinsider.com/susan-rice-told-white-house-cyber-team-to-knock-it-off-on-combatting-russian-meddling-2018-3)** > > Susan Rice did not want to "box in" then President Barack Obama if news of Russia's cyberattacks leaked. There may be a reasonable argument that the Obama administration’s response was inadequate. You are welcome to formulate such an argument if you wish. I’ll wait. In the meantime, as mentioned by **JohnT** and others, the position that you are complaining about apparently has been eliminated by the Trump administration. I have to imagine you are rather upset over that action, right? ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/39 "2018-07-23T17:53:50Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > I think Trump did backpedal and admit that it was Russia. Or someone else. At this point, he backpedaled on the backpedal on the backpedal on the backpedal. ---
**Author:** ![Icarus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icarus/32/72_2.png) [@Icarus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icarus)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2018, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385/40 "2018-07-23T18:03:48Z")
So, Silver, honestly, your accusations that “the Russian hack is somehow the Democrats fault” sounds awfully suspiciously a lot like saying the girl was at fault for the attack because she wore a short skirt and didn’t punch and kick her assailant ferociously enough. And we know that doesn’t fly. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-of-the-russian-hack-was-the-democrats-fault/818385.md?page=3)