# How much sympathy do people deserve who go adventuring in dangerous, politically unstable areas? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [September 20, 2010, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343 "2010-09-20T00:16:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Baal\_Houtham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baal_houtham/32/13604_2.png) [@Baal\_Houtham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baal_Houtham)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/61 "2010-09-20T15:59:26Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > [@even\_sven](#): > > > > I’ve known a number of people who sustained serious life-threatening injuries during their service. I don’t think I’ve gone into it much on the Dope, but I got hurt extremely badly during a robbery, and it’s only sheer luck and a matter of inches that my injuries didn’t kill me or leave me permanently paralyzed. > > > > Being a foreigner in an extremely poor area makes you a target for violent crime, and I’ve got some hair-raising stories of narrow escapes and quite a few who did not escape and were injured, raped or killed. > > I’ve probably spent more time in Third World countries than you have, and under hairier circumstances, but thanks for the lecture. It didn’t seem like a lecture to me, it seemed like a **first person account** from someone who had \*\*different experiences than your own. \*\* Your own lack of close calls in foreign countries (even more statistically dangerous ones) in no way cancels out her own close calls. ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/62 "2010-09-20T16:01:04Z")
> [@Hello\_Again](#): > > > [@Rigamarole](#): > > > > I’m not really familiar with this case. Did they trespass or were they there legally? > > They were tresspassing. Fair enough. Still, as the OP framed the question to apply to general situations then I have to stand by my stance of not blaming the victim. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/63 "2010-09-20T16:03:09Z")
I had close calls, but I’ve had close calls in the US too. I didn’t think walking around Watertown in Monrovia was any more inherently dangerous than walking around the hoods in DC or Minneapolis. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/64 "2010-09-20T16:07:22Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Looks like he was killed in a robbery. People get killed in robberies in the US too. [Ok, then how about this?](http://www.peacecorps.gov/index.cfm?shell=resources.media.press.view&news_id=1507) Does that not count because people get sick in the US, too? [How about this?](http://www.peacecorps.gov/index.cfm?shell=resources.media.press.view&news_id=1482) Does that not count because there are accidents in the US, too? [Surely this doesn’t count, for the reasons you have alraedy stated.](http://www.wildjunket.com/2009/03/17/peace-corps-volunteer-catherine-puzey-murdered-in-benin-west-africa/) Murders happen in the US, so we shouldn’t count murders for Peace Corps volunteers. I have a number of how many volunteers have died while on their mission. Would you like to guess what that number is? ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/65 "2010-09-20T16:08:02Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > When’s the last time you ever heard of a Peace Corps volunteer getting kidnapped or killed? Have you ever? A Peace Corps volunteer was shot and killed in Lesotho last week. I don’t know the most recent kidnapping, but a married couple in Cameroon was attacked in their homes while I was there. They came in with AK47s, roughed up the wife, separated the couple and held them at gunpoint in different rooms for what I believe was several hours. The brave couple actually fought (and won) to be allowed to go back to their village to finish up their service, arguing that their whole village shouldn’t suffer for the actions of the thieves. I don’t think stories like this even make international news, but that doesn’t mean they don’t happen. Anyway, yes, it’s not akin to being an aid worker in Sudan or solider in Afghanistan or whatever. But it’s dangerous. I was violently attacked in a robbery and in the course of it they broke three vertebrae, which by sheer luck ended up being low enough that I lived. Then they tried to rape me. I was physically unable to walk for two days, and then I had to complete 30 hour bus/train ride, alone and partially on unpaved roads and in a mind-blowing amount of pain, to get medical attention. You can say whatever you want, but you’re not gonna sell me on the idea that it’s “risk free.” ---
**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/66 "2010-09-20T16:08:51Z")
> [@Rigamarole](#): > > > [@Hello\_Again](#): > > > > They were tresspassing. > > Fair enough. Still, as the OP framed the question to apply to general situations then I have to stand by my stance of not blaming the victim. I’m going to stand by my stance, that if an adventurer breaks international law by violating a nation’s borders, neither they, nor anyone else, should exactly be surprised when they get thrown in the clink. ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/67 "2010-09-20T16:11:29Z")
> [@Hello\_Again](#): > > > [@Rigamarole](#): > > > > Fair enough. Still, as the OP framed the question to apply to general situations then I have to stand by my stance of not blaming the victim. > > I’m going to stand by my stance, that if an adventurer breaks international law by violating a nation’s borders, neither they, nor anyone else, should exactly be surprised when they get thrown in the clink. Well, the OP says: > [@astro](#): > > How much sympathy do people deserve who (effectively) decide to put thier head into the lion’s mouth by hiking or exploring in extremely dangerous areas. Which doesn’t say anything about breaking international law. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/68 "2010-09-20T16:11:53Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > Looks like he was killed in a robbery. People get killed in robberies in the US too. > > [Ok, then how about this?](http://www.peacecorps.gov/index.cfm?shell=resources.media.press.view&news_id=1507) > > Does that not count because people get sick in the US, too? > > [How about this?](http://www.peacecorps.gov/index.cfm?shell=resources.media.press.view&news_id=1482) Does that not count because there are accidents in the US, too? > > [Surely this doesn’t count, for the reasons you have alraedy stated.](http://www.wildjunket.com/2009/03/17/peace-corps-volunteer-catherine-puzey-murdered-in-benin-west-africa/) Murders happen in the US, so we shouldn’t count murders for Peace Corps volunteers. > > I have a number of how many volunteers have died while on their mission. Would you like to guess what that number is? I know people that have died in the US too. Show me anything that indicates life in the Peace Corps is statistically any more dangerous than life in New York City. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Excellent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f19dbf/32.png) [@Mr.Excellent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Excellent)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/69 "2010-09-20T16:29:42Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > [@Ravenman](#): > > > > [Last week.](http://www.newsoxy.com/world/peace-corps-volunteer-killed-14731.html) > > Looks like he was killed in a robbery. People get killed in robberies in the US too. Yes - the death of a PCV would only support the claim that Peace Corps service can be dangerous if the PCV or his killer were a True Scotsman. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/70 "2010-09-20T16:29:57Z")
Shocker. You get factual answers of people in the Peace Corps being murdered, and you move the goalposts. ETA: although I do wonder what kind of murder would count as far as **DtC** is concerned. Would a blowdart tipped with that dangerous frog poison count? How about being cannibalized and getting their heads shrunken? Or how about setting off some bizarre animal trap in some God-forsaken wilderness? Oh, that last one actually happened. So it doesn’t count. [Link.](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22163602/) ---
**Author:** ![pbbth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f9ae1b/32.png) [@pbbth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pbbth)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/71 "2010-09-20T16:44:14Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > [@Ravenman](#): > > > > [Ok, then how about this?](http://www.peacecorps.gov/index.cfm?shell=resources.media.press.view&news_id=1507) > > > > Does that not count because people get sick in the US, too? > > > > [How about this?](http://www.peacecorps.gov/index.cfm?shell=resources.media.press.view&news_id=1482) Does that not count because there are accidents in the US, too? > > > > [Surely this doesn’t count, for the reasons you have alraedy stated.](http://www.wildjunket.com/2009/03/17/peace-corps-volunteer-catherine-puzey-murdered-in-benin-west-africa/) Murders happen in the US, so we shouldn’t count murders for Peace Corps volunteers. > > > > I have a number of how many volunteers have died while on their mission. Would you like to guess what that number is? > > I know people that have died in the US too. Show me anything that indicates life in the Peace Corps is statistically any more dangerous than life in New York City. Life in NYC is actually very safe. NYC didn’t even make the list of [top 25 most dangerous cities in the US in 2007.](http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0921299.html#axzz105WwAuIv)[Or 2006](http://www.infoplease.com/us/statistics/safest-dangerous-cities-2006.html#axzz105XLSxdb). In fact it didn’t even make the list of 100 [least safe cities in the US](http://www.city-data.com/top27.html). We have more crime here than Podunk, Nowhere but we have a population of over 8 million people so that is to be expected. Per capita we have a lot less crime than a good number of places elsewhere in the US and a lot more hospitals, fire departments, police officers, and other resources that help keep us incredibly safe. The Peace Corps is a much more dangerous place to be than NYC. Not that you care, though. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/72 "2010-09-20T16:54:07Z")
I love the Compton comparisons. If one lives in Compton because it is all they can afford, and they are out late because they were working, then I would have sympathy if they get jacked. If one is passing through Compton because they want to shave minutes off of their drive or just to say that they did it, then if their foolishness tempers my sympathy. The more daring/foolish you are, the less my sympathy. The hikers fall into the second bucket. My sympathy is fairly expensive and exclusive and does not get tossed around willy-nilly. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/73 "2010-09-20T17:11:17Z")
Adventuring, little. Aid workers, a lot. As well as admiration and respect. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/74 "2010-09-20T17:15:26Z")
> [@D\_Odds](#): > > I love the Compton comparisons. > > If one lives in Compton because it is all they can afford, and they are out late because they were working, then I would have sympathy if they get jacked. > > If one is passing through Compton because they want to shave minutes off of their drive or just to say that they did it, then if their foolishness tempers my sympathy. The more daring/foolish you are, the less my sympathy. > > The hikers fall into the second bucket. My sympathy is fairly expensive and exclusive and does not get tossed around willy-nilly. My sympathy is free, and I dispense it liberally. The hikers made a stupid move and deserved to be yelled at for a couple of hours. They don’t deserve any jail time at all. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/75 "2010-09-20T17:19:41Z")
> [@even\_sven](#): > > Yeah. I speak several languages, love photography, travel extensively, and am an avid student of both Chinese and west African culture. Occasionally I do travel to politically sensitive areas. Does that make me a spy? No. Insufferable perhaps, but not necessarily a spy. ---
**Author:** ![Maastricht](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e57/32.png) [@Maastricht](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maastricht)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/76 "2010-09-20T17:28:51Z")
Western governements pretty much HAVE to negotiate such adventurers out of jail, eventually. If they don’t they lose face. Even if the public opinion in general is “brought it on themselves”. So a lot of money and/or political leverage is lost on such adventurers. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/77 "2010-09-20T17:36:43Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > > [@even\_sven](#): > > > > Yeah. I speak several languages, love photography, travel extensively, and am an avid student of both Chinese and west African culture. Occasionally I do travel to politically sensitive areas. Does that make me a spy? > > No. Insufferable perhaps, but not necessarily a spy. I’m still laughing. Perfect. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/78 "2010-09-20T17:52:36Z")
> [@pbbth](#): > > The Peace Corps is a much more dangerous place to be than NYC. Cite? ---
**Author:** ![Hawkeyeop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/958977/32.png) [@Hawkeyeop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hawkeyeop)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/79 "2010-09-20T17:57:21Z")
> [@Baracus](#): > > It seems that the hikers told the owner of their hotel, and perhaps others, where they planned on hiking. Broadcasting your plans to the locals, some of whom may be Iranian spies or at least willing to sell out an American tourist, would seem to be beyond stupid for a spy. Perhaps they wanted to make sure their cover story was well publicized ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343/80 "2010-09-20T18:40:48Z")
> [@FuzzyOgre](#): > > Zsofia, the impression I get from the comments is that they would get more sympathy if they really were spies. Well, not from **Der Trihs** , but I guess that’s about par for the course. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-much-sympathy-do-people-deserve-who-go-adventuring-in-dangerous-politically-unstable-areas/554343.md?page=5)