# How offensive is "Merry Christmas" to a Jew? (Bill O'Riley situation) **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 4, 2005, 6:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008 "2005-12-04T06:41:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/21 "2005-12-04T15:42:01Z")
> [@Left Hand of Dorkness](#): > > The religious thing I can see. The political thing is so antiChristian, it boggles the mind. Guys, do you REALLY think Jesus would want you to celebrate His brith with a smugly bullying attitude toward folks of other faiths? > > Daniel Nonsese. Christmas is a time when people of all religeous faiths all over the world celebrate the birth of Jesus by buying each other a bunch of crap no one needs. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/22 "2005-12-04T15:48:35Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Nonsese. Christmas is a time when people of all religeous faiths all over the world celebrate the birth of Jesus by buying each other a bunch of crap no one needs. Well exactly, that’s what I’m saying! THAT’s how Jesus wants you to celebrate his holiday (remember about the rich man and the eye of the needle? Buy useless crap for everyone and drive yourself into the poorhouse). He doesn’t want you to celebrate by being an ass to people, unless you’re starring in a Nativity play. Ironic, isn’t it, that the least stable people are the ones being the asses. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/23 "2005-12-04T15:51:05Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Nonsese. Christmas is a time when people of all religeous faiths all over the world celebrate the birth of Jesus by buying each other a bunch of crap no one needs. Nope. Only christians are celebrating the birth of Jesus. The rest of us are celebrating whatever we _feel_ like celebrating. ---
**Author:** ![Race\_Bannon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Race\_Bannon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Race_Bannon)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/24 "2005-12-04T15:51:24Z")
I appreciate all the replys. I guess I watch too much Fox News. It’s refreshing to come here to the SDMB and find that the world is not going to hell in a secular handbasket. E-Sabbath - good one about the phone sex! ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/25 "2005-12-04T15:54:40Z")
I guess how offensive it is to say “Merry Christmas” to a Jewish person depends on the tone and the intent (and O’Reilly’s tone and intent was clearly smug and insulting). I think the real question is why people like O’Reilly think it’s offensive to say “Happy Holidays” to a Christian. That’s what baffles me. He thinks that non-Christians have some sort of moral obligation to give him a sectarian greeting or else he’s being injured. Will there ever be a cure for CPC? At least a vaccine? ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/26 "2005-12-04T16:22:32Z")
> [@Kalhoun](#): > > Christmas: It’s not just for christians anymore! > > This is the lamest battle I’ve seen so far. Saying “Merry Christmas” in December is like saying “How are you?” to a co-worker. It’s a standardized greeting. You don’t really expect an answer other than “you too” or “fine”. If someone knows that I’m Jewish, and says Merry Christmas to me even after being told that I don’t celebrate Christmas, I would be offended. It’s a simple matter of courtesy. Merry Christmas is not a standard greeting. While many people view Christmas as a purely secular holiday, I don’t. Too me, not matter how many secular trappings, it’s Christian. I answer “Thanks, but I’m Jewish” and would expect them to remember that for next time. ---
**Author:** ![MsRobyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/90ced4/32.png) [@MsRobyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsRobyn)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/27 "2005-12-04T16:33:26Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Nonsese. Christmas is a time when people of all religeous faiths all over the world celebrate the birth of Jesus by buying each other a bunch of crap no one needs. Uh, no. This nice Jewish girl ignores the birth of Jesus and is scheduled to work that day. I’m not planning to buy anyone any crap, but when I do, it’s wrapped in Hanukkah paper. Personally, if someone is unaware of my religion and wishes me a merry Christmas, I just smile and say “thanks”, and if I know the person, gently tell them I’m Jewish. Otherwise, I just smile and say “thanks” and go about my day. On the other hand, when it’s some jerk like O’Reilly being a jerk, I just smile, say “thanks” and go about my day, but with a much lower opinion of the jerk. It’s one day a year, folks. I’m not going to get my panties in a bunch over it. I’m just going to go to work and spend the rest of the day with the TV off and maybe read a good book. Robin ---
**Author:** ![Kyla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/eada6e/32.png) [@Kyla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyla)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/28 "2005-12-04T16:46:32Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > If someone knows that I’m Jewish, and says Merry Christmas to me even after being told that I don’t celebrate Christmas, I would be offended. It’s a simple matter of courtesy. > > Merry Christmas is not a standard greeting. While many people view Christmas as a purely secular holiday, I don’t. Too me, not matter how many secular trappings, it’s Christian. I answer “Thanks, but I’m Jewish” and would expect them to remember that for next time. I agree with this entirely. Yesterday, a couple offered me a ride home while I was waiting at the bus stop. I refused politely, and they wished me a Merry Christmas and drove off. Not offensive in the slightest. Obviously, they were only being friendly. OTOH, I once had a coworker - who knew I was Jewish - bring me a CD of Christmas music to play on my computer to get into “the spirit of the season”. When I reminded her that I don’t celebrate Christmas, she called me a grinch and stomped off. Offensive and annoying. Most of my friends celebrate Christmas in a standard pagan manner, and I always enjoy their Christmas parties. I like parties and gift exchanges as much as anyone, I’m pretty sure only the most uptight people would avoid such things on principle. ---
**Author:** ![MLS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/919ad9/32.png) [@MLS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MLS)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/29 "2005-12-04T16:56:30Z")
I’m just thankful that as we near the blessed winter solstice, the forms and trappings of the real Old Time Religion (holly, mistletoe, candles, decorated trees, celebrations, gifts) have been retained. I don’t care if others call it “Christmas.” Except for the creche thing, most everything else is pagan anyhow. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/30 "2005-12-04T18:17:56Z")
I think, like everything, it would depend on who was saying and who it was being addressed to. I know a Jewish woman who probably would be offended if someone said “Merry Christmas”. As a teacher in the public school system, she made a big stink about the chorus kids singing about Jesus during the Holiday Concert and got them to change the program. Once, when I was a student in her class, another kid cried out “Jesus!” when someone hit him, and she retorted, quite aggressively: “Jesus isn’t here!” She’s also very devout Jew and very active in her community. But the other Jewish people I know aren’t that religious and would probably only be merely annoyed. ---
**Author:** ![alaricthegoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4bbf92/32.png) [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/31 "2005-12-04T22:22:22Z")
Jesus and I are cousins and correspond frequently. I am in a position to share a snippet of a note he sent me in response to a birthdy card. I mentioned O’Reilley, and he responded thusly: “Oy, What a goyishe kopf. Not even a schmuck, just a putz. He thinks I’m a REPUBLICAN??? As if…O’Reilly ain’t part of my \*poosse and he’s lucky I’m a nicer guy than he is or I’d give him a schtuck in hertz that he wouldn’t forget…” (He’s all about hiphop these days.) Personally, you want to wish my cousin a happy birthday?–knock yourself out. ---
**Author:** ![Wolfian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/7ea924/32.png) [@Wolfian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wolfian)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/32 "2005-12-04T22:51:30Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Nonsese. Christmas is a time when people of all religeous faiths all over the world celebrate the birth of Jesus by buying each other a bunch of crap no one needs. Down guys. **msmith537** is quoting a Bart Simpsonism, a damn funny one at that. BTW, whoosh. ---
**Author:** ![Tapioca\_Dextrin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Tapioca\_Dextrin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tapioca_Dextrin)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/33 "2005-12-04T22:57:53Z")
FWIW, I have Muslim and Hindu friends who celebrate Christmas. No big deal for them. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/34 "2005-12-04T23:00:24Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > Well, as a Christian, I would be highly insulted if Bill wished me a Merry Christmas because, despite all his attacks on secularism, I have never seen any indication that he believes in anything. You just said it, and a whole lot more politely than I would have. Side trivia - O’Reilly’s own Christmas cards said “Happy Holidays” until a Fox staffer noticed the disconnect between the vomit Billy O has been spewing, and the cards he was planning to send out. O’Reilly is a pathetic little man, whose only purpose is to attack other people. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/35 "2005-12-04T23:06:55Z")
> [@Wolfian](#): > > Down guys. **msmith537** is quoting a Bart Simpsonism, a damn funny one at that. > > BTW, whoosh. [Cartman]O holy night when I get lots of presents[/Cartman] 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Tapioca\_Dextrin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Tapioca\_Dextrin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tapioca_Dextrin)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/36 "2005-12-04T23:28:21Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > O’Reilly is a pathetic little man, whose only purpose is to attack other people. Much more appropriate than Happy Holidays 😃 ---
**Author:** ![justwannano](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7ab992/32.png) [@justwannano](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/justwannano)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/37 "2005-12-04T23:42:29Z")
I’m trying to imagine how it could be offensive to anyone. Its a celebration of a birthday. I believe it is common knowlege that Jesus Christ did live. Of all the people on earth his life has had the greatest effect. Weather or not you believe he was God doesn’t mean you can’t celebrate his birthday. Hell we celebrate Washingtons birthday.Nobody I’ve heard of has objected to that. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/38 "2005-12-04T23:45:41Z")
> [@justwannano](#): > > Of all the people on earth his life has had the greatest effect. That is certainly debatable. > [@justwannano](#): > > Weather or not you believe he was God doesn’t mean you can’t celebrate his birthday. Why on earth would you celebrate his birthday, though? He was just another Jewish teacher, from my point of view. > [@justwannano](#): > > Hell we celebrate Washingtons birthday.Nobody I’ve heard of has objected to that. Was George Washington the founder of any religions that I’ve missed? ---
**Author:** ![Apos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Apos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apos)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/39 "2005-12-04T23:47:46Z")
Because that’s what Christmas is all about right? Being a dick, demanding that everyone else act like you want them to, and so on. But then, that’s the double standard for religious people. They can tell unbelievers that they are deeply unhappy, bitter, Nazis, baby-killers, evil, and so on. This can be a central part of their entire belief system. But the minute anyone points out that they are being dicks and that trying to shove their dickery in my face is rude, we get howling cries of outrage that anyone would dare to criticize religion, which demands 100% respect no matter how out of line and assholish it gets. If you want respect for your beliefs, then DON’T BE A DICK and certainly don’t tell me that your beliefs are the core motivator and inspiraction for ALL YOUR DICKERY. ---
**Author:** ![AskNott](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asknott/32/5790_2.png) [@AskNott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AskNott)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008/40 "2005-12-04T23:56:46Z")
There is a whole cloud of angry fiction out there among columnists, talkshow growfers, websites, and mass e-mails about the alleged ACLU attacks on saying Merry Christmas, In God We Trust, and any mention of God in our founding documents. It ain’t true, folks. They’ve set up a strawman and attacked it. Here’s a cite. [http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051204/OPINION01/512040380&SearchID=73228467015217](http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051204/OPINION01/512040380&SearchID=73228467015217) > [@](#): > > We get this type of correspondence a lot, mostly in reaction to a well-organized attempt by extremist groups to demonize the ACLU, crush religious diversity and make a few bucks in the process. Sadly, this self-interested effort is being promoted in the guise of defending Christmas. > > For example, the Alliance Defense Fund celebrates the season with an “It’s OK to say Merry Christmas” campaign, implying that the ACLU has challenged such holiday greetings. (As part of the effort, you can get a pamphlet and two Christmas pins for $29.) > > The Web site, WorldNetDaily, touts a book claiming “a thorough and virulent anti-Christmas campaign is being waged today by liberal activists and ACLU fanatics.” The site’s magazine has suggested there will be ACLU efforts to remove “In God We Trust” from U.S. currency, fire military chaplains and expunge all references to God in America’s founding documents. (Learn more for just $19.95 . . . ) O’Reilly is an enthusiastic relay man for this propaganda network. He doesn’t care if he lies, he just passes on the daily talking points. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-offensive-is-merry-christmas-to-a-jew-bill-oriley-situation/334008.md?page=3)