# How often do people try to convert you to their religion? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [April 25, 2023, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176 "2023-04-25T19:24:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 16
**Author:** ![Chingon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chingon/32/17645_2.png) [@Chingon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chingon)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2023, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/301 "2023-12-23T19:26:03Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > I think they’re mostly doing some kind of virtue signalling superiority thing Oh there’s some virtue signalling all right, but I don’t think you’ve correctly identified the source ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2023, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/302 "2023-12-23T19:27:12Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > > [@puzzlegal](#): > > > > And for that matter, no one has inserted atheist slogans into the national anthem or plastered them on the currency. > > I think you mean pledge. I’ve never heard that anyone added god to the Star Spangled Banner. > Especially ironic since the person who wrote the Pledge was a minister, who deliberately kept God out of it. Oops, yeah. Mea culpa. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2023, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/303 "2023-12-23T19:31:20Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > I’ve never heard that anyone added god to the Star Spangled Banner. Added, no. In there from the beginning, yes. It’s just that almost nobody sings all the verses. Verse 4: > O thus be it ever when freemen shall stand > Between their lov’d home and the war’s desolation! > Blest with vict’ry and peace may the heav’n rescued land > Praise the power that hath made and preserv’d us a nation! > Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just, > And this be our motto - “In God is our trust,” > And the star-spangled banner in triumph shall wave > O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave! ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2023, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/304 "2023-12-23T19:33:40Z")
> [@thorny\_locust](#): > > True. I meant religion specifically is a thing not all humans do, not that acting arationally is. Got it. I agree. I think spirituality must be somewhat genetic, since my family does not have it at all. > [@thorny\_locust](#): > > Added, no. In there from the beginning, yes. It’s just that almost nobody sings all the verses. > > Verse 4: Isaac Asimov did. He used his super memory to memorize all the verses, and he told us he did it so that when some right winger called him a Communist, he could challeng them to an anthem singing contest. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2023, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/305 "2023-12-23T19:45:02Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > > [@thorny\_locust](#): > > > > True. I meant religion specifically is a thing not all humans do, not that acting arationally is. > > Got it. I agree. I think spirituality must be somewhat genetic, since my family does not have it at all. I think so too. My friend the Lubuvitcher grew up as an ordinary conservative Jew. One of his sisters became an evangelical atheist and another close relative converted to Christianity and became a nun or something. That’s got to be a lot more interest in the spiritual than an average family displays. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2023, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/306 "2023-12-23T20:15:27Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > I’ve never had a creationist yet admit they were wrong - or even respond with more evidence they were right. And it usually winds up with them telling me that I’ll find out when I’m dead, with the implication God will toss me into hell. If I had grown up with hell that could be a problem, but since I was Jewish it has no impact. As the saying goes, “You can’t reason a man out of a position he didn’t reason himself into.” I grew up believing in hell, and had some very extreme religious experiences from a young age - well outside the mainstream Christian experience. Somehow when I was about twelve an adult convinced me to try exorcising a demon from her daughter by laying on hands and speaking in tongues, which I did of course, not really understanding what the hell was going on. My friend was having some kind of fit, and I didn’t realize until _years_ later, when I actually had one myself, that she was having a grand mal seizure. I not only believed in hell, I felt hunted by demons, and occasionally I still get worried about going to hell, but I am usually able to keep myself in check by reminding myself that I have an anxiety disorder and a vivid imagination. Compare this experience to some atheists I know, like my uncle in law and his sisters who were raised atheist. They said the first time they encountered the idea of Jesus they were like, “You believe _what_? LOL.” And beyond that, they never really gave it much thought. In this sense, I agree that we can’t really assume atheists all have the same experience or the same reasons for their conclusions. There is no one atheist mindset. The story of how I came to become an atheist is a really complicated one. For a lot of people it was as simple as having always been one. ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2023, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/307 "2023-12-23T20:50:56Z")
You got there first. I was coming in for that. I knew it without looking it up as I can give all four verses from memory. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2023, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/308 "2023-12-23T20:59:09Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > It must be _awful_ being on the receiving end for a change. Show me where I, as an agnostic, has even tried to convert anyone to my religion. > [@Voyager](#): > > Yet people think that Dawkins or Harris having the nerve to publish a book on atheism as some sort of noisy bit of aggression against Christianity Not really, I mean unless they call people of Faith idiots, fools, etc. > [@Voyager](#): > > No atheist has ever come to my door to try to convert me. I see no atheist signs on buildings, like the signs I walk past on churches. No, they just bully and ridicule on message boards, etc. There are different ways of proselytizing. > [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > For my part, I don’t think the atheist jerks are trying to convert anyone, I think they’re mostly doing some kind of virtue signalling superiority thing. I’m sure some atheist at some point has tried to talk Christians out of their beliefs, but I see it more as an in-group phenomenon, a “Can you believe what other people believe?” sort of sneering. Online, it’s more like bullying. I see your point, and it may be better than the point I am trying to make. Bullying and virtue signaling, not attempted conversion? Hmmm. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2023, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/309 "2023-12-23T22:09:20Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Got it. I agree. I think spirituality must be somewhat genetic, since my family does not have it at all. My family’s all over the place. Some atheists, some believers; some practice, some don’t. I don’t think we’ve got any proselytizers, though I can’t be sure, as the family’s very scattered and I don’t know all the cousins. > [@Baker](#): > > You got there first. I was coming in for that. I knew it without looking it up as I can give all four verses from memory. I had to look it up; all I had was a vague sense of ‘wait a minute, I think that is in there somewhere.’ (Which probably makes it even more annoying that I got in first!) ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2023, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/310 "2023-12-23T22:09:32Z")
I think the last time was around 2009. I had two employees from competing evangelical churches who were both deeply concerned for my immortal soul. I made clear that I would be concerned for their employment status if I caught them proselytizing in the office again. Can’t think of another incident off-hand. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2023, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/311 "2023-12-24T04:19:51Z")
It’s been a long day. Yes, as a Jew I can saw (now that I know the word) Judaism is orthopraxic. Think of the ten commandments (we can forget about the other six hundred and three for now). ‘Thou shall not covet’ is the only one I can think of that concerns thought and belief rather than taking or refraining from specific action. Re Ceremonial Deism It really really pisses me off. I want a moral government certainly. BUT, I want one based largely on reason and constrained by laws, checks and balances. If it’s meaningless and just ceremonial, change G-d to Hashem or Allah or Odin. I like my church and state separated- just like meat and dairy. Re Atheism To an atheist, a believer is crazy. To a believer, an atheist is blind and deaf. The important thing is to be nice to each other. I’ve made my variant of Pascal’s wager. It’s worked out for me so far. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2023, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/312 "2023-12-24T05:06:59Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > > [@Voyager](#): > > > > Yet people think that Dawkins or Harris having the nerve to publish a book on atheism as some sort of noisy bit of aggression against Christianity > > Not really, I mean unless they call people of Faith idiots, fools, etc. Have you read the “left behind” books? They call atheists evil. Not “evil by omission” or anything like that, active practitioners of evil, just hoping to trip up Christians, or at least hurt them. The abortionist who is really upset she doesn’t have any babies to kill is one of the most over-the-top characters I’ve ever seen. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2023, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/313 "2023-12-24T05:37:18Z")
I don’t like superior assholes of any stripe. But I’m really embarrassed when they share some sort of identifying characteristic with me. I consider myself a spiritual person, though I lack a belief in the supernatural. I guess I mean spiritual in the sense of always looking for meaning and reflecting often on how I make sense of the world. And always seeking that something bigger to connect to. With meditation, it’s good enough for me that it works. I don’t need to ascribe better well-being to a mystical source. But I also enjoy the ritual of it all. I light a candle, I ring a bell, I think about the tradition that came before me. I used to subscribe to a newsletter called Free Will astrology. I don’t believe in astrology at all, but that particular author always provided something interesting to reflect on. It’s rare that I meet other people like this. Surely I meet other people who are as interested in spiritual practice as I am, but they usually believe in some kind of mysticism. My experience with Christianity and slide into atheism totally rocked my foundation, and I’m not interested in having that experience again. I’d rather just live with uncertainty than be consumed by that much belief in anything ever again. So I don’t really have anything to proselytize about. I find it a little bit reassuring to learn that there are conceptualizations of religion that don’t require faith. Like maybe I’m not alone in that. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2023, 7:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/314 "2023-12-24T07:10:40Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > Have you read the “left behind” books? I am getting old, my friend, I am not about to risk what brain cells I have left on that crappy dreck. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2023, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/315 "2023-12-24T11:05:46Z")
They sold a lot better than dawkins. > **[Left Behind](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left_Behind)** > > Left Behind is a multimedia franchise of apocalyptic fiction written by Tim LaHaye and Jerry B. Jenkins, released by Tyndale House Publishers from 1995 to 2007. > The bestselling premillennial novel(s) are eschatological narratives inspired by the Book of Revelation in the Bible. The storyline focuses on a seven-year conflict between the Tribulation Force, an underground network of converts, and the New World Order-esque Global Community and its leader, Nicolae Carpathia, who is also the Antichr... > In 2016, several books in the series were [bestsellers](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bestseller) and 65 million copies were sold in various languages.[[10]](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left_Behind#cite_note-10) > **[Richard Dawkins to give away copies of The God Delusion in Islamic countries](https://www.theguardian.com/books/2018/mar/20/richard-dawkins-to-give-away-copies-of-the-god-delusion-in-islamic-countries)** > > Author and the Centre for Inquiry planning free ebook versions of his books in Arabic, Urdu, Farsi and Indonesian following a ‘stirring towards atheism’ in some Islamic countries > The scientist and atheist said he was “greatly encouraged” to learn that the unofficial Arabic pdf of the book had been downloaded 13m times. Dawkins writes in The God Delusion about his wish that the “open-minded people” who read it will “break free of the vice of religion altogether”. **It has sold 3.3m copies worldwide since it was published in 2006** – far fewer than the number of Arabic copies that Dawkins believes to have been downloaded illegally. (Bolding mine) And yet, somehow, the existence of dawkins makes Christians “under attack”, but the wild success of books like “left behind” (and that’s just a poplar one that came to mind) is ho hum. I’ve been to religious services where the preacher tells his flock that atheists are bad. It’s everywhere. But if atheists moan and bitch about that, they are in the wrong, for putting down religion. I don’t care what you believe, your posts are carrying water for the worst kind of atheist-bashing. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2023, 11:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/316 "2023-12-24T11:17:57Z")
And, fwiw, i am not opposed to religion. I practice one, and i believe religion serves a valuable role in the lives of many. I think that most of the evil perpetrated in the name of religion would have been perpetrated with some other excuse if those people hadn’t happened to be religious. But “atheists are okay, so long as they shut up and never mention it” is problematic. Especially to anyone who lives in America, where we are all confronted by expressions of Christianity every day. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2023, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/317 "2023-12-24T16:47:18Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > But “atheists are okay, so long as they shut up and never mention it” is problematic. Especially to anyone who lives in America, where we are all confronted by expressions of Christianity every day. Ayup. And, nevertheless, “shut up and never mention it” is for the most part what I do. It’s so much easier, on most occasions, if I have to say something, to say “I’m a non-practicing Jew”. While this does sometimes cause people to try to convert me, it doesn’t generally seem to occur to them to ask “why aren’t you practicing?” And it’s true enough; just incomplete. – I agree that I could practice Judaism and be an atheist; but it would be pretty awkward, considering among other things that I manage and sell at a Saturday morning market. – I’m an agnostic about some of the Small Gods (spirits of particular places) and also about the possibility of the universe as a whole being in some sense an intelligent being, though it wouldn’t be in any sense we can comprehend. But neither of those is remotely like what most people mean when they say ‘do you believe in God?’ I’m entirely atheist about those gods. – I will occasionally give a close friend the whole explanation. ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2023, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/318 "2023-12-24T17:33:48Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > I’ve never heard an atheist deny that we are animals, Not per se, but it is ubiquitous to arrogate many qualities or talents human possess to humans alone, although it is ever more obvious there aren’t very many that we don’t share with _some_ animals, and many we share with all mammals, at least. Atheists tend to come at it from a “science and progress” perspective and Christians from a “God put the world here to be our footstool” belief. Same shit though. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2023, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/319 "2023-12-24T17:49:14Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > They sold a lot better than dawkins. No one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American public. My wife started the first one, but abandoned it not because of theology but because the writing was so bad. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2023, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176/320 "2023-12-24T17:54:46Z")
> [@Ulfreida](#): > > Not per se, but it is ubiquitous to arrogate many qualities or talents human possess to humans alone, although it is ever more obvious there aren’t very many that we don’t share with _some_ animals, and many we share with all mammals, at least. Atheists tend to come at it from a “science and progress” perspective and Christians from a “God put the world here to be our footstool” belief. Same shit though. Come at what? I’ve seen far more atheists cite the research showing that animals exhibit traits such as fairness than theists - at least during relgious discussions. (I have no idea about the religious breakdown of scientists doing the work.) Special creation implies a solid break between us and the other animals, evolution does not. I’d guess that the majority (I hope) of theists who accept evolution would have similar opinions about this as atheists. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176.md?page=15) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-often-do-people-try-to-convert-you-to-their-religion/983176.md?page=17)