These conspiracy theories you’ve just gish galloped (and I feel entirely fair characterizing what you’ve posted as conspiracy theories) didn’t come out of nowhere.
I almost feel the need to thank-you for crossing over the partisan-divide for a minute to let us know what is happening over the over-side of the bubble.
To everyone on this side of the “echo-chamber”: this is what they are thinking. This is what they are saying, this is the narrative that is being spread.
This is where the battle-lines have been drawn. It isn’t just “left-vs-right”. Its something else entirely. And its really fucking scary.
No, I’d probably be right where I am today wrt Kav and Ford. I don’t think my arguments or thoughts are motivated by either party. I might, I admit, be arguing slightly different if the boards thoughts were different, as I generally enjoy arguing against the mainstream. I like playing devils advocate because, frankly, it helps me sharpen my arguments for when I’m arguing with friends and family, some of who are very conservative. I figure if folks here can shred the arguments I make then I can crib their stuff and look brilliant at home.
In this specific case, I’d still be saying that I think Ford is basically telling the truth…she really believes she was assaulted. Whether she was or not, I couldn’t say. My WAG is she was, but the mind is a funny thing, and memory is as well. And we are talking about a 15 year old who was also drinking when this all went down 37 years ago. But I’d think that whoever the Republican was who was sitting on the info and waited to spring it at the last minute was slimy, and I’d think that the progressive Kav, if he did the same sort of antics would be as unsuited as I think this Kav is, based on those antics. I’d probably be a bit more biased in the favor of a progressive candidate, depending on where the guy stood on some things…certainly I wouldn’t have the same skin crawling part that I do with a religious conservative. But, generally I think I’d be where I’m at, regardless.
How partisan am I? Very. I’m militantly independent and moderate and think that both Republicans and Democrats are shitty, as I do left and right wingers. I think Republicans are definitely MORE shitty, and conservatives have lost their minds and their way and that both Republicans and conservatives have been completely hijacked by Trump and the tea party nutters. But I’m not that impressed by the Dems either with their infighting and left wing nuttery, and their magical ability to snatch defeat from the slavering jaws of victory. I’m REALLY pissed at all of the left wingers who took their marbles and stayed home because their buddy Bernie didn’t get the nod, and who wouldn’t hold their nose and vote for Clinton…more pissed at them than at the clueless blue collar rubes snowed by Trump who voted for him.
I care, but I can’t enlighten you, because you appear to have no internal way to sift complete insane wacko shit from real probabilities. Without this, you are going to be lost forever.
Ford because she has nothing to gain from coming forward, she talked about this long before Kavanaugh was being nominated, and Kavanaugh has multiple accusations. Also he is trying to avoid a legit FBI investigation while his accusers are calling for one.
When Al Franken got his accusation, I said ‘lets see what the investigation finds’ when the first accusation came out. I figured that if there was only one accusation, it may be false. But when other women came forward I realized it was likely true. I regret that he had to step down, and without him Sessions wouldn’t have recused himself (and we wouldn’t have Mueller in charge of the investigation). But I didn’t pretend Franken’s accusers were just making it up.
See point 2.
See point 2.
Again, the issue comes down to authoritarianism. Most people who score high in the personality trait of authoritarianism have moved to the GOP. Authoritarians tend to be very morally dubious and only concerned with power and fear of outsiders. The left does not have a massive subgroup of authoritarians in it. So as a whole we won’t react the same way.
I believe Trump won 86% of white voters who score high in authoritarianism.
Ford told her husband and therapist back in 2012, possibly other people.
At least 2 other women have come forward.
Mark Judge refuses to talk about these things.
The women are pushing for FBI investigations, Kavanaugh is not.
EDIT: How do you feel about the accusations of sex crimes against Roy Moore or Donald Trump? Are they real?
Waitaminute - Kavanaugh isn’t the “last best hope” of anything! The senate could drop him in a heartbeat and pick from anyone on a long list of other Federalist Institute candidates and miss this whole insane hubbub. Instead, they’re insisting on dragging this out, because… What makes Kavanaugh so uniquely desireable?
Well Ford is neither accused of sexual assault nor being interviewed for a seat on the Supreme Court nor has she made any claims about her relationship with alcohol. It’s telling of context, not bias.
What, you mean if the left-wing media were as shamelessly propagandist as Fox, Breitbart, and co? If the democratic party was run by a self-aggrandizing idiot who has no fucking clue what he’s doing? I mean, I’d probably change my political affiliation based on that…
Kavanaugh’s yearbook is relevant because it puts the lie to claims he made under oath in court. It’s relevant because it exposes him as a liar.
I guess you’re not aware that Ford first brought her concerns forward before Kavanaugh was nominated, back when she heard he was shortlisted on a list with 25 other nominees.
Man you’re the guy who said something awful enough to alienate Quartz, who is definitely on your side on this one. It’s not our fault this thread went to shit.
I would not change my position in any way if Kavanaugh were a liberal nominee. I am being 100% fair-minded and non-partisan. Just like everyone else in the thread.
It’s not that I necessarily buy into every single policy of the Democrats, it’s just that I think the Republicans as currently constituted are a danger to the country and should not be in power. Not sure how partisan that makes me.
Re: the OP’s hypothetical, I believe I would consider a Democrat with Kavanaugh’s baggage to be unsuitable for the position of Supreme Court Justice, whether or not Shodan happens to think I’m lying.
Well, I’d like to think this wasn’t about partisanship, and more about presumption of innocence when accused of a crime. At this point, I believe something might have happened to Ford, but I’m not going to say Kavanaugh is guilty because there is zero contemporary corroboration with her story, and it’s hella old. Democrats have already dismissed the allegations about Ellison for no corroboration, so why should Kavanaugh be any different?
I’m not going to say what I would do in a hypothetical. What I will say, is that when Bill Clinton said “I did not have sexual relations with that woman, Ms. Lewinsky”, I believed him until there was incontrovertible evidence otherwise. And I was more conservative back then than I am now.
This is the most important thing, ultimately. Barring some unexpected surprise from the FBI investigation, there’s no corroborating evidence to the accusations, and they should be treated as meaningless.
Which leads to a rather big problem. Kavanaugh is politically unsuitable to be a judge, due to his extreme positions, and possibly temperamentally unsuited as well - although deciding that on the basis of his response to false accusations of serious crimes is a bit flimsy. However, there’s no good choice but to confirm him now, otherwise the Senate will show that everyone is vulnerable to false accusations, and any appointment will be stopped by them.
Really, the Democrats should have attempted to verify these accusations before releasing them. Sadly, that’s not what people on the left want these days - any accusation of sexual misconduct counts as proof.
What incredible bullshit. Democrats have called for a full investigation regarding the accusations against Ellison, and haven’t dismissed anything at all. And, unlike Kavanaugh, Ellison himself has called for an investigation.
As a non-partisan (not a member of a political party, did not vote for Trump or Hillary), I find the woman’s accusations credible.
Kavanaugh also comes across as an entitled douchebag.
That said, the D’s are also taking full advantage of this situation and they are certainly not helping matters by their behavior (Booker I’m looking at you).
Why is Kavanaugh so personally important to the R’s? Why can’t they just nominate the next guy on the list who doesn’t have a cloud hanging over him? I don’t get it at all.
Let me stop you right there. Kavanaugh is not being tried in a criminal court, so there is no presumption of innocence. He has no due process rights, and he does not have a right to the job of Supreme Court Justice.
Well, for one, a “do-over” at this point definitely is not a guaranteed nomination, definitely not by November, and maybe not even January. And who’s to say some cloud isn’t going to be cast over the next guy or gal? Any nom is going to the the fight of their lives out of democrats given the shift of the court. We’ve already seen that uncorroborated accusations == cloud over your head.
This is the theory as I’ve heard it. Keep in mind it is only a theory.
Justice Anthony Kennedy has a son who worked at Deutsche bank, and loaned a billion dollars to Donald Trump. This money may have been laundered from Russia.
Kavanaugh is very partisan and feels a (republican) president should not be indicted or have to answer for crimes committed in office.
Kennedy and Trump made an agreement that if Kennedy steps down and Kavanaugh takes over, if any of Trump’s crimes come to the supreme court the SCOTUS will have a new justice who will always side with the administration. Also it is possible Kennedy would have to recuse himself due to his son’s potential crimes while Kavanaugh will not.
So basically both Kennedy and Trump wanted Kavanaugh because they knew Kavanaugh would help cover up Trump and Kennedy’s son’s crimes. McConnell didn’t want Kavanaugh due to all the skeletons in his closet but he was overruled.
That is the theory I’ve heard. No idea how true it is.
