# How prestigious is the US News college rankings? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [September 9, 2019, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940 "2019-09-09T17:36:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/1 "2019-09-09T17:36:37Z")
I didn’t even know that US News and World report still existed. But, I’m seeing a lot of chatter on social media about their college rankings which came out today. My own university, FSU, came in 18th for public schools and 57th overall in national universities. > **[Best Colleges Rankings and Lists](https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings)** > > See the rankings for best national universities, liberal arts colleges, business programs and engineering programs at US News. Back in the day, I do remember a print edition of the best colleges and it probably was US News and World Report. From spending some time reading though their site, it does appear to use a methodology and isn’t just clickbait. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/2 "2019-09-09T17:42:39Z")
I’ve heard it’s a really big deal among colleges. So much so that colleges now work on gaming the system to push their ratings up. There are over five thousand colleges in the United States. The ones in the middle of the pack need to do something to stand out. ---
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/3 "2019-09-09T17:49:48Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > I’ve heard it’s a really big deal among colleges. So much so that colleges now work on gaming the system to push their ratings up. > > There are over five thousand colleges in the United States. The ones in the middle of the pack need to do something to stand out. I can absolutely say that Florida State University is all over social media today about the rankings. And not just the official FSU feed, but the alumni groups and the individual colleges that make up FSU. ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/4 "2019-09-09T20:43:09Z")
Many schools (including higher ranked colleges) feel that these rankings mismeasure and misrepresent schools’ attributes, and don’t actively participate anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Hermitian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hermitian/32/470_2.png) [@Hermitian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hermitian)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/5 "2019-09-09T20:44:12Z")
So not only do our universities need prestige, but the organizations ranking the prestige of our universities need prestige? Where will it end with you guys?! ---
**Author:** ![Thing\_Fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@Thing\_Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thing_Fish)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/6 "2019-09-09T20:45:05Z")
It’s prestige all the way down. ---
**Author:** ![peccavi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peccavi/32/388_2.png) [@peccavi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peccavi)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/7 "2019-09-09T21:01:50Z")
My answer is a firm “it depends”. I know it is one of the best known, but it really only ranks U.S. Universities amongst themselves. I think this is fine for someone in the U.S. trying to sort through options on where to attend. However, I would be careful using this ranking for other purposes. A few years ago, I was asked to look into which universities in some specific countries (including both first world and developing nations) my company should consider becoming involved with (i.e. looking for opportunities for funding and collaboration) if we were going to start to do business in those countries. That’s when I discovered there are a lot of sources for such rankings ([Wikipedia page](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/College_and_university_rankings)). I settled on the Times Higher Education and QS rankings as the most detailed (I was interested in getting results for specific scientific and engineering disciplines) and least biased. I would still recommend these for non-students who want to assess where the best minds in the world are. When I performed my study, U.S. News and World Report global rankings were not yet a thing, so I didn’t consider these at that time. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/8 "2019-09-09T21:20:02Z")
What’s the quote? A celebrity is a person who is known for his well-knownness. _USN&WR_ is like that. Well known for being well known. And like with celebrities, just as respected. Not. Just checked some and the “regional” college rankings are full of WtF stuff. People are definitely gaming the system here. One place I was a prof at had unusually high rankings. Us faculty as well as the students were baffled. (As were the companies that recruited our students. The students were considered 2nd tier.) It is nowhere near that good. It is night and day vs. the comparable places in the rankings. The administrators loved these rankings, if they were good really good. Otherwise they ignored them. From a prospective student’s point of view, what really matters is the ranking of the departments you are considering majoring in by the societies for those areas. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/9 "2019-09-09T21:24:21Z")
I’m not sure if prestigious is the right word. Universities tend to be highly competitive and take these rankings seriously. They certainly try to game rankings by changing resources to whatever is being weighed. This makes the rankings less useful, but most people looking at them don’t know this. If they influence people making a decision, then the universities care about them. But that doesn’t make them all that accurate since weights are arbitrary. For example, one ranking measured number of research faculty, but counted anyone working more than 20% full time as one position. Suddenly, some universities hired lots of part time researches working a 20% full time equivalent instead of fewer full time positions. It looked a lot better, ranked higher, and meant little. Many universities, especially with electronic applications, encourage people who stand essentially no chance of getting in to apply. By rejecting more applicants, this makes the university seem more competitive and popular. But ten years ago, they wouldn’t have bothered inviting people with lower marks to apply. So, many rankings should be taken with plenty of salt. Some are probably better than others. I don’t know what US News specifically measures. This doesn’t mean rankings are completely useless or wrong, but there are arbitrary components and many other factors should affect decisions. ---
**Author:** ![carrps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carrps/32/2957_2.png) [@carrps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrps)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/10 "2019-09-09T21:32:35Z")
Woo Hoo, we’re number 1!!! in the Public school listings (#20 nationally). It’s a good school, and it was good when I was there. It just seems weird, because I kind of fell into going there. Fortunately, it didn’t cost $13K (in-state) tuition when I went. UCLA, btw. ---
**Author:** ![CairoCarol](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cairocarol/32/3825_2.png) [@CairoCarol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CairoCarol)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2019, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/11 "2019-09-09T23:23:34Z")
Personally, I heap blame on US News & World Report for being one of the first and most influential causes of the insanity that now infests the college application process. I may be incorrect in singling out that publication; it is not something I’ve studied. But my recollection is that the rankings were kind of a novelty when I applied to college (in 1975) and were immediately of great interest. I remember my mother grabbing that edition each year while I was a college student (she didn’t buy it otherwise) and checking to be sure that my alma mater was still highly rated, making her feel validated and giving her bragging rights. Over the next three-plus decades, I observed with increasing trepidation how what had once been a fairly straightforward process of applying to college was becoming a nightmare, worsening every year in terms of stress, competition, waste of resources, and general craziness, culminating in the Felicity Huffman et al college admissions scandal we’ve just witnessed. By the time I had a kid ready for the college application process, it was absurd (a search of my SDMB posts during that time would demonstrate that I too was swept up in the belief that my kid just HAD to get accepted to a top-tier school or my/his life would be in ruins). Anyway, it wasn’t only because of USN&WR that things got out of hand; many societal factors, including the blossoming of the internet, have played a role. But as far as I can tell, they were one of the initial causes. Had the bright idea of ranking all the schools been quashed when first suggested, we might be in better shape today. No chance the idea, once floated, wouldn’t take root, though. It’s not about helping families sort the college application process; it’s all about the money. I don’t read USN&WR but my understanding is that they have branched out and now they do stupid rankings all the damn time. No doubt that is what keeps them afloat, financially. . ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2019, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/12 "2019-09-10T00:08:08Z")
For the very top schools, it’s probably a better indicator of status to compare number of Nobel Laureates that went there or are/were on faculty. Let’s see, where is Bob Dylan an alum of, and what faculty appointments has he held? ---
**Author:** ![purplehorseshoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/purplehorseshoe/32/2996_2.png) [@purplehorseshoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehorseshoe)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2019, 9:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/13 "2019-09-10T09:39:26Z")
My mother took that list as the end-all be-all of college credentials, and wouldn’t hear of her Darling Daughter (that’s me!) coming anywhere near some godforsaken garbage heap near the middle of the list. Plenty of credulous folks to keep that particular ball rollin’ along. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2019, 11:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/14 "2019-09-10T11:54:54Z")
Similar is the [Aspen Prize for community colleges](https://www.aspeninstitute.org/blog-posts/announcing-the-2019-aspen-prize-for-community-college-excellence-finalists/). Schools take great pride in being #1. [According to their site:](http://highered.aspeninstitute.org/aspen-prize-program/selection-process/)Institutions are assessed for exceptional student outcomes in four areas: student learning, certificate and degree completion (including of a bachelor’s degree after transfer), employment and earnings, and high levels of access and success for minority and low-income students. One school Lake Area Tech advertises it’s #1 ranking and its mostly why [President Obama choose to visit the tiny school in 2015](https://www.lakeareatech.edu/president-obama-to-give-commencement-address-at-lake-area-technical-institute/) to give the commencement address. To me, its just another criteria in making a selection. Often the biggest one is just if the school is close enough to home so ones expenses are cheaper. ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2019, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/15 "2019-09-10T13:19:06Z")
I’ve studied and worked at a lot of colleges. They are mostly similar for most students no matter where they’re ranked (as long as they’re regionally accredited). ---
**Author:** ![KarlGauss](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/karlgauss/32/3713_2.png) [@KarlGauss](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KarlGauss)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2019, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/16 "2019-09-10T13:33:17Z")
OTOH, medical school rankings are accurate and trustworthy. Just look at this about the [University of Toronto Faculty of Medicine](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Toronto_Faculty_of_Medicine): > [@](#): > > The school was ranked 5th in the world and 1st in Canada by the Academic Ranking of World Universities in 2019 and the U.S. News and World Education Rankings for Clinical Medicine in 2018, and 11th in the world and 1st in Canada by the QS University Subject Rankings for Medicine in 2018. 😃 P.S. The linked wiki page for my dear Faculty is otherwise embarrassing. Go [here](https://medicine.utoronto.ca/) if you’re interested which I am sure you’re not. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2019, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/17 "2019-09-10T13:50:55Z")
> [@](#): > > Quoth **ftg** : > > From a prospective student’s point of view, what really matters is the ranking of the departments you are considering majoring in by the societies for those areas. Or even the subgroups within the departments, or even individual professors. Some fields of study are narrow enough that there are only a small number of options where you _can_ pursue them. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2019, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/18 "2019-09-10T14:24:02Z")
Well just how “bad” can a school get? I mean if students graduate and then find out nobody will hire them, well word gets around fast. What companies come and recruit there? For example in auto mechanics I simply emailed various shops in the area to ask where they hired from. Yes some were more recommended than others. ---
**Author:** ![Chingon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chingon/32/17645_2.png) [@Chingon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chingon)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2019, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/19 "2019-09-10T19:01:17Z")
Sure if you view universities as simply career placement services. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2019, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940/20 "2019-09-10T20:01:50Z")
Student parking? It’s an issue that wont be on any major ranking but it can be a big issue. I remember UMKC years ago. UMKC had about 90% of their students having to drive and park to attend. Only there were not near enough parking spaces so you got to the parking lot and waited in a line for someone to leave so you could park. Often this would be quite a battle and make you late for class. The parking spots were on meters but often the meters were broken and if you parked in one you’d get a ticket. It really was annoying and something the students were constantly complaining about yet the administration didnt want to do anything about it. KU Medical Center, similar. People had to park all over the neighborhood so that caused friction with them and they would post signs restricting non resident parking but still if you were a student, what could you do? Eventually both schools listened and added more parking. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prestigious-is-the-us-news-college-rankings/839940.md?page=2)