# How prevalent is train use in the U.S.? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 23, 2006, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prevalent-is-train-use-in-the-u-s/381563 "2006-11-23T17:28:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2006, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prevalent-is-train-use-in-the-u-s/381563/81 "2006-11-26T23:26:46Z")
[QUOTE=ryobserver] You are supposed to show photo ID, but in my experience this is only requested when buying tickets at the counter, or when presenting a ticket you’ve bought at a kiosk or online but forgotten to sign in the corner. [/QUOTE] They’re still doing this? I remember reading about this in about October 2001, and how it was a farcical gesture towards security, which achieved nothing whatsoever. ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2006, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prevalent-is-train-use-in-the-u-s/381563/82 "2006-11-27T00:48:30Z")
[QUOTE=GorillaMan] They’re still doing this? I remember reading about this in about October 2001, and how it was a farcical gesture towards security, which achieved nothing whatsoever. [/QUOTE] I knew they instituted it in the Northeast corridor (the Boston to DC length of track) but I never knew if they went country-wide with the policy. They say that you should have a ticket purchased beforehand if boarding at a staffed station or with a Quik-Trak kiosk, but I’m not sure what that means. When I used to use Amtrak fairly regularly, I would start any trip from the station that was handily a mile from my college. To call it a staffed station is a bit of a stretch, as it was a one-room shack that a woman would open up like an hour before the scheduled arrival/departure time but there was no way to purchase a ticket there. I always had my tickets purchased online well beforehand anyway, since there are service fees with purchasing a ticket on the train and would have had to buy another ticket at Philly for the regional trains in the Northeast corridor. Also, the times I was using Amtrak were the times that the train could actually fill up (travel for Thanksgiving and Christmas mostly, as travel for spring break was rarely as heavy) not only with the general populace and students from my college but also students from Penn State an hour away. So having that ticket purchased ahead of time was vital for actually getting and staying on the train. No idea if I could have just hopped on-board on a whim one morning to go visit Pittsburgh or something. For my situation (college far away from home in the middle of nowhere with no car) rail was ideal for when I had to leave for breaks. Having friends on both sides of the DC area, I could either go to a station somewhere nearby (generally BWI). I also sometimes took an overnight train all the way to Chicago, walked three blocks to the closest blue line stop (not fun in downtown Chicago in winter or early spring loaded down by luggage) and then either took the blue line all the way to O’Hare or changed somewhere in the Loop to get on the orange line to Midway. What was annoying, however, is that there was never a one-day solution. Trips to the DC area required spending a night with friends or in a hotel somewhere near BWI and of course the trip to Chicago was overnight, generally (when everything was on time, of course) leaving my station at about 7 PM and getting into Chicago about 8 AM. Even though there is a shuttle from the BWI Amtrak stop to the BWI airport terminal, there were never flights leaving late enough in the evening for me to do it all in one day. All I needed was something like an 8 PM or sometimes even earlier flight flying west (eventually to Albuquerque) but there were none. Still are none. I have no idea why the airport seems to shut down at 6 PM. ---
**Author:** ![Antonius\_Block](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/51bf81/32.png) [@Antonius\_Block](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antonius_Block)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2006, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prevalent-is-train-use-in-the-u-s/381563/83 "2006-11-27T02:29:02Z")
[QUOTE=GorillaMan] They’re still doing this? I remember reading about this in about October 2001, and how it was a farcical gesture towards security, which achieved nothing whatsoever. [/QUOTE] From Amtrak’s [Passenger Security and Identification](http://www.amtrak.com/servlet/ContentServer?pagename=Amtrak/am2Copy/Title_Image_Copy_Page&c=am2Copy&cid=1080080554204&ssid=342) page: > [@](#): > > **Photo ID Required** > Amtrak customers 18 years of age and older must produce valid photo identification when: > > ``` > * Obtaining, exchanging, and refunding tickets > * Storing baggage at stations > * Checking baggage > * Sending Amtrak Express shipments > * Onboard trains, in response to a request by an Amtrak employee > > ``` > > Please note that unaccompanied children 15 and older must also produce valid photo ID when purchasing tickets. > > **Random Ticket/ID Checks** > Following federal Transportation Security Administration (TSA) guidelines, we regularly conduct random ticket verification checks onboard trains to ensure that passengers are properly ticketed. Please be prepared to show valid photo identification to a member of the onboard crew upon request. > > **What is a Valid ID?** > To be valid, your identification must be current and in-force. The following forms of identification are acceptable for persons 18 and older: > > ``` > * One piece of photo identification issued by a government authority, or > * Two pieces of identification, at least one of which is a non-photo ID issued by a government authority > > ``` > > Examples of acceptable forms of ID include: > > ``` > * State or provincial driver's license > * Passport > * Official government-issued identification (federal, state or county government or legitimate foreign government) > * Canadian provincial health card ID card with photo > * Military photo ID > * Student identification (university, college or high school photo ID) > * Job Corps photo ID > > ``` As mentioned in [post #37](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7994402&postcount=37) upthread, I regularly take Amtrak’s [Capitol Corridor](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capitol_Corridor) between the SF Bay Area and Davis (near Sacramento), California. Although I sometimes board in San Jose (staffed station, ID required), it’s usually more convenient for me to board at the Santa Clara stop, which is unstaffed so I buy the ticket on the train with no penalty (none of the Capitol Corridor trains – 16 each direction every weekday – have reserved seating). I have **never** been asked for ID by the conductor when buying my ticket on-board. Occasionally, there will be a random on-board ticket-check, but I’ve never been asked for ID during these either. _[Since the Amtrak computers aren’t linked to any database like the TSA’s “no-fly” list, and the ticket agents barely glance at the ID (i.e. don’t scan it or write anything down), it’s hard to know what possible function such a system provides except to make people think that “something is being done to protect them”.]_ ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2006, 9:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prevalent-is-train-use-in-the-u-s/381563/84 "2006-11-27T09:30:15Z")
[QUOTE=Antonius Block] _[Since the Amtrak computers aren’t linked to any database like the TSA’s “no-fly” list, and the ticket agents barely glance at the ID (i.e. don’t scan it or write anything down), it’s hard to know what possible function such a system provides except to make people think that “something is being done to protect them”.]_ [/QUOTE] That was exactly the point of the article I read five years ago, ridiculing the practice. Which is why I’m amazed something so transparently useless has persisted this long. ---
**Author:** ![Antonius\_Block](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/51bf81/32.png) [@Antonius\_Block](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antonius_Block)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2006, 10:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prevalent-is-train-use-in-the-u-s/381563/85 "2006-11-27T10:06:35Z")
**GorillaMan** , this thread is in GQ, so we have to have to maintain a pretension of factual answers, but it’s probably OK to say that attempts to reduce Amtrak’s photo ID requirement might be taken as being “soft on terrorism”. The Amtrak tickets bought with ID **do** carry the name of the purchaser, so I suppose someone could claim that all (adult) passengers are identifiable (unless they board at unmanned stops like [Santa Clara](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=8000338&postcount=83)). Presumably, if something terrible happened on a train from Davis to the San Francisco Bay Area, the Davis ticket clerk could later come up with a description of shifty-eyed passenger **Antonius Block** , who bought his ticket with a **República von Transylvania** passport that _“totally looked all official-like”_, even though there’s no record of it. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2006, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prevalent-is-train-use-in-the-u-s/381563/86 "2006-11-27T18:42:39Z")
[QUOTE=Happy Wanderer] [It’s already in the bag.](http://www.friends4expo.org/) Ground has been broken on phase one, and phase II is pretty much a lock. They still need to extend the subway to the beach. If Villaraigosa can get that moving, a lot will be forgiven. \*\*Antonius Block \*\*has a lot of good information, but what it doesn’t show is the explosive growth in the LA system. We went from 0 miles of rail to the [current system](http://www.mta.net/riding_metro/riders_guide/rail_info.htm) in 16 years. There is serious talk about extending the Gold Line to Claremont and even to San Bernadino. It is already being built into east LA. The Orange Line, while not rail, is a dedicated busway in the valley that has had amazing success. They already are planning to extend it from Woodland Hills up to Chatsworth. All in all, by the time they are finished we will have a fair approximation of the late lamented Red Car system. Except it will be better. Red cars often ran on city streets and got stuck in traffic. The cars had no air conditioning, and primitive heating. The system was in poor shape and getting worse. Now we have the beginning of something truly useful, that will last for generations. It was the best thing Tom Bradley ever did. The neat thing about a rail system, is the more you build, the more value the existing system has. Every station, every mile of track, makes the rest of the system that much more useful. I give the MTA a lot of credit for establishing a very good nucleus. We just need to keep adding onto it. . [/QUOTE] This just in from today’s L.A. Times…the City of Beverly Hills is pushing for a couple subway stations within its limits. This is based on the assumption that the Red Line subway will be extended out to Santa Monica. No definite plans for that have been made, and no funds have been allocated, but this, too appears likely to happen in the near future. Traffic on the Westside is getting so bad that many locals have changed sides and are now in favor of bringing the subway through. This could be stupendous–a lot of people who work in the area and live in the Inland Empire would be able to consider taking the train in to work, since they would now have a quick way to get from downtown to the Westside. ---
**Author:** ![Stan\_Shmenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/94ad74/32.png) [@Stan\_Shmenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stan_Shmenge)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2006, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prevalent-is-train-use-in-the-u-s/381563/87 "2006-11-28T00:05:49Z")
[QUOTE=Spectre of Pithecanthropus] This just in from today’s L.A. Times…the City of Beverly Hills is pushing for a couple subway stations within its limits. This is based on the assumption that the Red Line subway will be extended out to Santa Monica. No definite plans for that have been made, and no funds have been allocated, but this, too appears likely to happen in the near future. Traffic on the Westside is getting so bad that many locals have changed sides and are now in favor of bringing the subway through. This could be stupendous–a lot of people who work in the area and live in the Inland Empire would be able to consider taking the train in to work, since they would now have a quick way to get from downtown to the Westside. [/QUOTE] I read the article this morning. Still, with a 5B price tag, it may be a while before they break ground. Still, we can hope! It can take 30 minutes just to get through BH on Santa Monica Blvd. during rush. ---
**Author:** ![ryobserver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b2d939/32.png) [@ryobserver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ryobserver)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2006, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prevalent-is-train-use-in-the-u-s/381563/88 "2006-11-28T00:29:14Z")
Amendment to my earlier post: Amtrak’s ban on buying tickets on the train isn’t absolute, but it’s effectively absolute in the Northeast Corridor. If you board at a station that’s staffed when you board, or has any working ticket kiosks, forget about getting a ticket on board. The last passenger I saw trying to buy a ticket on board had got on at NY Penn Station, heading for Philadelphia, I think; she had to get off in Newark, and was probably still trying to get a ticket when the train left. ---
**Author:** ![TheLoadedDog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/35a633/32.png) [@TheLoadedDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheLoadedDog)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2006, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prevalent-is-train-use-in-the-u-s/381563/89 "2006-11-28T00:45:14Z")
Wouldn’t be a bad plan if you wanted to get off in Newark though… 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2006, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prevalent-is-train-use-in-the-u-s/381563/90 "2006-11-28T01:04:18Z")
Middle Tennessee is getting light commuter rail in the Nashville Area. Not in **my** community, yet… ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2006, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prevalent-is-train-use-in-the-u-s/381563/91 "2006-11-28T01:33:34Z")
[QUOTE=Happy Wanderer] I read the article this morning. Still, with a 5B price tag, it may be a while before they break ground. Still, we can hope! It can take 30 minutes just to get through BH on Santa Monica Blvd. during rush. [/QUOTE] Try getting OUT of Santa Monica on a bad day! The only way under the 405 is to take one of four streets (Wilshire, Santa Monica, Olympic or Pico) and if there’s a backup on the 405 Santa Monica is effectively cut off from the rest of the city. If they push the Red Line through to the ocean maybe it will take some of the pressure off. Does anyone know, are there any plans to run a line along the Sepulveda corridor to the Valley? It seems like a natural step to provide better access to LAX. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2006, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prevalent-is-train-use-in-the-u-s/381563/92 "2006-11-28T01:42:07Z")
[QUOTE=GorillaMan] They’re still doing this? I remember reading about this in about October 2001, and how it was a farcical gesture towards security, which achieved nothing whatsoever. [/QUOTE] You have no idea how many people are trying to win an Oscar for security theater. ---
**Author:** ![Stan\_Shmenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/94ad74/32.png) [@Stan\_Shmenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stan_Shmenge)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2006, 11:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prevalent-is-train-use-in-the-u-s/381563/93 "2006-11-28T11:28:36Z")
[QUOTE=Pochacco] Try getting OUT of Santa Monica on a bad day! The only way under the 405 is to take one of four streets (Wilshire, Santa Monica, Olympic or Pico) and if there’s a backup on the 405 Santa Monica is effectively cut off from the rest of the city. If they push the Red Line through to the ocean maybe it will take some of the pressure off. Does anyone know, are there any plans to run a line along the Sepulveda corridor to the Valley? It seems like a natural step to provide better access to LAX. [/QUOTE] The red line could take a LOT of pressure off. It could run 10,000 people per hour in each direction. Divided between the 5 major arteries that would be over 2000 cars per hour removed, or 40 cars per minute, per artery, per direction. Not bad at all. We need this awful bad. Let’s hope for the best. The Expo Line won’t be as direct of have the capacity or speed of the subway. There are no plans to run anything along the Sepulvada corridor, and there probably never will be. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2006, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prevalent-is-train-use-in-the-u-s/381563/94 "2006-11-28T19:40:32Z")
[QUOTE=Dr. PoopiePants] I took a chance that the last hot dog in the wiener-warming carousel on the counter in a snack bar at the airport was not spinning around for a year (that’s 7 dog years BTW). [/QUOTE] Why must everything remind me of Seinfeld? “It’s a perfectly sane food to eat.” I rode the train or bus for years after getting scared to fly as well. Then I had to go to a wedding on the West Coast and had to force myself to go. I’d like to go on sight-seeing train tours because I always drive and never get to look around at scenery! ---
**Author:** ![medstar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f07891/32.png) [@medstar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/medstar)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2006, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prevalent-is-train-use-in-the-u-s/381563/95 "2006-11-28T21:16:40Z")
[QUOTE=Derleth] How would this help? Wouldn’t it just give the terrorists another target?Who pays?Container trains pay for the rails. Why give them an incentive to move to trucks and aircraft instead?Where there is no infrastructure, no housing, and in many regions limited water. For the moment, I’ll ignore how Stalinist the sentiment seems. [/QUOTE] You raise a lot of good points, but I still believe that the U.S. needs a wide variety of transportation options so that no one option can effectively strand a large portion of the population for reasons of terrorism, acts of nature, etc. While the price tag would be high, so would the numbers of people put to work. After reading the posts concerning trains in L.A., this would improve the quality of life for many people in that area. Who knows, maybe more people will move to the midwest if there was reliable train service. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-prevalent-is-train-use-in-the-u-s/381563.md?page=4)