# How to be politically correct thread **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 1, 2017, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241 "2017-09-01T12:24:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/101 "2017-09-05T15:27:17Z")
> [@HeweyLogan](#): > > So to clear up what seems like some confusion, or at least as far as I can tell, are people here saying Piers Morgan was being insensitive when he referred to where he was at as a gay bar, as opposed to just a bar? > > Or was, and is the criticism against him worth dismissing since it was only brought up by three people? > > It seems like people are saying both, some, and none. Okay, first of all, curse you for making me click in the link in the OP so I would be in a position to answer you coherently. Second, it appears that people were accusing Piers Morgan of being insensitive/“sensationalist” by _unnecessarily_ pointing out that his location was “a gay bar.” Objectively, it’s difficult to argue that they didn’t have a point. His Instagram doesn’t really convey any information about his location beyond the fact that that he was in a gay bar. There’s a lot of room left for speculation, though: \*“ooh, that Piers Morgan chap goes to gay bars! He must be one of THOSE sorts.” “Hang on, he’s with a bird in that gay bar; maybe 'e’s not bent, after all…” “Don’t be daft, man; birds aren’t allowed in gay bars!” “Well, they probably let him in because he’s a celebrity.” “'alf a tic, he mentions there’s another bloke with them. A threesome, eh? Always thought he was bit dodgy”\* [Homer Simpson Voice]…and that’s the story of how Piers Morgan keeps people talking about him…[/HSV] Third of all, do I even WANT to know who the fuck Piers Morgan is? ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/102 "2017-09-05T15:34:06Z")
> [@cochrane](#): > > Oh, no! Not **BigT’s** ignore list. Anything but that. How can anyone survive the shame? Or the amount of Dom Perignon they would be drinking? j/k, **BigT**. you can be annoying, but you’re not _that_ annoying. Feel free to use this in your .sig line… ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/103 "2017-09-05T15:34:24Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > Most of us are just saying Morgan always was an asshole, is an asshole now, and will always be an asshole. Furthermore, if he hates this country so much he can get the fuck out. Problem is the Brits hate him don’t want him either. You’ll be happy to know that he _is_ out. That was a Soho, London gay bar, not New York. He’s a presenter on a morning show called _Good Morning Britain_ and the woman he was with, Susanna Reid, is a co-host. For your enjoyment, here is an amusing clip featuring Reid: [You must have had to beat off a lot of American men.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZe777oON8w) ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/104 "2017-09-05T15:44:22Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > Fuck those people with a tetsubo. > > It’s like the town that had an annual mock gunfight and then cancelled it because one asshole complained. Then had to backtrack because thousands of people got pissed off at them for cancelling it over that single complaint. Was it a Wild West gunfight or a Compton Drive-by gunfight? 'cos if it was the latter, I think I can empathize with the complainer… ETA: I just looked up what a _tetsubo_ is. Yikes. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/105 "2017-09-05T15:45:03Z")
> [@](#): > > …Third of all, do I even WANT to know who the fuck Piers Morgan is? Not important who he is, only whether or not he is gay. And where he fits on the spectrum of gayitude. Totally gay, gay “curious”, or accepting. The last is, of course, the least gay position on the spectrum, but is nonetheless more gay than the position of right-thinking Americans, who abhor such moral laxity. There is right, and there is wrong, there is no “sorta right” and “kinda wrong”. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/106 "2017-09-05T20:50:18Z")
> [@HeweyLogan](#): > > So to clear up what seems like some confusion, or at least as far as I can tell, are people here saying Piers Morgan was being insensitive when he referred to where he was at as a gay bar, as opposed to just a bar? The only confusion here is your own (well, and the OP’s). There are two general principles in play here, and they don’t contradict each other. To wit: **1) A few random posts on social media don’t constitute an official edict of social etiquette.** Not every usage that a couple people happen to object to thereby becomes automatically verboten, even for intelligent polite people who sincerely strive to avoid causing offense in general. **2) It is usually considered in poor taste, though not necessarily outright offensive, to explicitly specify another’s minority-group status when it’s completely irrelevant**, especially if you’re not a member of that group yourself. E.g., you wouldn’t say _“I asked my physically-handicapped receptionist if there were any calls for me while I was out”_, or _“This recording is of an Asian violinist playing on a Stradivarius”_, or _“I borrowed a couple stitch markers from a male knitter in my craft club”_. Unless the fact of the receptionist being physically disabled, or the violinist being Asian, or the knitter being male is in some meaningful way relevant to what you’re saying about them. Otherwise, you just look like a shallow twat who instinctively labels people by the fact of their superficial “difference”, even if that difference has nothing to do with their presence in whatever narrative you happen to be telling. Therefore, since the photo and remark that Piers Morgan tweeted appeared to have nothing to do with the fact that the bar he was in was specifically a gay bar, and since it is pretty generally safe to assume that Piers Morgan is looking like a shallow twat whatever he’s on about, a few people questioned his choice of words. But nothing said by anyone in that context implies in any way that there’s anything wrong with calling a gay bar a gay bar **when that fact is actually relevant to what you happen to be saying about it**. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/107 "2017-09-05T21:17:34Z")
Even so, that’s still something to know. It’s fairly common in my experience for people to mention something they find unusual or interesting, and there’s no malice whatsoever behind it. But if it’s considered impolite to mention ethnicity or sexual orientation when it’s irrelevant, that’s something people should know, because it’s a common faux pas. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/108 "2017-09-05T21:27:11Z")
> [@HeweyLogan](#): > > I missed this. Great! Thanks. I was misunderstanding some people in this thread. But Piers Morgan is an asshole, anyways. ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/109 "2017-09-05T21:27:40Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Even so, that’s still something to know. It’s fairly common in my experience for people to mention something they find unusual or interesting, and there’s no malice whatsoever behind it. But if it’s considered impolite to mention ethnicity or sexual orientation when it’s irrelevant, that’s something people should know, because it’s a common faux pas. Common? Among whom? It shows s very provincial attitude to find these things (such as ethnicity or sexual orientation) to be “unusual or interesting.” ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/110 "2017-09-05T21:29:05Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > … Piers Morgan, however, is unable to say or do anything without coming across as a cringing asshole. If he walked up to me and said, “I like ice cream,” my instinctive response would be, “Go fuck yourself.” > … ] Well said! ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/111 "2017-09-05T21:31:07Z")
> [@HeweyLogan](#): > > So the criticism of him using gay bar instead of just a bar is irrelevant, it’s because he is an asshole that the criticism of him is warranted and right. Anyone else, meh. Go back to calling it a gay bar, this is a Piers Morgan issue only. Pretty much. I just use the fact that he’s generally an asshole, as an excuse to get on this here Crazy Train for a ride. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/112 "2017-09-05T21:37:50Z")
> [@DrFidelius](#): > > Common? > Among whom? > It shows s very provincial attitude to find these things (such as ethnicity or sexual orientation) to be “unusual or interesting.” Piers doesn’t strike me as provincial. ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/113 "2017-09-05T21:49:39Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Piers doesn’t strike me as provincial. Piers is not provincial. He is an asshole. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/114 "2017-09-05T21:54:00Z")
Look up “asshole” in a dictionary. You’ll see Morgan’s picture 😃 ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/115 "2017-09-05T21:55:13Z")
Yes he is, but I don’t think that’s what he was going for there. Usually when he’s an asshole, it’s because he wants to be. ---
**Author:** ![orcenio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/orcenio/32/1036_2.png) [@orcenio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/orcenio)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/116 "2017-09-05T22:23:02Z")
Allow me to quote a post of mine from ~4 years ago (apparently still relevant). > [@Piers Morgan: always this bad?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/piers-morgan-always-this-bad/651607/3): > > [He is](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86jqqdoOwwg&t=14m30s)\* [very hated](http://www.cracked.com/article_20522_the-5-ballsiest-lies-mainstream-media-passed-off-as-fact.html) [in Britain](http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/moslive/article-1077937/The-Insider--8216-Morgan-hated-man-English-Channel.html). > \*Bonus: Guys if you have a strong stomach stay and watch [19:30-21:00](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86jqqdoOwwg&t=19m30s). ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/117 "2017-09-05T22:24:09Z")
[QUOTE=adaher] It’s fairly common in my experience for people to mention something they find unusual or interesting, and there’s no malice whatsoever behind it. [/quote] Well duh, if they are mentioning a circumstance **because they find it unusual or interesting** , then it **is** relevant. For instance, if you say _“This Asian violinist was interested in Stradivarius violins because they seemed exotic and foreign in addition to being musical rarities”_, then specifying that the violinist is Asian (or at least not European) is kind of essential to the point. But if you say, for example, _“An Asian violinist bought a Stradivarius”_ or _“An Asian violinist was the concertmaster”_ or _“An Asian violinist played very quickly”_ or whatever, you sound a little weird. Because the impression is that either you’re trying to make some point about what Asians **in general** are like as violinists, or that you just can’t help drawing attention to the fact that this violinist happens to be Asian no matter how irrelevant it is to what you’re actually trying to say. [QUOTE=adaher] But if it’s considered impolite to mention ethnicity or sexual orientation when it’s irrelevant, that’s something people should know, because it’s a common faux pas. [/QUOTE] I think you’ll find it **is** pretty generally known. Yes, some people don’t seem able to stop dragging in such irrelevancies in remarks like _“a speech about the emergency measures was made by the woman mayor”_ or _“Professor Jones is a black economist specializing in international currency exchange”_ or _“A gay business owner agreed that fixing the pavement would be necessary”_. But that usually doesn’t mean that they don’t know and understand the general principle of not emphasizing irrelevant details. It just means that on some level they are so fixated on what they perceive as the fundamental oddness of a mayor being female, or an economics professor being black, or a business owner being gay, that they simply can’t recognize it as irrelevant enough to leave out. ---
**Author:** ![Latro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@Latro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Latro)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2017, 9:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/118 "2017-09-06T09:14:44Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Therefore, since the photo and remark that Piers Morgan tweeted appeared to have nothing to do with the fact that the bar he was in was specifically a gay bar, and since it is pretty generally safe to assume that Piers Morgan is looking like a shallow twat whatever he’s on about, a few people questioned his choice of words. So you can’t say “I was at an Irish pub, when my shoe laces became undone.” Or a Chinese restaurant or a ladies night or a bar-mitzvah. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2017, 9:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/119 "2017-09-06T09:57:22Z")
> [@Latro](#): > > So you can’t say “I was at an Irish pub, when my shoe laces became undone.” > Or a Chinese restaurant or a ladies night or a bar-mitzvah. Sure you can. But your hearers will naturally expect that your location probably has some relevance to what you’re saying. If you were merely thinking about your unreliable shoelaces and trying to make a point about how insecure they are, wouldn’t you just say something like “My shoelaces came undone last night while I was out”? It does seem somewhat less odd to say “My shoelaces came undone at a Chinese restaurant” than to say “I got this drink half an hour ago from a lesbian bartender” or “I heard some terrible things about the storm damage from a black news announcer”, etc. That’s because we’re used to people being more insistent on irrelevant details of race, gender, sexuality, etc., than on irrelevant details of restaurant theme. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2017, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241/120 "2017-09-06T13:41:04Z")
> [@Living\_Well\_Is\_Best\_Revenge](#): > > Then yes they are Mexicans. Do you really not understand the point here? Is the point that BigT’s grandfather couldn’t figure out on his own that you don’t call people who aren’t from Mexico “Mexican”? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-be-politically-correct-thread/795241.md?page=7)