# How to deal with anti-vax relatives who want to hang out? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 12, 2021, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932 "2021-05-12T19:12:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/41 "2021-05-13T01:18:43Z")
> [@Deeg](#): > > One thing we need to ask ourselves is are we trying to punish the anti-vaxxers by keeping them away? Noooo…as has been stated in this thread, on this board, and all over the internet, we are trying to prevent anti-vaxxers from infecting our families, our friends, our co-workers and ourselves. Why is this such a difficult thing to comprehend?? ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/42 "2021-05-13T02:12:00Z")
Tell your aunt about MY last two aunts, who both died of COVID. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/43 "2021-05-13T02:20:07Z")
> [@Deeg](#): > > I’m with QuickSilver on this. Do you mind writing off the anti-vax relatives for the rest of your life? Then tell them to stay away. If the relationship is worth trying to save then you may have to make a tough decision. Being vaxxed yourself means that the chances of getting a dangerous level of COVID is rare (maybe even unprecedented). > > One thing we need to ask ourselves is are we trying to punish the anti-vaxxers by keeping them away? It’s an understandable reaction but is it worth ruining the relationship? What you both seem to have missed is that it would not be the OP who has damaged the relationship. The aunt is the one who had irreparably damaged the relationship by saying “I don’t love you enough to not try and get you and the rest of our family killed.” Even if COVID stopped being a thing, that level of callousness and selfishness means they are dangerous to be around. When push comes to shove, they care more about minor inconveniences than the lives of others. It’s entirely up to the aunt to try and salvage this relationship if she wants to, by starting to wear masks. Maybe if she wears it for a couple weeks, and gets a vaccine, it’s possible to believe she’s had a change of heart and realized that other people matter. If she chooses not to, then she is the one who has decided to “ruin the relationship.” The OP should make it clear what is necessary to salvage it, and leave the ball in her court. I object to you guys both putting the onus on the OP to possibly salvage this relationship. ---
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/44 "2021-05-13T03:23:03Z")
Until the US and prolly the world has herd immunity, then there is a real risk of mutations. Thus far, it looks pretty promising that even a single poke means that getting covid is almost certainly not going to put you in the hospital. But do we really want a spring repeat of NY? Or Arizona? Or worse becoming India or Brazil? I consider someone that isn’t poked (by summer) as demanding the right to be a drunk driver. Menace to the public and to yourself. Frankly, I could care less if anti-vaxers meet Darwin, but they are going to cost the health care system and society something significant. The sooner there is a carrot and stick approach, the better. No shoes, no shirt, no vaccine, no service. Be it flying, Disneyland, a ball game, restaurants and private businesses. ya wanna be anti-covid shots (looking at you my second eldest brother), then wear the scarlett letter and be shunned by society. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/45 "2021-05-13T03:27:26Z")
> [@China\_Guy](#): > > I consider someone that isn’t poked (by summer) as demanding the right to be a drunk driver. I don’t think you’re going to make “poked” catch on… but this is a great analogy. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/46 "2021-05-13T03:38:51Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > I don’t think you’re going to make “poked” catch on… C’mon, we can do it! We’ll have Gumby’s sidekick as our mascot… ooh, maybe an ad where anti-vaxxers are trampled by enraged Pokies. Then they point at the camera and growl… _ **Get a poke. No joke.** _ _(©2021 digco tri-county industries)_ ---
**Author:** ![Deeg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/deeg/32/2955_2.png) [@Deeg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Deeg)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/47 "2021-05-13T04:15:10Z")
If one’s family is vaccinated then the chances of getting sick are very low. The chances of dying after vaccination are extremely low. Driving to the airport to pick up the unvaccinated relative is more dangerous. If not everyone in one’s family is vaxxed then keep the relatives out but eventually we’re all (mostly) going to be vaxxed and we’ll have to decide if saving relationships is worth the very small risk. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/48 "2021-05-13T04:20:10Z")
> [@Deeg](#): > > eventually we’re all (mostly) going to be vaxxed and we’ll have to decide if saving relationships is worth the very small risk. Ask me my opinion when we get to that point. Right now we are at the “Hey! I can see the ground down there, so I’m gonna step out of the plane.” point. ---
**Author:** ![Deeg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/deeg/32/2955_2.png) [@Deeg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Deeg)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/49 "2021-05-13T04:20:23Z")
It wasn’t me that put the onus on the OP but the aunt. If Blalron doesn’t care about salvaging the relationship then he doesn’t have to. I also have an aunt who’s hesitant. She’s not as pushy about it–she just believes the lies that others tell her–but some day I have to decide what’s worth more to me. ---
**Author:** ![slash2k](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@slash2k](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/slash2k)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/50 "2021-05-13T04:25:36Z")
> [@Deeg](#): > > Being vaxxed yourself means that the chances of getting a dangerous level of COVID is rare (maybe even unprecedented). At least 112 vaccinated people in the US have died of COVID. (Data as of 26 April, [as reported to CDC](https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/covid-19/health-departments/breakthrough-cases.html).) I’d say that was a “dangerous level.” Getting vaxxed significantly reduces the risk of severe illness, but it doesn’t eliminate it. > [@Deeg](#): > > If not everyone in one’s family is vaxxed then keep the relatives out but eventually we’re all (mostly) going to be vaxxed and we’ll have to decide if saving relationships is worth the very small risk. What’s the relationship worth if the other party is so disconnected from reality as to have no qualms about potentially making OP and/or family members ill? ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/51 "2021-05-13T04:28:33Z")
> [@Deeg](#): > > Do you mind writing off the anti-vax relatives for the rest of your life? Speaking for myself, probably. Depending on motivation to some extent. If someone has seriously and more importantly proudly burrowed down that particular rabbit-hole of ignorance, chances are we’d have additional issues beyond that to contend with. I’m not really a huge believer in unconditional love. At least with adults affection is almost always at least a little bit conditional and I’m not much for putting up with toxic individuals (I am assuming in this scenario they’re assertively toxic, not just confused). But then that’s easy for me to say - none of my immediate family are anti-vaxxers. However if I found out some cousin who wanted to visit from out of town was a nuttily proud conspiracy theorist-variety - yeah, I’d probably make a polite excuse and decline the invitation. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/52 "2021-05-13T12:35:12Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > But then that’s easy for me to say - none of my immediate family are anti-vaxxers. However if I found out some cousin who wanted to visit from out of town was a nuttily proud conspiracy theorist-variety - yeah, I’d probably make a polite excuse and decline the invitation. I suppose the OP struck a nerve with me because I’m finding myself in a very similar situation, having to make a similar decision. Similar but much more personal in that it isn’t some distant aunt or cousin but an immediate relative who is not vaccinated and it is a formal family function coming at the end of this year. Most of the people attending whom I know are already or will be vaccinated by then. But not this particular individual (& partner). My suspicion is that there will be a number of attendees who are also not vaccinated but I do not know them personally. So, “Fuck you, you anti-vax lunatic!” at what personal cost?.. is the question I’m not only asking in general, but also having to answer for myself, specifically. I suspect it will be a common question being asked by more and more people as time goes on and social behaviors begins to return to the pre-pandemic normal. And while vaccines are not “a panacea” (I never said they were), they do play a very significant role in changing the risk assessment equation for the majority of those who are vaccinated. ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/53 "2021-05-13T13:11:22Z")
I would lie through my teeth, without hesitation. I would say, while I’m not willing to elaborate on something as deeply personal as my medical condition, I am uncomfortable with this interaction. Would love to see you another time, perhaps when things look better. I know I can rely on your discretion to NOT discuss my medical status with anyone else. Thank you for your understanding, sending our love! Done and done. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/54 "2021-05-13T13:36:14Z")
> [@Deeg](#): > > If not everyone in one’s family is vaxxed then keep the relatives out but eventually we’re all (mostly) going to be vaxxed and we’ll have to decide if saving relationships is worth the very small risk. Why is it always up to us to compromise with those who refuse to budge? Is the relationship worth saving to the person who refuses to get a vaccine? Apparently not. If it’s not worth it to them to go through a minor inconvenience to save the relationship, then why should it be worth it to me? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/55 "2021-05-13T13:40:43Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > So, “Fuck you, you anti-vax lunatic!” at what personal cost? The personal cost is the elimination of toxic people from your life who would put you and yours into danger in order to indulge in their irrationality. Not that high a cost, IMHO. All you are doing if you enable them is ensuring that _they_ pay no personal cost for their actions. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/56 "2021-05-13T13:42:50Z")
OP, you are not being a jerk. It is perfectly reasonable to want to protect yourself and your family from an unprecedented public health crisis. I tend towards being direct, so I would tell the person why they were not welcome, or only welcome under certain circumstances, but however you want to communicate to the relative how you are willing to see them is fine. I am constantly amazed at people like your relative who insist on making an already difficult and stressful situation like the pandemic more difficult and stressful and I think that they get away with it because they often don’t suffer any consequences for their bad behavior. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/58 "2021-05-13T14:07:37Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > So I’m justified in refusing to attend my daughter’s wedding in order to stick to my principles? Is she justified in preventing you from attending her wedding in order to stick to hers? > [@QuickSilver](#): > > I mean, I know we’ve been somewhat estranged for the past few years due to non-covid related factors, but I hoped we could patch it up and leave the past behind on this one occasion. I have a whole lot of differences with my parents. They supported Trump, and while they don’t quite buy into the big lie, they have some _questions_ about the election. But, they got vaccinated, so I visited and even gave my mother a hug on Mother’s day. > [@QuickSilver](#): > > And anyway, she’ll have her mom there (we’re divorced for many years) so it’s not like she can’t ask her step-dad to stand in for me. I guess if that’s what she prefers to getting a vaccine to protect both herself and around her, then the cost to her isn’t that high. Of course, if you cave, then she pays no cost at all. > [@QuickSilver](#): > > I hope you see the point I’m trying to make. Yes, that we should indulge in their stubborness by caving in and enabling it. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/59 "2021-05-13T14:08:39Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > So I’m justified in refusing to attend my daughter’s wedding in order to stick to my principles? I love and respect my daughter and new son-in-law so much for eloping and streaming their wedding recently just to avoid any awkward situations. I get your point, but there are so many valid, logical workarounds. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/60 "2021-05-13T14:19:20Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > I love and respect my daughter and new son-in-law so much for eloping and streaming their wedding recently just to avoid any awkward situations. > > I get your point, but there are so many valid, logical workarounds. I’d be overjoyed if my daughter and future son-in-law made that decision. I’m biting my tongue and hoping they will come around but it doesn’t seem to be in the cards given their current plans. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932/61 "2021-05-13T14:20:28Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > I’m biting my tongue and hoping they will come around but it doesn’t seem to be in the cards given their current plans. And why would they make that decision if they know that it comes at no personal cost to them? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-deal-with-anti-vax-relatives-who-want-to-hang-out/941932.md?page=4)