# How to dissuade a newbie Trump supporter?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551
**Category:** Great Debates
**Created:** [November 14, 2015, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551 "2015-11-14T13:30:46Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@HotDogWater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HotDogWater)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/1 "2015-11-14T13:30:46Z")
I have a friend who is excited that Trump is speaking in our city soon. When she asked me if I wanted to go with her, I laughed and said “He’s an idiot”. But that’s all I had.
Can someone please help me with concrete facts about his platform, history, and stances on issues that I can use to show I disagree with his candidacy?
Mods, if this is better suited to GD, please move. I rarely read that section and don’t have a feel for the dope over there 🙂
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### Author:  [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/2 "2015-11-14T13:56:33Z")
Why?
He’ll be gone as soon as the primaries start.
(FWIW, I prefer to characterize him as a blustering buffoon rather than an idiot, but YMMV.)
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### Author:  [@Rhythmdvl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhythmdvl)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/3 "2015-11-14T14:05:32Z")
Reported to suggest forum change
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### Author:  [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/4 "2015-11-14T14:17:35Z")
> [@HotDogWater](#):
>
> Can someone please help me with concrete facts about his platform, history, and stances on issues that I can use to show I disagree with his candidacy?
It sounds like you are asking us to explain why you don’t like Trump. Maybe you should start by explaining why you don’t like Trump.
Do you oppose billionaires seeking elected office? Do you find him personally offensive? Do you disagree with his policies? I think you can do the best job of explaining why you oppose him.
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### Author:  [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/5 "2015-11-14T14:29:42Z")
Although Trump has no real chance to win the nomination, his candidacy might help improve understanding of the GOP. Although I _strongly_ doubt it will happen, I’d _love_ to see Trump or Carson win the nomination. I’d certainly encourage all my Republican friends to support one or the other. (And I’m on record as preferring a Trump Presidency to a Cruz or Rubio.)
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### Author:  [@HotDogWater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HotDogWater)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/6 "2015-11-14T14:54:04Z")
Thanks \*\*Ravenman[/B, you’re right, of course. What I don’t like about Trump is that he seems to be all bluster, just saying things that get an emotional response out of people, without any real plans or initiatives. That’s why I’m trying to find concrete information about what he would do if elected. Not just the glurge he’s saying.
And it is that glurge that offends me. Misogyny and racism offend me. But I can’t tell my friend not to support him for that, because she says “He’s just telling it like it is! That’s why America needs him!” It is frustrating.
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### Author:  [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/7 "2015-11-14T15:32:09Z")
**Ravenman** got it almost right. You don’t need us to tell you why \*you \*don’t like Trump. You need us to tell you why \*your friend \*ought not like Trump. And she may well not like him for different reasons than you or I.
IOW it sounds like your friend wants all that cultural stuff Trump’s pushing. Just round up or wish away all the poor or brown folks and everybody left will be rich. Just shoot the men who don’t wear short hair and all the culture clash will be gone. etc. She \*likes \*that stuff. So you’re not going to convince her to not like it. Though you might convince yourself she’s not worth liking over that stuff.
Instead you want to find the things Trump actually stands for that she won’t like once she knows of it. And these are probably things not in his [del]propaganda[/del] public platform.
Things like: How does rearranging the economy & tax system to especially benefit billionaires even more than the last 30 years’ changes help you? If you’re wealthier now than you were then (correcting for your increased age and inflation), and have better prospects now than then, then Trump’s your man. If not; not.
etc.
As always when debunking a magician, the key is to look exactly where he’s not pointing.
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### Author:  [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/8 "2015-11-14T15:44:26Z")
Since this involves politics, let’s move it to Great Debates.
Colibri
General Questions Moderator
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### Author:  [@orcenio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/orcenio)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/9 "2015-11-14T15:48:51Z")
Good god, I would **NEVER** try to dissuade a Trump supporter. I want the dude to win. I can’t believe it, but you yanks found a NY equivalent to Silvio Berlusconi.
If you really do hand him the keys to your country, I’ll be taking bets til when Trump inevitably calls Merkel ‘an unfuckable lardass’ after fully tanking your economy.
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### Author:  [@Iggy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Iggy)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/10 "2015-11-14T15:53:04Z")
First you might try familiarizing yourself with what Trump’s positions on the issues are. You can go to Trump’s [website](https://www.donaldjtrump.com/positions) or an independent [site](http://www.ontheissues.org/Donald_Trump.htm).
CNN has a [piece](http://www.cnn.com/2015/06/20/politics/trump-announcement-speech/) from June of 2015 that reflects some of what he has been saying during his campaign.
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### Author:  [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/11 "2015-11-14T16:15:06Z")
> [@orcenio](#):
>
> Good god, I would **NEVER** try to dissuade a Trump supporter. I want the dude to win. I can’t believe it, but you yanks found a NY equivalent to Silvio Berlusconi…
>
> after fully tanking your economy.
😕 You seem to be hoping for the U.S. economy to tank. How does that help anyone? (Reduced economic activity might appear to suit some environmental goals. Is that the reason for your support? :dubious: )
I support Trump in his quest for the nomination, because I hope this may speed American politics to a needed cartharsis. I certainly don’t hope for Trump White House, but in the highly unlikely event it happened, I’d expect it to be much less bad and dangerous for the country than, say, a Cruz or Rand Presidency.
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### Author:  [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/12 "2015-11-14T16:17:50Z")
> [@orcenio](#):
>
> Good god, I would **NEVER** try to dissuade a Trump supporter. I want the dude to win. I can’t believe it, but you yanks found a NY equivalent to Silvio Berlusconi.
>
> If you really do hand him the keys to your country, I’ll be taking bets til when Trump inevitably calls Merkel ‘an unfuckable lardass’ after fully tanking your economy.
Well, while I do think that Trump will do that and because he is not supported by the establishment and moderate republicans, I do expect that Trump will be the first president to be not only impeached but kicked out of office.
However I do not think I want to have the pleasure to see that, because so much damage can take place before getting to that.
As for discouraging others, I still go for the old adage of “Show me your friends and I’ll tell you who you are” Trump is a bully that will ignore the laws and plant more hatred among Americans and will divide the nation even more.
> **[Donald Trump finds anti-immigrant ally in Sheriff Joe Arpaio](https://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/donald-trump-finds-anti-immigrant-ally-sheriff-joe-arpaio-msna637041)**
>
> Under ordinary circumstances, Arpaio would be seen as a toxic surrogate for a presidential campaign. But Trump’s candidacy thus far has been far from ordinary.
> [@](#):
>
> PHOENIX— With Donald Trump taking the stage here before thousands of people on Saturday, he only fanned the flames of the controversy swirling around his presidential campaign by standing on the same stage as a divisive figure in the immigration debate: Maricopa County Sheriff Joe Arpaio.
>
> Sheriff Joe, as he’s commonly referred to — the self-proclaimed “toughest sheriff in America” — is currently embroiled in a controversy of his own regarding immigration. A federal judge ruled in 2013 that Arpaio was unconstitutionally racially profiling Latinos. Now he faces being held in contempt of courtfor deliberately ignoring an order to stop. The long-running racial profiling case is expected to drag out through the summer. On top of it all, the 83-year-old sheriff has admitted that his attorney hired a private investigator to spy on the wife of the federal judge presiding over the case.
Yes, Trump decided to join Arpaio to the hip even if the Sheriff was already found to be by the courts to discriminate against minorities and that the Sheriff does think that he is above the law. Even the local paper called Arpaio “a bully with a badge”, so we are left with 2 options:
1. Trump ignores (willfully?) who he is getting involved with, so he is an incompetent regarding who he will appoint in a future cabinet and the kind of people that he will nominee for judges and other positions of power.
2. Or, Trump does know already who he is getting into bed with and he does not care. At all. Because he is indeed a racist bully with a chance of getting access to the most powerful military in the world.
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### Author:  [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/13 "2015-11-14T16:18:46Z")
> [@HotDogWater](#):
>
> I have a friend who is excited that Trump is speaking in our city soon. When she asked me if I wanted to go with her, I laughed and said “He’s an idiot”. But that’s all I had.
Go to the rally. [But take a book with you.](http://wics.com/news/local/springfield-woman-goes-viral-after-attending-trumps-speech)
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### Author:  [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/14 "2015-11-14T18:19:49Z")
Even if someone might want the country run like it were a business (a dubious proposition, but we’ll grant it for the sake of argument), do we really want the country run like Trump or Fiorina run a business?
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### Author:  [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/15 "2015-11-14T18:39:02Z")
What’s wrong with serial bankruptcy where ever more money flows to the guy in charge of causing it?
Sounds like an excellent business model. For the guy.
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### Author:  [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/16 "2015-11-14T20:00:05Z")
> [@HotDogWater](#):
>
> And it is that glurge that offends me. Misogyny and racism offend me. But I can’t tell my friend not to support him for that, because she says “He’s just telling it like it is! That’s why America needs him!” It is frustrating.
Maybe it’s time to tell your friend that you don’t like racists or misogynists. Racism and misogyny are not cute and they are not what America needs.
For that matter - why do you need friends who are racist and misogynist?
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### Author:  [@DinoR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DinoR)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/17 "2015-11-14T20:22:23Z")
> [@HotDogWater](#):
>
> Thanks \*\*Ravenman[/B, you’re right, of course. What I don’t like about Trump is that **he seems to be all bluster, just saying things that get an emotional response out of people, without any real plans or initiatives.** That’s why I’m trying to find concrete information about what he would do if elected. Not just the glurge he’s saying.
You nail it on the head with the highlighted part. Here’s the [positions](https://www.donaldjtrump.com/positions) he’s formally announced on his website. Even a number of those are heavy on the bluster and light on the details. There’s a theme of I an a strong, successful businessman trust me to be successful in making these areas better. He’s at least put some more meat on the bones. Those are his positions direct and unfiltered. If something raises questions in areas that you think would resonate with your friend it’s a start you can use to find out if his proposal is even remotely feasible and what the likely side effects are.
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### Author:  [@HotDogWater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HotDogWater)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/18 "2015-11-14T20:35:55Z")
All excellent pieces of advise, thank you folks. And **Merneith** , I like your style. My friend is not a racist or a misogynist, that’s what makes this so vexing. I think she just doesn’t see it in Trump, maybe because of being naive. I am going to start there with her, then move into the policies others here have led me to.
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### Author:  [@Locrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Locrian)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/19 "2015-11-14T20:56:44Z")
I am content with my opinion: No matter how much you like / dislike Trump, can you actually picture him doing a 14-16 hour a day job? He’d resign in a week. Ask your friend if he thinks he wants the job.
He’s dropping out, probably before January. Only question is which republican he will swing his votes towards.
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### Author:  [@Desert\_Nomad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desert_Nomad)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2015, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-dissuade-a-newbie-trump-supporter/737551/20 "2015-11-14T21:25:45Z")
> [@HotDogWater](#):
>
> I have a friend who is excited that Trump is speaking in our city soon. When she asked me if I wanted to go with her, I laughed and said “He’s an idiot”. But that’s all I had.
I don’t understand your response. I went to see both Bernie and Trump when they came to our city.
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