# How to effectively combat the Fox News propaganda machine? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 5, 2019, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305 "2019-10-05T05:59:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/21 "2019-10-05T16:14:17Z")
> [@Annoyed](#): > > So Fox News is bad but MSNBC is OK and totally not just as biased as Fox News. [yup](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_equivalence) ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/22 "2019-10-05T16:34:54Z")
> [@nelliebly](#): > > … And Fox has convinced many/most of them they can only trust Fox News. … Fox didn’t do that. The NYT, CNN, and MSNBC destroyed their reputations through their own bad acts. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/23 "2019-10-05T17:13:02Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Fox didn’t do that. The NYT, CNN, and MSNBC destroyed their reputations through their own bad acts. Ok. I’m assuming you are a fully functioning, fairly healthy, mental fit man who is fully employed and of at least average intelligence. Ok. So given these assumptions, I want to know by what rubric do you grade a news organizations trustworthiness? And please answer me fully and directly without the use of weasel words or vague handwaving. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/24 "2019-10-05T17:18:45Z")
@ the OP: Believe it or not, the best way to combat Fox News is actually to convince Trumpers that Fox has gone over to the liberal side. Right now, there is a significant amount of anger among Trumpers who feel that Fox is gradually being commandeered on the inside into morphing into another CNN/MSNBC-like liberal outlet. If that perception takes root, Fox News will crash and burn among its viewership. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/25 "2019-10-05T17:22:40Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Fox didn’t do that. The NYT, CNN, and MSNBC destroyed their reputations through their own bad acts. Cite please? Don’t just throw out a sentence to derail the debate. Please quantify the bad acts from some objective source. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/26 "2019-10-05T17:39:18Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > @ the OP: Believe it or not, the best way to combat Fox News is actually to convince Trumpers that Fox has gone over to the liberal side. Right now, there is a significant amount of anger among Trumpers who feel that Fox is gradually being commandeered on the inside into morphing into another CNN/MSNBC-like liberal outlet. If that perception takes root, Fox News will crash and burn among its viewership. Well if were just asserting outcomes here, why not go whole hog? The best way to combat Fox News is to actually convince the world it doesnt exist! Or would that be the best way for Fox News to win?? Foxzer Sousay News!! And Poof!! It’s gone! ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/27 "2019-10-05T17:40:26Z")
> [@nelliebly](#): > > It’s hard to overestimate the impact Fox News has on the US political scene. It’s a highly effective ultra-conservative > > Regular Fox News viewers obediently swallow whatever the Fox propaganda machine tells them, including that climate change is a hoax and that the impeachment inquiry is a Democratic witch hunt. And Fox has convinced many/most of them they can only trust Fox News. I’m out of patience and would like to shove every Fox-News-Lovin’ climate change denier and impeachment obstructionist out of the way so the rest of us can do what needs to be done. I won’t, obviously (Nellie is jelly.), but how do we ever get the truth to these people? The best way is to simply expose it for what it is. Jon Stewart did a great job of this. There is no shame in calling out bullshit as bullshit, and I wish more standard over-the-air media outlets did so. (Hell, Faux news and the so-called president have no problem calling actual, real things “fake news”) The people who are tricked by Faux are misinformed. The answer is to inform them. The problem is, lots of them don’t care to be. But if there are those who just naively think they’re being informed, perhaps a reminder that they’re not could actually help. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/28 "2019-10-05T18:08:26Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > The idea that Fox News is brainwashing an obedient audience of sheeple is akin to focusing on lobbying organizations like the NRA or AARP as fonts of Evil, rather than recognizing that the stances of these organizations strike a strong chord in their constituencies. Their successes reflect genuinely held (if often dead wrong) beliefs held by their audiences/members. Attacking the Evil Groups misses the point. I think that’s like claiming a piece of paper is saying the words somebody wrote on it. Sure people watch Fox because it reflects their strongly held beliefs. But they got these strongly held beliefs from watching Fox. Look at climate change for an example; do you think the people who believe it’s all a hoax are basing that belief on some scientific research that they conducted? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/29 "2019-10-05T18:20:02Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > The problem is, lots of them don’t care to be. But if there are those who just naively think they’re being informed, perhaps a reminder that they’re not could actually help. Telling somebody they already know everything they need to know is a lot more attractive message than telling them they need to learn something. Fox viewer: “Climate control is a hoax.” Non-Fox viewer: “I think you’re misinformed. Here’s the evidence that climate change is real.” Fox: “Did you hear that? He just called you stupid! He’s attacking you! So ignore what he’s saying!” Fox viewer: “Hey mister, I don’t like that kind of talk.” Fox: “And all his evidence is just lies put out by the lamestream media! Don’t believe it!” Fox viewer: “And I don’t need to hear any of your fake news.” Fox: “And you’re an independent thinker who doesn’t just repeat what people tell you.” Fox viewer: “And I’m an independent thinker who doesn’t just repeat what people tell you… uh… I mean me.” ---
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/30 "2019-10-05T18:26:52Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > The idea that Fox News is brainwashing an obedient audience of sheeple is akin to focusing on lobbying organizations like the NRA or AARP as fonts of Evil, rather than recognizing that the stances of these organizations strike a strong chord in their constituencies. Their successes reflect genuinely held (if often dead wrong) beliefs held by their audiences/members. Attacking the Evil Groups misses the point. > > Fox is merely a more extreme example of what’s been plaguing the major media for a long time - framing the news to please a constituency while avoiding hard-hitting editorials clearly labeled as such. This process has accelerated under Trump and ensures that opposing camps seek out their preferred filters. When CNN and the AP blatantly editorialize in their news stories\* it just encourages the belief of right-wingers that the MSM is out to get them. > > Fox obviously does run commentary aimed at minimalizing or mocking climate change activism, but pretty much [plays it straight](https://www.foxnews.com/world/global-climate-strike-skipping-school-demonstrations) in much of its actual reporting. > > \*“but it’s twue! it’s twue!!” :rolleyes: **Jackmannii** , of course Fox News is giving a segment of the population news that conforms to and confirms their own worldview. Furthermore, they do it in a way even less-educated people can understand. That’s why people with no more than high school diploma are much more likely to watch Fox. Clear back in 1994, [Rupert Murdoch had a clear idea](https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2019/03/11/the-making-of-the-fox-news-white-house)of what Fox News would offer, and it wasn’t responsible journalism for discerning viewers: > [@](#): > > Unlike the three established networks, which vied for the same centrist viewers, his creation would follow the unapologetically lowbrow model of the tabloids that he published in Australia and England, and appeal to a narrow audience that would be entirely his. His core viewers, he said, would be football fans; with this aim in mind, he had just bought the rights to broadcast N.F.L. games. Hundt told me, “What he was really saying was that he was going after a working-class audience. He was going to carve out a base—what would become the Trump base." But those whose views Fox News reflects _and_ shapes were part of the population long before 1996, when FN first aired; they were simply not convinced they were well-informed or mainstream, and they were not the political force they’ve become. As Fox surged ahead in popularity, CNN was forced to employ some of the same tactics. MSNBC didn’t take to the airwaves as the liberal’s Fox News until 2002. And Fox News is consistently found to contain more bias than any other news network. So the “Gee, Ma, all the kids are doing it!” defense is a dud. ’ Sure, there’s some straight reporting on Fox–covering a hurricane or a 42-car pileup–but what gets reported and what doesn’t is also important. Fox had confirmation on the Stormy Daniels story by October 2016 but [killed it so it wouldn’t interfere with the election.](https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2019/03/11/the-making-of-the-fox-news-white-house) And its symbiotic relationship with the Trump White House is unprecedented. > [@](#): > > Joe Peyronnin, a professor of journalism at N.Y.U., was an early president of Fox News, in the mid-nineties. “I’ve never seen anything like it before,” he says of Fox. “It’s as if the President had his own press organization. It’s not healthy.” That’s putting it mildly. And it’s why you should be concerned–very, very concerned. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/31 "2019-10-05T19:06:37Z")
We, the people, don’t care about trustworthiness. We care about power. That’s why we have rewarded dishonesty and corruption in government for all these decades regardless of who or what party was nominally in control. As long as enough lucre is flowing to the right special interests nothing will change. The news media are tailored to be profitable by acquiring mindshare. You don’t get mindshare unless you emotionally resonate with your audience. ---
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/32 "2019-10-05T19:56:56Z")
I just now realized I somehow cut off the last sentence of the first paragraph in the OP. It should have read “highly effective conservative propaganda machine.” I guess people could figure that out, but it bothers me that I left a fragment in there. My apologies. ---
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/33 "2019-10-05T19:58:58Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Fox didn’t do that. The NYT, CNN, and MSNBC destroyed their reputations through their own bad acts. Ladies and gentlemen, I give you Exhibit A: how Fox News convinces regular viewers they can’t trust any other news network. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/34 "2019-10-05T20:07:16Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > Ok. I’m assuming you are a fully functioning, fairly healthy, mental fit man who is fully employed and of at least average intelligence. Ok. So given these assumptions, I want to know by what rubric do you grade a news organizations trustworthiness? And please answer me fully and directly without the use of weasel words or vague handwaving. Come on man. Im holding my breath and im beginning to struggle! ---
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/35 "2019-10-05T20:27:50Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > The best way is to simply expose it for what it is. Jon Stewart did a great job of this. There is no shame in calling out bullshit as bullshit, and I wish more standard over-the-air media outlets did so. (Hell, Faux news and the so-called president have no problem calling actual, real things “fake news”) The people who are tricked by Faux are misinformed. The answer is to inform them. The problem is, lots of them don’t care to be. But if there are those who just naively think they’re being informed, perhaps a reminder that they’re not could actually help. That’s an idea. I don’t know how many Fox viewers watched Jon Stewart. I’m guessing most of his audience skewed liberal even though he also called out liberal politicians’ BS. We’d need a viewer vehicle that, like Murdoch’s tabloids, is geared toward conservative concrete thinkers who don’t like their thinking challenged but that also challenges Fox in a subtle (at first) way. In more fanciful moments, I imagine subliminal messages embedded in NASCAR racers: F-o-o-o-O-X I-I-I-S fa-a-a-AKE n-e-e-EWS. On a more serious note, maybe the answer lies in online news sources and social media, where most people under 50 get their news, but I’m not sure how that would work. Name the source American Patriots News or something that would appeal to conservatives and frame stories so that they don’t put Fox viewers’ backs up? Honestly, I think the source would have to BE conservative but a Never Trumper conservative that would strongly appeal to the same demographic while actually giving the whole story AND slowly loosening the Fox stranglehold. AND it’d have to be almost ubiquitous. Probably not too realistic, right? ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/36 "2019-10-05T20:54:06Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > Well, ISTM you did, and then went ahead and said it again. …except I didn’t, then I didn’t do it again. > [@](#): > > My point – and I stand by it – is that there are tons of responsible major media that do a good job of informing the public, even if they’re far from perfect and sometimes have mercenary considerations like sensationalism, which is why I have more respect for public broadcasters outside the US than most American media. That’s all well-and-good and everything but it doesn’t mean jack-shit when the people targeted by the propaganda never actually get a chance to see it. We all personally curate what news we consume now. Twitter and facebook feeds show only the things that people want to see. If you follow Trump on Twitter and the Whitehouse and ICE and Fox News and a few other conservative commentators then all you will ever see and hear about is what it is they want to tell you. The free press is not a counter to this. It doesn’t combat this. It runs parallel to this in what is essentially another reality. > [@](#): > > But the NYT, Washington Post, CNN, etc. do fine journalism most of the time, or at least, adequate and responsible journalism. Doing fine journalism most of the time really isn’t enough right now. Many have argued that the Hillary email story turned the last election. How they cover and how they frame impeachment could turn the next election. But again: not the point. We are talking about countering propaganda. The free press isn’t the best method to counter propaganda, not in today’s information age. I pointed you to the official Whitehouse twitter feed yesterday. Go look at it again today. [https://twitter.com/WhiteHouse](https://twitter.com/WhiteHouse) Look at how much more propaganda has been mainlined directly to the eyeballs of the people that follow it. Look at this tweet. > > [@the Whitehouse](#): > > Millions of Americans lost their healthcare coverage and doctors under Obamacare, after being promised that they could keep them. > > Now, radical Democrats are trying to do away with healthcare choice altogether. Posted two hours ago. By the Whitehouse. Can you imagine that happening under any other administration? Do you remember a couple of years ago at the start of the Trump regime when the Whitehouse twitter feed at least pretended not to be so partisan? I’ve just gone to Google News and searched for Obamacare and nobody has covered that. No mention of it at all. The only hit I got was the press release from the Whitehouse. The free press hasn’t done anything to counter this bit of propaganda. In the two hours since then the feed has retweeted 5 additional pieces of insanity, none of it countered by the free press. The free press isn’t prepared nor is it able to counter this. Trump & Co are spending millions of dollars on facebook advertising that none of us ever get the chance to see because it isn’t targeted at us. The free press doesn’t counter any of this. > [@](#): > > It’s odd that you think CNN is kowtowing to the powers that be as they are becoming rather vehemently anti-Trump and have been on the warpath since at least the time Trump tried to ban one of their White House reporters. That isn’t what I said. I said: “Here is an absolutely fawning profile of Kellyanne Conway by CNN.” Did you read it? Did you watch it? It was an absolutely fawning profile of Kellyanne Conway by CNN. This is the same CNN that at one point hired [Sarah Isgur](https://www.vox.com/2019/2/19/18231993/cnn-gop-operative-2020-election-coverage?__c=1) as a political editor. (They have since redefined her role) CNN can be anti-Trump and they can be ANGRY that they tried to ban Jim Acosta and still not be an effective counter to Whitehouse propaganda. Both can be true. > [@](#): > > The Washington Post, for its part, has said that Jeff Bezos has never once in any way meddled with their editorial policy. I really think you’re greatly exaggerating the problems with the major mainstream media. I’m not exaggerating at all. I’ve consistently said that by and large they do good journalism. But good journalism isn’t enough. And the lapses are important and big enough they actually make a difference. Good journalism isn’t enough to counter the flood of propaganda that has been unleashed by this administration. There is too much of it. Information overload. Its all over the place and its happening under the radar. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/37 "2019-10-05T20:54:36Z")
> [@nelliebly](#): > > That’s an idea. I don’t know how many Fox viewers watched Jon Stewart. … > … Yeah, that’s why I think over the air broadcast sources are good. You’re online idea is good, too. I think a lot of these numpties are getting turned online. 4-chan, Alex Jones, etc. The old folks in front of their TVs, not so much. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/38 "2019-10-05T23:04:00Z")
> [@nelliebly](#): > > Ladies and gentlemen, I give you Exhibit A: how Fox News convinces regular viewers they can’t trust any other news network. I almost never watch Fox News (I don’t have cable). The other networks have done plenty to [erode the trust the public (once) had in them all on their own](https://content.gallup.com/origin/gallupinc/GallupSpaces/Production/Cms/POLL/2edrgnvmrk2uhaoxiyymqw.png). Set aside the partisans for a moment; just look at the independents: 20 years ago, 55% of them trusted mass media. Today it’s only 36%. I don’t think independents got that way by watching Fox News 24/7. Do you? ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/39 "2019-10-05T23:27:03Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > Cite please? Don’t just throw out a sentence to derail the debate. Please quantify the bad acts from some objective source. It’s not ‘derailing’ the debate, it _is_ the debate. Posts #2, #8, #9, #10, #11, #12, #14, #18, #19 ALL referenced other media outlets prior to my post #22. As for cites, I’m not sure what you’d like. I posted a graphic in my previous post showing the decline in independents’ trust in the media. How about these quotes from posters in this thread: > [@Ambivalid](#): > > … But, when delivering the news or exercising this free press conflicts with the bottom line, and that bottom line dictates the shaping of that political narrative, the bottom line always will win.every time. Its blatant on propaganda machines like Fox News. But it is much more subtle and therefore insidious, in left of center media sources, including but not limited to cable news like MSNBC. > > They soften the edges here, they gloss over little inconvenient details there and in the process write there own narratives. Narratives to attract eyeballs and advertisers. But its not just the money. Its also the ideology propelling these clashing narratives. The ads and the eyeballs and the ideology all, at least at times, take precendence over pure objective fact re the state of the country and the world. … Ambivalid calls the “left of center media sources” “subtle and therefore insidious”. The only word I’d quibble with is “subtle”. > [@Jackmannii](#): > > … Fox is merely a more extreme example of what’s been plaguing the major media for a long time - framing the news to please a constituency while avoiding hard-hitting editorials clearly labeled as such. This process has accelerated under Trump and ensures that opposing camps seek out their preferred filters. When CNN and the AP blatantly editorialize in their news stories\* it just encourages the belief of right-wingers that the MSM is out to get them. > > … > > \*“but it’s twue! it’s twue!!” :rolleyes: Jackmannii can see that CNN and the AP editorialize in the their news stories. So do many of the rest of us. > [@wolfpup](#): > > … It’s odd that you think CNN is kowtowing to the powers that be as they are becoming rather vehemently anti-Trump and have been on the warpath since at least the time Trump tried to ban one of their White House reporters. … If wolfpup can notice that CNN is “on the warpath” and “vehemently anti-Trump” then I imagine a great many independents and conservatives can detect the same bias. People know CNN isn’t playing it straight. If you don’t trust our fellow dopers, here are some additional cites: [NBC - Media bias against conservatives is real, and part of the reason no one trusts the news now](https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/media-bias-against-conservatives-real-part-reason-no-one-trusts-ncna895471) [NY Post - Former NPR CEO opens up about liberal media bias](https://nypost.com/2017/10/21/the-other-half-of-america-that-the-liberal-media-doesnt-cover/) [WaPo - Why bias gets worse, not better, in the MSM](https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/right-turn/wp/2014/05/05/why-bias-gets-worse-not-better-in-the-msm/) [’60 Minutes’ Lara Logan Calls Out the MSM on Their Bias](https://newstalk1290.com/60-minutes-lara-logan-calls-out-the-msm-on-their-bias/) Would you like me to recount some of the MSM’s recent fuck-ups? ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2019, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305/40 "2019-10-05T23:29:44Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > Ok. I’m assuming you are a fully functioning, fairly healthy, mental fit man who is fully employed and of at least average intelligence. Ok. So given these assumptions, I want to know by what rubric do you grade a news organizations trustworthiness? And please answer me fully and directly without the use of weasel words or vague handwaving. I don’t have a “rubric” and I don’t “grade” news organizations’ trustworthiness. Is that a direct-enough answer for you? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-effectively-combat-the-fox-news-propaganda-machine/841305.md?page=3)