# How to Fake Steve Fossett's Death? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 29, 2008, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099 "2008-07-29T16:33:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/1 "2008-07-29T16:33:56Z")
Rumors on MSNBC are being reported that Steve Fossett may have faked his own death. Seems unlikely to me. Any historic examples of the fake-your-death thing only being found out years later? Does it ever work? OK, let’s make it easy. Assume the wife (of an unnamed billionaire adventurer just like Steve Fossett) is in on it. He files a flight plan to go north. He heads south, maybe into Mexico. The searchers find nothing. The wife declares him dead. She collects the insurance (do very rich people have life insurance?). What complications does he now face? 1. Getting rid of the plane. They are all traced by safety guys. Got to destroy it and bury it. 2. Got to have a place to live. Not too hard. A place in Arizona, maybe his widow’s guest house. Can you trust the servants? Can he never safely go out to dinner again? 3. Got to have a cash flow. No problem, he can live off what his wife draws from the accounts. 4. Medical issues. All older people have health problems. Will be never see a doctor again? How about his prescriptions? 5. What else? ---
**Author:** ![lieu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c2a13f/32.png) [@lieu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lieu)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/2 "2008-07-29T16:46:26Z")
If he fakes his death, what does he gain? It seems to me that he had all the money he needed. No compelling reason there. He’d also lose the ability to attempt more record breaking flights and be given credit for them. His face is widely known due to all the publicity he garnered on previous flights. That’s a real complication. Finally, if caught there’s a chance he’d be jailed and would lose his freedom. Complications abound. I can’t see a reason in the world his disappearance would be construed as anything other than legit. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/3 "2008-07-29T16:48:18Z")
I agree. It seems, on the face of it, that this dog will not hunt. Still an interesting little mental puzzle. ---
**Author:** ![yojimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yojimbo/32/232_2.png) [@yojimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yojimbo)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/4 "2008-07-29T16:48:29Z")
> **[John Darwin disappearance case](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Darwin_disappearance_case)** > > The John Darwin disappearance case involved the faked death of the British former teacher and prison officer John Darwin. Darwin turned up alive in December 2007, five and a half years after he was believed to have died in a canoeing accident. The confession of John Darwin's wife to Dave Ward formed a large part of the case. > Darwin was arrested and charged with fraud. His wife, Anne, was also arrested and charged for helping Darwin to collect his life insurance of £250,000. The fraudulent cla... That’s a recent story of a guy and his wife who faked his death to make some money. He couldn’t do it properly though and after a few years tried to re-surfaced into his life. It’s a crazy story and well worth a read. Fossett is dead though AFAIC. I don’t really see the why he would have faked it. Do the rumors give any possible motive? ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/5 "2008-07-29T16:54:18Z")
Some talk of marital problems, but that makes it even tougher to do. ---
**Author:** ![Half\_Man\_Half\_Wit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/half_man_half_wit/32/21766_2.png) [@Half\_Man\_Half\_Wit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Half_Man_Half_Wit)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/6 "2008-07-29T16:59:10Z")
[This article](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2462912/Adventurer-Steve-Fossett-'may-have-faked-his-own-death'.html) cites ‘personal problems or fears about his business dealings’ as possible reasons – not terribly compelling. Still, when I read it, I thought, ‘great, I can actually watch a conspiracy theory\* unfold!’ \*Are those faked his own death/is really dead and was replaced by a lookalike/really was killed by Courtney Love kind of deals properly called conspiracy theories, or is there a separate name for those? ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/7 "2008-07-29T18:08:44Z")
[QUOTE=Paul in Saudi] Any historic examples of the fake-your-death thing only being found out years later? Does it ever work? [/QUOTE] A difficult question to answer, because if it really works, no one will ever find out. It may be a very common scam, but if no one is ever caught, how would we know? ---
**Author:** ![Szlater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/90ced4/32.png) [@Szlater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Szlater)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/8 "2008-07-29T18:14:09Z")
Aren’t MSNBC be running the risk of a libel action from his family, or can one defame the dead with impunity? ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/9 "2008-07-29T18:41:15Z")
Also, does faking one’s own death, in and of itself, break any laws? Obviously there are some attendant activities (collecting insurance, frex) that would qualify as fraud, but does the deliberate creation of a scenario in which death will be assumed by the authorities, and then keeping silent when the relevant paperwork is filed, violate any law? ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/10 "2008-07-29T18:52:54Z")
[QUOTE=Szlater] Aren’t MSNBC be running the risk of a libel action from his family, or can one defame the dead with impunity?[/QUOTEAs I understand the law, it’s a general principle that ‘the dead can not be libeled’. Presumably because the victim of the libel has to show actual damages, and how can a dead person suffer damages? ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/11 "2008-07-29T18:58:37Z")
Addressing Point 1, it’s reported: > [@](#): > > Fossett chose a light stunt aircraft which could be easily dismantled and hidden, a type he did NOT like. [Link](http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,24088144-661,00.html) ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/12 "2008-07-29T19:37:22Z")
[QUOTE=Paul in Saudi] Rumors on MSNBC are being reported that Steve Fossett may have faked his own death. Seems unlikely to me. [/quote] Unlikely to me, too - what would motivate him to do that? > [@](#): > > OK, let’s make it easy. Assume the wife (of an unnamed billionaire adventurer just like Steve Fossett) is in on it. He files a flight plan to go north. He heads south, maybe into Mexico. The type of aircraft and flight he was on does not require a flight plan in the US (although elsewhere it would). He simply did not file one. Could he have head south to Mexico? Sure. Getting past the border might be problematic given that there is surveillance there but it’s far from impossible, especially if he flew at night with no running lights. If he gets caught he’s in deep do-do, on the other hand, he can afford a good lawyer. However, the airplane he was in clearly had a US license number (starts with an “N”, as opposed to what Mexican airplanes use - an “X” if I recall correctly but don’t quote me on that) so wherever he landed would know it’s a US aircraft if the people seeing the landing were at all conversant with aviation. On the other hand he could have easily landed that airplane “in the bush” - I flew a similar model of airplane off and on for two years and they perform great on rough fields > [@](#): > > The searchers find nothing. The wife declares him dead. She collects the insurance (do very rich people have life insurance?). Insurance or not, she got a $10 million estate out of the situation. > [@](#): > > 1. Getting rid of the plane. They are all traced by safety guys. Got to destroy it and bury it. Naw, just burn it - it’s mostly wood and dacron. It will burn VERY nicely, especially if you start the fire with the remaining gasoline on board. Sell the remaining aluminum and steel scrap to a recycler, or bust it apart and leave it in a remote area. Make sure the numbers/letters on the side of the fuselage and the dataplate are destroyed/removed. > [@](#): > > 1. Got to have a place to live. Not too hard. A place in Arizona, maybe his widow’s guest house. Can you trust the servants? Can he never safely go out to dinner again? Got me - why not Tahiti? Or Argentina? > [@](#): > > 1. Got to have a cash flow. No problem, he can live off what his wife draws from the accounts. If she’s in on the deal. > [@](#): > > 1. Medical issues. All older people have health problems. Will be never see a doctor again? How about his prescriptions? Well, not ALL old people have health problems - my father is nearly 80 and requires no medication. His father lived into his 90’s with the same good health. I have never heard of Fossett having any particular health condition, and if he takes of himself he could live a couple more decades in good health. If he sets up shop in a third world country AND has access to funds funneled to him by his wife he could afford doctors and drugs with no problem. From the linked article, a couple of points I wish to address. > [@](#): > > ROUND-THE-WORLD adventurer Steve Fossett may have faked his own death following revelations he had an amazing double life and kept secret mistresses. Not that secret - or that unusual for wealthy businessmen. I had heard rumors of infidelity from both the Chicago aviation community and the Chicago sailing community (Fossett had strong ties to both). > [@](#): > > The globally accepted story is that 63-year-old adventurer Fossett - friend of Virgin tycoon Richard Branson and the first man to fly non-stop round the earth in a hot air balloon - died last September 3 when his final flight in a light plane over the Nevada desert went tragically wrong. Personally, that’s MY belief, too. I don’t see any reason to suspect otherwise. > [@](#): > > But now the official search spokeswoman, Lieutenant Colonel Cynthia Ryan of the US Civil Air Patrol, has told the News of the World she believes he may NOT have crashed. > > She said: “Anything is possible. There are a lot of raised eyebrows - even more so now. I know very few people here, friends in law enforcement, that buy this story like the rest of the world has.” Why not? The best pilot can come to grief on a flight. Maybe she’s pissed (or being pissed on) because she couldn’t find the guy. You know what, a _lot_ of airplanes gone missing in the desert southwest have _never_ been found (although the search for Fossett turned up one or two that had been missing a couple decades). The ONLY unusual thing here is the fame of the missing person. If it had been Joe Blow from Tempe no one would care this much. > [@](#): > > SECRET MISTRESSES: Fossett cheated on his wife with TWO lovers in an amazing double life. As I said, NOT that unusual in high powered business men and not a shock to those in the Chicago flying and sailing communities. > [@](#): > > BAFFLING CHOICE OF PLANE: Fossett chose a light stunt aircraft which could be easily dismantled and hidden, a type he did NOT like. But a type excellent for the sort of alleged scouting for location flight he said he was conducting. Also, very hard for papparazzi to track. Easily dismantled? Um… relatively speaking, I guess, but it’s not like you could take it apart with a wrench in a half an hour. Me, if I had to “dispose” of such an aircraft I’d choose fire, but whatever… > [@](#): > > NO EMERGENCY KIT: Despite a lifetime’s experience he supposedly set off on the three-hour flight in just T-shirt and shorts with no parachute or his regular global positioning system watch. It’s called “overconfidence” and kills pilots. T-shirt and shorts really is a common “uniform” for flying a Decathalon, and if you aren’t planning on conducting stunt flying (which he was not) you don’t need a parachute. :rolleyes: I don’t know about the whole watch thing, but Fossett learned to fly before we had GPS AND he’s made several solo round the world voyages so I’ll assume he’s a competent navigator. Me, in that part of the world I’d worry about taking some emergency water along, but I wouldn’t bother with a parachute, either, and I’d wear cool, lightweight clothing. Also crank open the air vents as wide as possible, it can get toasty hot in those things on a sunny day. Maybe leave the door on the ground and keep the left-side window open, too, for maximum ventilation. > [@](#): > > TAKE-OFF PUZZLE: The only witness who says he saw Fossett fly off has never been quizzed by the authorities. Why would he be questioned? Is there some doubt he took off in an airplane? It’s where he went _after_ that which is in question, isn’t it? > [@](#): > > TRACKER RIDDLE: The plane was fitted with a satellite rescue beacon to pinpoint its position for rescuers but no signal was ever received. And that is more common than people would like to know. Here’s how the signal could fail to function: 1. It was never activated. For instance, if Fossett made a safe landing in the bush, walked away from the airplane, then came to grief the beacon would never activate. (Or if he snuck off to fake his death) 2. It wound up underwater, like at the bottom of a river or lake. Given that he was flying over desert this is sort of unlikely but bodies of water do exist in remote locations. 3. The beacon wound up way down in a canyon or elsewise blocked by rock formations. It could transmit til doomsday, but the signal would never reach the satellites. The terrain he was flying over was rugged enough for that to be plausible. 4. Someone forgot to change the damn batteries on the beacon. Yes, these things are supposed to be checked regularly but crap happens. 5. He crashed with sufficient force to destroy the beacon. That’s sort of tough, as the beacons are tough, and usually in the tail of the plane which _usually_ hits last and is least destroyed, but hey, weird things happen. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/13 "2008-07-29T19:43:04Z")
[QUOTE=Szlater] Aren’t MSNBC be running the risk of a libel action from his family, or can one defame the dead with impunity? [/quote] Legally, the dead have no reputation and cannot be defamed. His family could sue, but they’d have to prove reckless disregard on the part of MSNBC, which is difficult. ---
**Author:** ![cwthree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de0a6/32.png) [@cwthree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cwthree)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/14 "2008-07-29T20:10:30Z")
[QUOTE=Paul in Saudi] Any historic examples of the fake-your-death thing only being found out years later? Does it ever work? [/QUOTE] One of my great-grandfathers (hey, you didn’t say it had to be famous, just historic) faked his own death. He had a history of drinking and erratic behavior, so when he went missing and his clothes were found on the bank of a nearby river, it was assumed that he’d either committed suicide or gone in swimming and drowned. Years later, his brother died. The brother had no living relatives, so my great-grandfather’s kids cleaned out the house, etc. Among his documents was a letter from my great-grandfather dated some years after his disappearance. In the letter, he explained that he was, in fact, alive and living a couple hundred miles away under a different name. He said that he was sick and pretty sure he was going to die, and apparently he wanted to clear up some things before that happened. He didn’t die, and in fact remarried under his new name. My grandmother (his daughter) has met her half-sister from his second marriage. Bear in mind that great-grandpa’s apparent death and resurrection happened in the early part of the 20th century. Communications, record-keeping, and the labor market being what they were, it was considerably easier than it is today to drop out of one identity and pick up a new one. ---
**Author:** ![beowulff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beowulff/32/542_2.png) [@beowulff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beowulff)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/15 "2008-07-29T21:16:46Z")
If there is someone famous who died suspiciously, had plenty of resources, and had good reason to fake his own death, it was Ken Lay. Just sayn’… ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/16 "2008-07-29T21:51:47Z")
[QUOTE=beowulff] If there is someone famous who died suspiciously, had plenty of resources, and had good reason to fake his own death, it was Ken Lay. Just sayn’… [/QUOTE] But didn’t they find his body? ---
**Author:** ![beowulff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beowulff/32/542_2.png) [@beowulff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beowulff)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/17 "2008-07-29T22:07:42Z")
[QUOTE=Cisco] But didn’t they find his body? [/QUOTE] They found _ **A** _ body… I thought of this as soon as I heard the news - it would really only take paying off a couple of key people. ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/18 "2008-07-29T22:25:44Z")
Just for speculation’s sake, I’ll try to offer a plausable scenario. 1. Let’s say that Fossett has a friend (or a bribed confederate) who owns an aircraft maintenance facility at a remote airfield somewhere in the Southwest. The friend/confederate is in on the plot. They’d have several options for disposing of the plane. They could repaint the plane (to disguise its appearance) and sell it to an unknowing third party. They could dismantle it and sell it for parts, not unlike what happens to most stolen cars. Or they could just scrap the plane. 2. I don’t think anomnimity is really that much of a problem. Steve Fossett is simply not that famous that he wouldn’t be able to walk down the street without people recognizing him. That sort of “honor” is usually reserved for movie stars, heads of state, and other ultra-visible people. Even if someone did say, “Hey, you look like Steve Fossett,” he’d just have to say that the person must be mistaken, and maybe show whatever fake ID he’s obtained. As long as he stays away from family and close friends, he could probably do OK. 3)Probably not a problem. I personally wouldn’t know how to hide a lot of money, but plenty of people do. 4)Again, probably not a big problem. It might be a bit strange that an obviously well-to-do man is paying his medical bills in cash, but as far as I know doctors only contact authorities in a few special cases. (If you have certain dangerous diseases, if they think you’re molesting a minor, and if they think you might committ suicide are the ones which come to mind at the moment) Aside from those cases, your health is not something that the authorities or the general public need to know about. 1. If he flew to Mexico, it might make things much easier. There’s a lot of governmental corruption down there. A well-placed bribe or two could get him a new ID. ---
**Author:** ![B\_A\_Bay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/dec6dc/32.png) [@B\_A\_Bay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/B_A_Bay)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2008, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/19 "2008-07-30T00:13:13Z")
The problem is you don’t have ten million in cash. It’s too hard to maintain large sums of cash and not leave any trace of it. If he was planning this he’d have had to divert fund to store the cash. This diversion is traceable. It’s highly unlikely someone who is a millionaire is going to be satisfied living on a substance level after years and years of being comfortable. Furthermore, the problem of ID comes up. He couldn’t get any after the crash as he is recognizable, and if he planned and faked his death, this means someone knows and got him ID. Again this leaves the problem of this guy diverting enough funds to pay someone off so they won’t tell. This leaves a solution of a friend who will agree to hide him, the best place to hide is in an inner city among poorer people who pay their rent and mind their business and aren’t apt to watch a lot of TV. With his money he COULD do it, but it would require way too many hardships for no reason. People do disappear but those who stay lost tend to be those who no one wants to find anyway or long since dead. If you’ve ever driven out west you can go, literally hours, without meeting a car or seeing a house. It would be easily plausible the guy’s body was scavanged by coyotes, vultures, and God knows what else, so he’s just a pile of bones, covered up by dust and in another few decades when suburan life comes in to build a new house those bones will be found ---
**Author:** ![amarone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e0b2c6/32.png) [@amarone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarone)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2008, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099/20 "2008-07-30T00:22:19Z")
[QUOTE=Paul in Saudi] Rumors on MSNBC are being reported that Steve Fossett may have faked his own death. Seems unlikely to me. Any historic examples of the fake-your-death thing only being found out years later? Does it ever work? [/QUOTE] British MP [John Stonehouse](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Stonehouse) faked his own death on a Miami beach but it was not very successful as he was caught a month later in Australia, ironically by police who believed he was [Lord Lucan](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_John_Bingham%2C_7th_Earl_of_Lucan) who vanished after (presumably) killing his children’s nanny. Lucan has never been found, albeit he did not meet the OP’s criteria as he did not fake his own death. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fake-steve-fossetts-death/458099.md?page=2)