# How to fly the flag without supporting the current jokers? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 28, 2007, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780 "2007-05-28T13:25:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Miscue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8491ac/32.png) [@Miscue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miscue)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2007, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/21 "2007-05-28T20:43:21Z")
Fly that doggone thing. I decided years ago I’d refuse to let them steal the flag from me the way they stole morality. Just be glad they haven’t gotten Rock and Roll yet. Or humor (and don’t say Dennis Miller unless you want me to shoot you in the stomach). ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2007, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/22 "2007-05-28T22:54:35Z")
[QUOTE=Boyo Jim] These shit for brains are fucking DISMANTLING my country before my very eyes. That’s worthy of a flag flying at half staff, but there’s probably some rule against that. [/QUOTE] Actually, I think flags are supposed to be flown at half-staff on Memorial Day. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2007, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/23 "2007-05-29T00:46:54Z")
[QUOTE=Der Trihs] Perhaps have a sign on or near the flagpole saying something like “Up With America, Down With Bush !” … [/QUOTE] Hey, are you actually softening towards America a little? That did not sound like the hatred of America, that so many of us have come to expect from you. It also sounded like a good compromise. [QUOTE=BrainGlutton] Actually, I think flags are supposed to be flown at half-staff on Memorial Day. [/QUOTE] IIRC: Only on a flag pole raised with a halyard and only until noon. Jim Added reference: > [@](#): > > Displaying the flag at half staff on MEMORIAL DAY > > On Memorial Day the flag is flown at half-staff only until NOON. The proper sequence for displaying the flag on this holiday we have set aside to remember the more than one million men and women who have died in defense of our Nation is: > > In the morning the flag should be attached to the halyard and raised briskly to the top of the flag pole, then slowly lowered to the mid-way point of the pole. > At noon the flag should be raised to the top of the flag pole. > At the end of the day the flag should be slowly and ceremoniously lowered and removed. ---
**Author:** ![Charger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/df788c/32.png) [@Charger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charger)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2007, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/24 "2007-05-29T01:37:45Z")
Frankly, I think there’s something wrong with people who see the flag and assume that the only reason you are displaying it is to show support for Bush. People have been displaying flags in their yards and on their cars since long before I was born. When I see the flag, I think of the constitution, veterans (no matter which day of the year), and our current military. In other words, the republic for which it stands. If some clown wants to start an argument or turn up his/her nose at you because he/she made the blanket assumption that flag-flyers must fall into a certain negative category, then the problem is with the offended person. To those who disagree, will it be okay to fly the flag again after Bush is out? Come to think of it, now I wonder if there will be a surge in flag sales at that time. ---
**Author:** ![zamboniracer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e9a140/32.png) [@zamboniracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zamboniracer)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2007, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/25 "2007-05-29T02:49:28Z")
Of course the flying the flag shows support for the country and not the current less than stellar administration. The flag is not the exclusive property of the Bushies and neither is the letter “W.” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Sunrazor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sunrazor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunrazor)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2007, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/26 "2007-05-29T03:15:54Z")
[QUOTE=Der Trihs] IMHO, the Right in this country has so co-opted the flag and the general concept of patriotism that most people will immediately see any display of one as support for Bush, the Republicans and probably the war in Iraq. Unless you make it crystal clear that you do not. [/QUOTE] I respectfully disagree. This liberal Democrat former Boy Scout skeptical Episcopalian sees the Stars and Stripes as a symbol of all the things that are good about the United States, and all the things that could be better. I’ve seen hundreds of scoundrels, including the ones in office now, wrap themselves in the flag, and the funny thing is that its dignity and glory never seem to rub off on them. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2007, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/27 "2007-05-29T03:44:36Z")
You could always hang and burn Bush in effigy in your front yard, although be careful to make sure the flames don’t catch your house on fire. The only problem with this is eventually you’ll probably get tired of making new effigies and constantly having to light them. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2007, 5:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/28 "2007-05-29T05:13:24Z")
[QUOTE=Sunrazor] I respectfully disagree. This liberal Democrat former Boy Scout skeptical Episcopalian sees the Stars and Stripes as a symbol of all the things that are good about the United States, and all the things that could be better. I’ve seen hundreds of scoundrels, including the ones in office now, wrap themselves in the flag, and the funny thing is that its dignity and glory never seem to rub off on them. [/QUOTE] Not in your eyes; they have in mine, and other people I know. Assuming that they ever did have any “dignity and glory”. Does anyone know of an actual poll or something on how many people associate the flag with the Republicans/Right these days, or on which Party most people consider more patriotic ? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2007, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/29 "2007-05-29T05:31:01Z")
Moving thread from IMHO to Great Debates. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2007, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/30 "2007-05-29T06:10:01Z")
[QUOTE=Beware of Doug] I used to make a subtle statement in that direction by hanging out my great-aunt’s 48 star flag of WW2 vintage, with stitched-on stars and stripes. It wasn’t faded or stained or ripped, but the typical flag-waving yahoo would have had it burned long ago. [/QUOTE] Why do you hate Alaska and Hawai’i!? ---
**Author:** ![TJdude825](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dec6dc/32.png) [@TJdude825](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TJdude825)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2007, 8:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/31 "2007-05-29T08:01:43Z")
For those who don’t know the rules: > **[United States Flag Code](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Flag_Code)** > > The United States Flag Code establishes advisory rules for display and care of the national flag of the United States of America. It is part of Chapter 1 of Title 4 of the United States Code (4 U.S.C. § 5 et seq). Although this is a U.S. federal law, the code is not mandatory: it uses non-binding language like "should" and "custom" throughout and does not prescribe any penalties for failure to follow the guidelines. It was "not intended to prescribe conduct" and was written to "codify various > [@](#): > > … > The flag should not be used as “wearing apparel, bedding, or drapery”,[1] or for covering a speaker’s desk, draping a platform, or for any decoration in general (exception for coffins). > … > The flag should never be used for any advertising purpose. It should not be embroidered, printed, or otherwise impressed on such articles as cushions, handkerchiefs, napkins, boxes, > … > he flag should not be used as part of a costume or athletic uniform, except that a flag patch may be used on the uniform of military personnel, firefighters, police officers, and members of patriotic organizations. > … > When a flag is so worn it is no longer fit to serve as a symbol of the United States, it should be destroyed in a dignified manner, preferably by burning. I’ve just quoted some of the more interesting (IMO) parts of the code, the first few for how frequently and blatantly they’re broken, and the last because burning can apparently be a sign of disrespect or of respect, depending on the context, and I suppose, they way the burning is done. ---
**Author:** ![MerryMagdalen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c2a13f/32.png) [@MerryMagdalen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MerryMagdalen)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2007, 9:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/32 "2007-05-29T09:21:54Z")
Would it be against flag rules to fly the American flag at the highest point on the staff, and then fly a smaller, possibly homemade flag with perhaps a W and a “no” symbol? (Think Ghostbusters, with a W instead.) I know the American flag must be flown highest, but I don’t know whether you can fly another on the same staff. As for something less overtly political…I can’t think of it. ---
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2007, 10:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/33 "2007-05-29T10:49:52Z")
[QUOTE=Alessan] Why do you hate Alaska and Hawai’i!? [/QUOTE] I guess ice and apostrophes don’t turn me on. ---
**Author:** ![Trotsky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bcef8e/32.png) [@Trotsky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trotsky)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2007, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/34 "2007-05-29T12:02:58Z")
Why don’t you guys just fly the Soviet flag? You obviously hate everything about the USA for the most part. Cindy Sheehan just threw in the towel, don’t you ultra smart guys give up! ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2007, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/35 "2007-05-29T12:10:26Z")
[QUOTE=Trotsky] Why don’t you guys just fly the Soviet flag? You obviously hate everything about the USA for the most part. [/quote] Because there’s no great connection between hating America and liking the Soviet Union ? Because the Soviet Union is gone ? Because the Cold War is over ? Because most people in this thread **don’t** hate America ? Because being neither an America-love-it-or-leave-it type or a Communist apparently still baffles some people who can’t conceive of a third category, and it’s fun to baffle such people ? ---
**Author:** ![Trotsky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bcef8e/32.png) [@Trotsky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trotsky)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2007, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/36 "2007-05-29T12:11:38Z")
Ok, would a crescent moon flag work better? ---
**Author:** ![Trotsky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bcef8e/32.png) [@Trotsky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trotsky)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2007, 12:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/37 "2007-05-29T12:16:36Z")
'Sheehan writes in her online diary, “you are not the country that I love and I finally realized no matter how much I sacrifice, I can’t make you be that country unless you want it.” ’ I think that’s how a lot of leftists think. Problem is, it never was what you wanted it to be either. It’s not all about you guys. Why not go to Venezuela, and watch TV stations shut down one by one. Oh, I forgot, those are right wing ones, and it’s probably ok then. Seen a lot of leftist support for shutting down Fox as a reaction to hugo’s leninism. Maybe obama or hillary can help with that. ---
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2007, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/38 "2007-05-29T12:24:47Z")
I see the flag and I think of a big, proud and largely friendly and peaceful nation. I think of sunshine and parades and white marble monuments in Washington. I do not think of pressure groups, talk radio politics, fat cat lobbyists, Sergeant Hartman from _Full Metal Jacket_, or Richard Nixon’s lapel pin. At least I try not to. ---
**Author:** ![Trotsky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bcef8e/32.png) [@Trotsky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trotsky)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2007, 12:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/39 "2007-05-29T12:26:53Z")
I try not to think of al gore, cindy sheehan, BJ clinton, and michael moore… But I still appreciate the country. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2007, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780/40 "2007-05-29T12:30:23Z")
[QUOTE=Trotsky] Ok, would a crescent moon flag work better? [/QUOTE] If you think that I’d want a flag based on Islam, or any other religion, you apparently haven’t read me before. One reason I don’t like America is it’s religiousity. You seem to be operating under the assumption that if someone disapproves of America, or what it has done/is doing, they are automatically loyal to some random enemy of the week. You are wrong. Some people despise America for what it has done, and want to change it so they don’t despise it any more. Some people despise what America has done and love it anyway. Some people ( like me ) despise America for what it’s done, and simply have no particular loyalties to any group. [QUOTE=Trotsky] Why not go to Venezuela, and watch TV stations shut down one by one. Oh, I forgot, those are right wing ones, and it’s probably ok then. [/QUOTE] Because I don’t like Venezuela either. And if you are going to rant about the “evil” left wing countries, why not talk about, say, the brutally oppressive Canadian regime ? Could it be because you don’t want to admit that a lot of left wing countries are more pleasant places to live than America in many ways ? [QUOTE=Trotsky] Seen a lot of leftist support for shutting down Fox as a reaction to hugo’s leninism. [/QUOTE] What “leftist support for shutting down Fox” ? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-fly-the-flag-without-supporting-the-current-jokers/405780.md?page=3)