How to increase the GDP rate to 4%

[k9bfriender]

@Ruken

Having fun with BLS stats here. There were 1.7MM 16-24 year old MW (or less) earners in 2009. Last year there were 526k 25-34 year old MW earners. I’m pretty sure two thirds of them died. Certainly not raises.

Some of them probably have died. Did you check the stats for people making federal MW, or people making their local MW? I suspect that is at least part of why those numbers have changed, as many states have increased their MW’s, so while someone may be making MW, they are not making the federal MW.

Also, if you really want to get a fair accounting, then the numbers that you should be using are the people who are making less than the proposed new MW.

Playing with the number of people who make $7.25 an hour lets you get some snark in, but does not give any sort of accuracy or credibility to the argument.

@Ruken

there are studies on raising MW to $10.10 because that was the real historical maximum when the studies were comissioned. But there’s been some inflation since then so I checked the BLS CPI and $1.60 in 1968 translates to about $11.50 today.

Yeah, MW is at the lowest point it has been in, in terms of purchasing power, since it was implemented.

When republicans complain that it is already too high, and that raising it will destroy the economy, remember that.

@Slash1972

I’m not sure what my lifestyle has to do with COL increases. Can you explain?

If your pay goes up, then the cost to the govt goes up, if the cost to the govt goes up, then the cost to the taxpayer goes up, if the cost to the tax payer goes up, then either the taxpayer pays more taxes, or has a higher burden on the national debt.

It’s like a MW increase, except it is not borne by the consumer, but entirely by the taxpayer.

@Slash1972

I’m sorry, but I find it hard to believe that someone who started working at McDonalds in Ohio in 2009 making MW would STILL be making minimum wage today.

It is sorry, but if you want to find one, then walk in to a McDonald’s in ohio. MW exactly, maybe not, but less than the proposed MW of 10.10, definitely. I actually ignore McD’s for the most part, but I have friends at most of the other places. Wendy’s corp has a wage cap at $9.25 an hour. Arby’s was only $9. Burger King will only pay MW and does not give raises. And there certainly are people who have been at these jobs for over a decade. Meijer is union, and paid 7.50 when I worked there, which is lower than the current state MW, so I assume that they bumped it up a bit. In any case, you got .15 an hour increase once a year there. Wal-Mart was similar from what I have heard, but I never worked there myself.

[Ruken]

@k9bfriender

Also, if you really want to get a fair accounting, then the numbers that you should be using are the people who are making less than the proposed new MW.

Playing with the number of people who make $7.25 an hour lets you get some snark in, but does not give any sort of accuracy or credibility to the argument.

If you think you have some credibility and fair accounting to offer, let’s see your data.

[D_Anconia]

@k9bfriender

Wendy’s corp has a wage cap at $9.25 an hour. Arby’s was only $9. Burger King will only pay MW and does not give raises.

Do you have a cite for any of those claims?

[Shodan]

@k9bfriender

You are claiming here, and further down in your post, that a MW worker will have the same or less purchasing power after a MW hike. I am pointing out that is impossible, unless inflation goes up by the same amount as the MW hike, and that would only be possible if MW was the only driver of inflation.

Again, you are simply wrong. Other factors can drive inflation in addition to MW increases.

And MW could get raises based on the same things.

I thought you were the one claiming that MW workers never got raises.

When you ask for rasies, do you take your costs into account at all? If your costs have gone up, do you press for more of a raise?

No. My employer doesn’t care about my costs. He cares about what I produce. I push for as much of a raise as I can get. On occasion, I thought I could get more at another company. I was invariably right.

When you talk about MW workers, you seem to think that it is only important to include those who make exactly $7.25, and that someone who makes $7.30 is not a MW worker. You also seem to completely ignore the states that have a higher MW.

No, as a matter of fact I said specifically

Increases in MW hit hardest on businesses with larger numbers of employees who are earning between what the MW used to be, and what it is increased to. Thus if you raise the MW from $7.25 to $10.10, the businesses hit hardest are those with the largest numbers of employees who earn between $7.25 and $10.10, because they all have to get raises.

Someone who makes $7.30 an hour is someone who doesn’t make $7.25 exactly.

The point is that it is that there is not going to be a one for one increase in cost to cover a higher MW as you seem to be indicating. A 40% hike in MW does not translate to a 40% increase in costs.

No one, least of all me, made this claim.

And if chicken and pork had gone up too, would you just eat less?

No, I would eat less chicken and pork, or meat overall, and more eggs, milk, rice and beans, etc. The way I did when I was poor.

If the price of everything goes up, that’s what’s called inflation, and that’s what you are denying will happen.

And no business has ever refused to hire someone when they needed to get more work done than their staffing could accomplish because they didn’t want it to cut into their profit.

Do you believe that businesses hire people who will cut into their profits?

Sure, you mentioned that earlier in this post that you have in fact received raises. So, you know who doesn’t receive raises?

Yes - people who can’t find anyone to pay them more.

If increasing price has a tendency to reduced demand, and we have always had inflation, then demand should have been going down historically. As it has been going up historically, along with rising prices, I am going to point out that Econ 101 is not where you should end your economic studies.

I am going to point out that that is where you should probably start.

Inflation means there is a sustained increase in the price level. The main causes of inflation are either excess aggregate demand (economic growth too fast) or cost push factors (supply-side factors).

Cite. So essentially you have it backwards.

Sometimes.

No, usually.

Any employer that cannot get $10 an hour worth of productivity out of any employee (exception being disabled or developmentally delayed employees, who you can pay less than MW) needs to revisit their business plan.

Then we don’t need any increase in the MW? Employees just need to be worked harder? That seems a little harsh.

ISTM that some jobs just don’t produce very much in terms of value to the company. Other jobs do. Those other jobs don’t pay MW.

Regards,
Shodan

[Ruken]

@k9bfriender

Yeah, MW is at the lowest point it has been in, in terms of purchasing power, since it was implemented.

Not by CPI. What deflator are you using?