# how to write 1990 in roman numerals **URL:** \ **Category:** Cecil's Columns/Staff Reports\ **Created:** [May 23, 2007, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257 "2007-05-23T18:19:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Arnold\_Winkelried](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Arnold\_Winkelried](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arnold_Winkelried)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/1 "2007-05-23T18:19:52Z")
The column mentions automatic number translation via software [What is the proper way to style Roman numerals for the 1990s? (23-Feb-1990)](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a3_375.html) The Oracle database software (to\_char function, RN number format element) does the following: 1990 - MCMXC 1999 - MCMXCIX 3999 - highest number translated to roman numerals, everything after that shows up as “overflow” ---
**Author:** ![JeffB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeffb/32/188_2.png) [@JeffB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JeffB)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/2 "2007-05-23T18:51:13Z")
Excel provides five options for converting to Roman format, also with 3999 being the highest converted: ```auto 1990 MCMXC MLMXL MXM MXM MXM 1999 MCMXCIX MLMVLIV MXMIX MVMIV MIM 3999 MMMCMXCIX MMMLMVLIV MMMXMIX MMMVMIV MMMIM ``` ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/3 "2007-05-23T18:58:34Z")
It seems to me that, where each answer is equally “right” given the ambiguities of ancient Latin, why not use the shortest notation? Thus, “MXM” for 1990, and IMM for 1999. I remember M&M Mars trumpeting the “Year of M [and] M” in 2000. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![essell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/34f0e0/32.png) [@essell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/essell)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/4 "2007-05-23T21:27:50Z")
[QUOTE=Elendil’s Heir] It seems to me that, where each answer is equally “right” given the ambiguities of ancient Latin, why not use the shortest notation?.. [/QUOTE] Yes. Why not. Why not let all the Scott Tenorman’s of this world get away our $16.12 ? ---
**Author:** ![Defective\_Detective](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d2c977/32.png) [@Defective\_Detective](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defective_Detective)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/5 "2007-05-23T23:44:57Z")
I guess it’s oficially settled, then: Roman numerals suck. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/6 "2007-05-24T12:59:29Z")
[QUOTE=essell] Yes. Why not. Why not let all the Scott Tenorman’s of this world get away our $16.12 ? [/QUOTE] Huh? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/7 "2007-05-24T15:36:50Z")
> **[Scott Tenorman Must Die](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scott_Tenorman_Must_Die)** > > "Scott Tenorman Must Die" is the third episode of the fifth season of the American animated television series South Park, and the 69th episode of the series overall. It first aired on Comedy Central in the United States on July 11, 2001. In the episode, 9th grader Scott Tenorman makes Eric Cartman believe that buying pubic hair from him will make Cartman reach puberty. Realizing that he had been tricked, an angry Cartman plots revenge on Scott. > South Park creators Trey Parker and Matt Stone poin... ---
**Author:** ![essell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/34f0e0/32.png) [@essell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/essell)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/8 "2007-05-24T16:14:36Z")
[QUOTE=Elendil’s Heir] Huh? :dubious: [/QUOTE] It was part of Cartman’s speech about doing _what’s right_ rather than _what’s easiest_. Roman Numerals are like caligraphy. The whole point is the work involved else we’d just write 1990. The way it’s presented is the point, not the information involved. Much more grown up than a Southpark quote ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/9 "2007-05-24T19:56:46Z")
So… the _longer_ the Roman numeral the better, from your perspective? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/10 "2007-05-24T22:58:07Z")
In that case, who needs X? IIIIIIIIII will work just as well. Or, heck, let’s just toss out L, C, and D, too, while we’re at it. ---
**Author:** ![JimOfAllTrades](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@JimOfAllTrades](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JimOfAllTrades)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/11 "2007-05-24T23:25:23Z")
If we toss out the LCDs my calculator, phone, and flat screen monitor will die! Who knew modern electronics depended on roman numerals? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Nanashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@Nanashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nanashi)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2007, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/12 "2007-06-03T03:12:06Z")
I’m surprised you haven’t noticed this. There is a general rule to Roman Numerals. I take a course in Latin. 1. Numbers can’t repeat more than 3 times. (No XXXX = 40) 2. When subtracting, the number can’t be less than one tenth of the number that is being subtracted from. (IC is not 99, but XC does work for 90) 3. A macron over a number multiplies it by 1,000. ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2007, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/13 "2007-06-04T02:25:08Z")
That’s the stuff they teach in school today, yes. Ask someone who has to read old documents for a living just how true those general rules are, and he’ll laugh in your face. ---
**Author:** ![Nanashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@Nanashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nanashi)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2007, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/14 "2007-06-04T04:32:02Z")
[QUOTE=John W. Kennedy] That’s the stuff they teach in school today, yes. Ask someone who has to read old documents for a living just how true those general rules are, and he’ll laugh in your face. [/QUOTE] Yes, I understand that most of the Roman population wasn’t very educated. I’ve seen Roman graffiti of gladiators and their scores. A gladiator with 24 kills had some number XXIIII next to him. Apparently these rules applied to the educated population of Rome. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2007, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/15 "2007-06-04T06:02:29Z")
[QUOTE=Nanashi] Yes, I understand that most of the Roman population wasn’t very educated. I’ve seen Roman graffiti of gladiators and their scores. A gladiator with 24 kills had some number XXIIII next to him. Apparently these rules applied to the educated population of Rome. [/QUOTE] I’m sorry, but that’s nonsense. XXXX for 40, for example, is found in monumental inscriptions, manuscripts, etc. It has nothing whatever to do with education levels. It’s simply a variant form. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2007, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/16 "2007-06-06T00:55:04Z")
[QUOTE=Nanashi] I’m surprised you haven’t noticed this. There is a general rule to Roman Numerals. I take a course in Latin. 1. Numbers can’t repeat more than 3 times. (No XXXX = 40) 2. When subtracting, the number can’t be less than one tenth of the number that is being subtracted from. (IC is not 99, but XC does work for 90) 3. A macron over a number multiplies it by 1,000. [/QUOTE] Someone forgot to tell cuckoo clock manufacturers. Every one I’ve ever seen has IIII for 4. ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/17 "2007-06-07T00:58:34Z")
Plenty of other clocks have “IIII” rather than “IV”. ---
**Author:** ![Alive\_At\_Both\_Ends](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/73ab20/32.png) [@Alive\_At\_Both\_Ends](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alive_At_Both_Ends)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/18 "2007-06-07T12:27:15Z")
[QUOTE=John W. Kennedy] Plenty of other clocks have “IIII” rather than “IV”. [/QUOTE] The reason for that is aesthetic - it balances the “VIII” on the other side. ---
**Author:** ![essell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/34f0e0/32.png) [@essell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/essell)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2007, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-to-write-1990-in-roman-numerals/405257/19 "2007-06-07T14:04:11Z")
[QUOTE=Alive At Both Ends] The reason for that is aesthetic - it balances the “VIII” on the other side. [/QUOTE] [That’s](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a2_153.html) one theory…