# How welcome (or not) are non-Jewish immigrants in Israel? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 30, 2010, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-welcome-or-not-are-non-jewish-immigrants-in-israel/552059 "2010-08-30T23:04:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2010, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-welcome-or-not-are-non-jewish-immigrants-in-israel/552059/1 "2010-08-30T23:04:56Z")
Let’s say I, a typical American of European ancestry, nominally Protestant Christian and of no particular Jewish heritage, decided it would be great to become a citizen of Israel. How welcome- or not- would I be? ---
**Author:** ![Genericuser234](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/5daacb/32.png) [@Genericuser234](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Genericuser234)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2010, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-welcome-or-not-are-non-jewish-immigrants-in-israel/552059/2 "2010-08-30T23:12:20Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > Let’s say I, a typical American of European ancestry, nominally Protestant Christian and of no particular Jewish heritage, decided it would be great to become a citizen of Israel. How welcome- or not- would I be? It depends on how open you make yourself. If you just show up and try to fit in with the local culture, it shouldn’t be a problem in IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![GiantRat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@GiantRat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GiantRat)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2010, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-welcome-or-not-are-non-jewish-immigrants-in-israel/552059/3 "2010-08-30T23:45:59Z")
> [@marochko](#): > > > [@Lumpy](#): > > > > Let’s say I, a typical American of European ancestry, nominally Protestant Christian and of no particular Jewish heritage, decided it would be great to become a citizen of Israel. How welcome- or not- would I be? > > It depends on how open you make yourself. If you just show up and try to fit in with the local culture, it shouldn’t be a problem in IMHO. Never been to Israel personally, but I have worked from the states pretty closely with some folks in Israel. They all had a solid understanding of American culture and norms, and were pretty cool in general. Amusingly, my first interaction with those folks (we’re all IT guys) was at 5am my time on a weekend. The message: “we’re under attack from Saudi Arabia!” Imagine my relief to discover that it was just a suspicious botnet sourcing from IP addresses assigned to Saudi. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2010, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-welcome-or-not-are-non-jewish-immigrants-in-israel/552059/4 "2010-08-30T23:52:42Z")
I assumed the OP was taking about how welcome, legally-speaking, would the immigration officials in Isreal make him ? What is their immigration and citizenship policy towards non-Jews (as I understand it they have pretty much no-exceptions policy towards allowing all Jewish immigrants). ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-welcome-or-not-are-non-jewish-immigrants-in-israel/552059/5 "2010-08-31T01:39:10Z")
[Policy.](http://israpundit.blogspot.com/2002/09/digging-deeper-israeli-citizenship-and.html) > [@](#): > > … 4. Naturalization > > A person 18 years of age or older may acquire Israeli nationality by naturalization if he meets these criteria: (1) is currently in Israel, (2) has been in Israel for 3 of the 5 preceding years, (3) intends to settle in the country (4) has some knowledge of Hebrew (former Palestinian citizens are exempt from this provision), (5) renounces any and all foreign nationalities, and (6) takes an oath of loyalty to the State of Israel. Completion of all of the above requirements is not essential in all instances, however, as the Minister of the Interior at his discretion has the power (for a special reason) to waive requirements (1), (2),(4), and (5) above. > > 1. By grant from the Minister of the Interior to certain categories of minors. > > The law provides, in addition, for a discretionary grant of citizenship to minors who are not Israeli nationals but who are residents of Israel. It is also true that “The Law of Return” applies to those who have no Jewish identity but who even have a Jewish grandparent, the same definition that the Nazis used. Some of the religious and conservative parties have been upset over the large numbers of immigrants (often Russian) that they consider non-Jewish but who qualify under that ruling. ---
**Author:** ![Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hypnagogic_jerk/32/4252_2.png) [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypnagogic_Jerk)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-welcome-or-not-are-non-jewish-immigrants-in-israel/552059/6 "2010-08-31T01:47:53Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > Some of the religious and conservative parties have been upset over the large numbers of immigrants (often Russian) that they consider non-Jewish but who qualify under that ruling. I understand that some of these are actually _neo-Nazis_, which strikes me as the kind of people you don’t want to have in Israel. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-welcome-or-not-are-non-jewish-immigrants-in-israel/552059/7 "2010-08-31T03:15:42Z")
> [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](#): > > > [@DSeid](#): > > > > Some of the religious and conservative parties have been upset over the large numbers of immigrants (often Russian) that they consider non-Jewish but who qualify under that ruling. > > I understand that some of these are actually _neo-Nazis_, which strikes me as the kind of people you don’t want to have in Israel. I assume that [this](http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/6987848.stm) is what you are referring to. > [@](#): > > Eight young men are being held over 15 assaults of Orthodox Jews, foreign workers and other minority groups. Police said a ninth youth had fled the country. > > It is thought to be the first organised neo-Nazi cell to be uncovered in Israel … About one million former Soviet Jews have immigrated to Israel since the 1990s, under the country’s “law of return”, which allows entry to anybody who is Jewish or has Jewish ancestry (defined as having at least one Jewish grandparent). > > Some of the immigrants are thought to have only the most tenuous links to Judaism, and experts say a small minority have embraced Nazi beliefs. Nah. The complaints are not about the small minority of 8 out of a million; the complaints are about the larger number without a Jewish identity but allowed in under the “Law of Return.” ---
**Author:** ![Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hypnagogic_jerk/32/4252_2.png) [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypnagogic_Jerk)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-welcome-or-not-are-non-jewish-immigrants-in-israel/552059/8 "2010-08-31T03:32:31Z")
I’d heard of the phenomenon of young people (usually Russian as you’ve mentioned) of tenuous Jewish ancestry immigrating to Israel and then demonstrating neo-Nazi beliefs, but I didn’t know how common it was. Let’s hope it’s that rare. This said, I do understand why some Israelis would dislike a large influx of people with very weak links to Jewish identity. This sort of thing can make integration difficult and change the culture of a country in major ways. If I understand correctly, other than the law of return (which allows people with some Jewish ancestry to get Israeli citizenship without fulfilling all conditions), Israel, like many other countries, may grant citizenship to long-term residents who have some knowledge of the national language. Does anyone know if it’s common for non-Jews to become Israeli citizens in such a way, and how they are seen by other Israeli citizens? ---
**Author:** ![Buckler\_of\_Swashing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Buckler\_of\_Swashing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buckler_of_Swashing)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-welcome-or-not-are-non-jewish-immigrants-in-israel/552059/9 "2010-08-31T03:51:01Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > [Policy.](http://israpundit.blogspot.com/2002/09/digging-deeper-israeli-citizenship-and.html) > > > [@](#): > > > > A person 18 years of age or older may acquire Israeli nationality by naturalization if he meets these criteria … (5) renounces any and all foreign nationalities… Does this mean you cannot hold a dual citizenship? I was sure someone I no longer know once told me their parents were both dual Israel/American citizens, but I could be wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hypnagogic_jerk/32/4252_2.png) [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypnagogic_Jerk)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-welcome-or-not-are-non-jewish-immigrants-in-israel/552059/10 "2010-08-31T04:17:41Z")
It’s common for countries to require naturalized citizens to renounce all other allegiances, but I don’t know how closely they enforce this. Some countries don’t actually allow their citizens to renounce their citizenship, so strict enforcement would be unjust to them. And as for these dual Israeli/American citizens, it’s possible that they held both citizenships from birth and were never naturalized as Israeli citizens. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-welcome-or-not-are-non-jewish-immigrants-in-israel/552059/11 "2010-08-31T04:40:59Z")
> [@Buckler\_of\_Swashing](#): > > > [@DSeid](#): > > > > [Policy.](http://israpundit.blogspot.com/2002/09/digging-deeper-israeli-citizenship-and.html) > > Does this mean you cannot hold a dual citizenship? I was sure someone I no longer know once told me their parents were both dual Israel/American citizens, but I could be wrong. My understanding is that those who become citizens under the “Law of Return” have no need to renounce so for them it is no problem. The cite is discussing those who do not qualify thus. In that regard there is [this](http://www.aaci.org.il/articlenav.php?id=34) FWIW: > [@](#): > > In order to lose U.S. citizenship, one must voluntarily perform an expatriatory act, and such performance must be coupled with an intent to give up citizenship. Citizenship is not lost if there is an expatriatory act with no such intent. > > The U.S. Supreme Court has held that the act itself cannot be accepted as proof of intent – there must be extraneous proof, and the burden of proof is on the U.S. Government to establish the intent to give up citizenship. > > The U.S. State Department does not regard automatic acquisition of Israeli citizenship (Par. 2 or the Nationality Law of Israel) as an expatriatory act so the issue of intent does not even arise. However, if someone acquires Israeli citizenship by naturalization, his application (Par. 5 of the Nationality Law) can be regarded as a potential expatriating act. However, if the State Department cannot prove that the person intended thereby to give up his U.S. citizenship, the citizenship is not lost. I have no idea how often citizenship by naturalization occurs. Maybe one of our Israeli posters will have some information. ---
**Author:** ![Kyla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/eada6e/32.png) [@Kyla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyla)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 5:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-welcome-or-not-are-non-jewish-immigrants-in-israel/552059/12 "2010-08-31T05:42:40Z")
> [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](#): > > It’s common for countries to require naturalized citizens to renounce all other allegiances, but I don’t know how closely they enforce this. Some countries don’t actually allow their citizens to renounce their citizenship, so strict enforcement would be unjust to them. And as for these dual Israeli/American citizens, it’s possible that they held both citizenships from birth and were never naturalized as Israeli citizens. I know loads and loads of American citizens who naturalized as Israeli citizens and retained their American citizenship. I don’t think it’s a big deal. If you’re not of Jewish descent, I don’t think becoming an Israeli citizen would be particularly easy. Unless you’re married to someone of Jewish descent, I think. I’ve never heard of someone even trying. Oh, except the [Black Hebrews](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_Hebrew_Israelites_of_Jerusalem). They entered Israel illegally, but have worked something out with the Israeli government so they are now legal residents, and they serve in the army and everything. ---
**Author:** ![Shinna\_Minna\_Ma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f08c70/32.png) [@Shinna\_Minna\_Ma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shinna_Minna_Ma)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-welcome-or-not-are-non-jewish-immigrants-in-israel/552059/13 "2010-08-31T12:30:16Z")
I made aliyah (moved to Israel) 3 years ago, and I still have my American citizenship, as does everyone in my family. All of our neighbors who moved here long ago (20+ years) still have their American or Canadian or South African (or whatever) citizenships. I continue to vote in American elections. The best part about keeping my citizenship is that I can travel back to America on my American passport, so I don’t need to worry about getting a visa. –SMM ---
**Author:** ![Buckler\_of\_Swashing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Buckler\_of\_Swashing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buckler_of_Swashing)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2010, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-welcome-or-not-are-non-jewish-immigrants-in-israel/552059/14 "2010-08-31T15:11:54Z")
> [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](#): > > It’s common for countries to require naturalized citizens to renounce all other allegiances, but I don’t know how closely they enforce this. Some countries don’t actually allow their citizens to renounce their citizenship, so strict enforcement would be unjust to them. And as for these dual Israeli/American citizens, it’s possible that they held both citizenships from birth and were never naturalized as Israeli citizens. > [@DSeid](#): > > > [@Buckler\_of\_Swashing](#): > > > > Does this mean you cannot hold a dual citizenship? I was sure someone I no longer know once told me their parents were both dual Israel/American citizens, but I could be wrong. > > My understanding is that those who become citizens under the “Law of Return” have no need to renounce so for them it is no problem. The cite is discussing those who do not qualify thus. In that regard there is [this](http://www.aaci.org.il/articlenav.php?id=34) FWIW: > > > [@](#): > > > > In order to lose U.S. citizenship, one must voluntarily perform an expatriatory act, and such performance must be coupled with an intent to give up citizenship. Citizenship is not lost if there is an expatriatory act with no such intent. > > > > The U.S. Supreme Court has held that the act itself cannot be accepted as proof of intent – there must be extraneous proof, and the burden of proof is on the U.S. Government to establish the intent to give up citizenship. > > > > The U.S. State Department does not regard automatic acquisition of Israeli citizenship (Par. 2 or the Nationality Law of Israel) as an expatriatory act so the issue of intent does not even arise. However, if someone acquires Israeli citizenship by naturalization, his application (Par. 5 of the Nationality Law) can be regarded as a potential expatriating act. However, if the State Department cannot prove that the person intended thereby to give up his U.S. citizenship, the citizenship is not lost. > > I have no idea how often citizenship by naturalization occurs. Maybe one of our Israeli posters will have some information. Thank you both for the info, I will have to check this out further. Or just blame my fallible memory.