# How well do other nations' citizens know US geography? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 11, 2003, 8:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672 "2003-07-11T08:00:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2003, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/61 "2003-07-13T06:07:58Z")
MLS… DC is a southern city in terms of accents, history, and such, but geographically, its farther north than south. And Atlanta isn’t an eight hour drive from Orlando- at most it will take you seven, although if you try and hop straight through downtown 'Lanta at 5pm you might as well get out and walk… ---
**Author:** ![Publius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c57346/32.png) [@Publius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Publius)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2003, 6:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/62 "2003-07-13T06:35:45Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Muffin \* > \*\*Snap quiz: > > Alaska is the northern-most state, so what is the second northern-most state? > > When answering, please indicate generally where you live. \*\* Not only do I agree with **Neurotik** that it’s Minnesota, but I’ve also grown up in California and would like to live in DC. Great minds… 😉 One of the things that amazed me when I went Back East was how close together everything seemed. I can drive all day from where I live and still be in California; heck, I won’t even reach the state capital for ten hours. The nearest major cities besides Los Angeles (about an hour away, measuring from downtown) are San Diego (3 hours), Las Vegas (5), San Francisco (7-ish), and Salt Lake City (really freaking long). By contrast, I can drive two hours from DC and be in Philadelphia, and four or so will take me to New York. In the time it would take me to drive to San Francisco from my house, I could probably drive from DC to Canada. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2003, 11:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/63 "2003-07-13T11:38:56Z")
Mapquest says I can make it to my provincial capital in 23 hours, 28 minutes, but my sister has made it in under 20 hours. She drives a Mustang and likes to pass. Yay Sis! ---
**Author:** ![Dawne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ed8c4c/32.png) [@Dawne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dawne)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2003, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/64 "2003-07-13T12:18:24Z")
I really didn’t know that lots of my fellow Europeans didn’t know how big America was. I grew up believing that it was absolutely huge and found that it was true when we went travelling there two years ago. It seems ridiculous to me to think that the US is only twice as big as France and I’ve never heard anyone say that they think it is. Out of interest, how long would it take to drive from Niagra falls to Albany? I have a small map (with no scale) with all of my holiday stops on it and it look sas though this will be my longest journey. I only know that you can do the journey in a day because we’re going to Niagra falls in the morning but staying at a hotel in Albany that night. Once i know how far apart these places are I can work out the other distances which all look about 10 times shorter. The two points are 2.5 cm apart (roughly 1 inch) ---
**Author:** ![Neurotik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/91b2a8/32.png) [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2003, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/65 "2003-07-13T12:50:32Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Dawne \* > \*\*Out of interest, how long would it take to drive from Niagra falls to Albany? I have a small map (with no scale) with all of my holiday stops on it and it look sas though this will be my longest journey. I only know that you can do the journey in a day because we’re going to Niagra falls in the morning but staying at a hotel in Albany that night. \*\* It’ll take you about five hours, depending on traffic, etc. Incidentally, why the heck are you going to Albany? > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Publius_ > **By contrast, I can drive two hours from DC and be in Philadelphia, and four or so will take me to New York. In the time it would take me to drive to San Francisco from my house, I could probably drive from DC to Canada.** HA! Those are theoretical numbers only. Three hours is about average for Philly, sometimes four. Heck, it’s taken me three hours to get from Baltimore to the Delaware border a few times. And my record for New York is 8 hours. Although, usually it takes about five, unless it’s the middle of the night. Assuming not much traffic, you could get from DC to Boston in the time it takes to get to San Francisco. Or from DC to Buffalo, which is almost Canada. Although why you’d go to Buffalo is beyond me. ---
**Author:** ![Dawne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ed8c4c/32.png) [@Dawne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dawne)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2003, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/66 "2003-07-13T13:32:49Z")
Why am i going to Albany? I have no choice. We don’t get a lot of freedom with this holiday. Is Albany not good, then? (It _can’t_ be worse than Williams… can it?) ---
**Author:** ![Neurotik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/91b2a8/32.png) [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2003, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/67 "2003-07-13T13:38:34Z")
I dunno. Don’t get me wrong, Albany isn’t terrible or anything. It’s just that the only real reason to go there is either for state government reasons or to get somewhere else, like the Catskills or Berkshires. A fairly boring place, otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![Dawne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ed8c4c/32.png) [@Dawne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dawne)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2003, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/68 "2003-07-13T14:11:52Z")
I don’t think I’ll be staying there for very long, we’re spending most of the day at niagra falls then travelling (hopefully with stops inbetween) and i think we leave immediately the next morning and head for the Green Mountain National forest, Plymouth, Woostock, New London and Massachusetts. I think Albany is just somewhere inbetween where we can stay for the night, like Williams was last time. ---
**Author:** ![OxyMoron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/e9a140/32.png) [@OxyMoron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OxyMoron)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2003, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/69 "2003-07-13T16:17:32Z")
Albany’s fine for that. And if you want to see something really bizarre, swing by Nelson Rockefeller’s own mini-Brasilia, the [Empire State Plaza](http://joelglickman.com/hibp/flyby/albany.jpg). ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2003, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/70 "2003-07-13T19:25:23Z")
Tacky things to see along the road: > **[Roadside America - Guide to Uniquely Odd Tourist Attractions](https://www.roadsideamerica.com/)** > > Home Page for Roadside America, travel tools and guide to unusual attractions, tourist traps, weird vacations, and road trips. Routes, distances and times: > **[Official MapQuest - Maps, Driving Directions, Live Traffic](https://www.mapquest.com/)** > > Official MapQuest website, find driving directions, maps, live traffic updates and road conditions. Find nearby businesses, restaurants and hotels. Explore! ---
**Author:** ![ruadh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d2c977/32.png) [@ruadh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ruadh)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2003, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/71 "2003-07-13T19:37:32Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dutchboy208 \* > **MLS… DC is a southern city in terms of accents, history, and such, but geographically, its farther north than south.** I grew up just outside of DC and I never had any idea I lived in “the south” until my mother’s relatives in New Jersey told me I did. Nobody I knew in DC or its adjacent counties considered it a southern city. I also found the presence or absence of a southern accent in a DC-raised person to be largely a matter of class. Back to the OP, here are a few things about the US I’ve found very few Europeans to be aware of: [ul] [li] Washington D.C. is different (and very far) from Washington State[/li][li] Washington D.C. is a city, not part of any state[/li][li] San Francisco is about eight hours from L.A. and bloody cold most of the time[/li][/ul] On the size thing: I went to go to Florida for my brother’s wedding a couple months ago. Since I don’t know anybody else in Florida, I only stayed for the long weekend and then returned to Ireland. Loads of people here asked me why I didn’t just go to D.C. “while I was there”. They all seemed rather nonplussed when I told them this was like asking someone why they didn’t go to Milan while they were in Dublin. ---
**Author:** ![Dawne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ed8c4c/32.png) [@Dawne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dawne)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2003, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/72 "2003-07-13T19:52:17Z")
Thanks Muffin and OxyMoron, I’ll look out for those things but i don’t think we get much freedom to choose where we go, I’ll be stuck on a coach for hours everyday. Someone said something in another thread about a man who has wild rats on his arms in Toronto, I’ll look out for him too. ---
**Author:** ![Nichol\_storm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Nichol\_storm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nichol_storm)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2003, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/73 "2003-07-13T20:14:21Z")
I had a Japanese penpal who had an excellent command of English and a very sweet disposition. She emailed me excitedly one day to tell me that she was flying to the USA to visit her cousin in Washington State and she wanted to see me. Keep in mind I live in Mississippi. There was no way I was making it to Washington State in a couple of days, sans plane flight. Hell, getting to Japan wouldn’t have been much harder. I felt terrible when I had to tell her this but the distances were just too vast. ---
**Author:** ![Violet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/ebca7d/32.png) [@Violet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Violet)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2003, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/74 "2003-07-13T20:15:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by RexDart \*\*\* how well do non-Americans understand our US geography? How many of our cities do they know, how much of our regional stereotypes are they familiar with (do they know how we make fun of Southerners like Corkers make fun of Kerrymen?) \*\* Anecdotal, of course: My experience is that international business travelers and international adventure travelers know the most about U. S. geography, culture & customs. Otherwise, the top U. S. cities, in terms of movies and news, are known, like NYC and L. A. There are some associations like, “California. Oh, yeah. Beach Boys!” ---
**Author:** ![Jodi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7feea3/32.png) [@Jodi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jodi)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2003, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/75 "2003-07-13T20:20:48Z")
> [@](#): > > The Cascades are a sub-range of the Rocky Mountains. I’m not sure what a “sub-range” is, but considering that there’s about 200 miles between the two, I’m not sure that the Cascades qualify. Get your Britannica and look up “Washington.” You’re welcome. (Gee, isn’t snarky correcting fun?) ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f07891/32.png) [@Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Plastic_Ninja)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2003, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/76 "2003-07-14T05:31:19Z")
Having lived in TX over half my life, I can’t easily comprehend living in England. It must be like vacationing in your backyard. My idea of a really good time is to go so far out into the wilderness as I can within a few hours drive of home, then climb as high as I can and look at all the NOTHING. No cities, towns, houses, people…nothing. I like being able to go out into the wilderness and stay for hours and hours without a sign of other human beings. More than that, I love to drive all day long. Start at five o’clock in the morning and stop when it starts getting dark. Can’t imagine living in a country so small you couldn’t do that without doubling back… ---
**Author:** ![Horatio\_Hellpop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2003, 7:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/77 "2003-07-14T07:12:06Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dtilque \* > \*\* > Seattle is further north than Montreal and, for that matter, Quebec City. > > Portland OR is further north than Toronto. \*\* Actually, all of Oregon is farther north than southernmost Canada. The southern tip near Detroit is roughly the same lattitude as northernmost California. I’m amazed that folks in England know as much about our geography as they do. I sort-of know where Cornwall, York and Liverpool are (mainly because of their proximity to France, Scotland and Ireland), but after that things get a little fuzzy. ---
**Author:** ![MLS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/919ad9/32.png) [@MLS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MLS)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2003, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/78 "2003-07-14T16:25:31Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Little Plastic Ninja \* > \*\*Having lived in TX over half my life, I can’t easily comprehend living in England. It must be like vacationing in your backyard. > > My idea of a really good time is to go so far out into the wilderness as I can within a few hours drive of home, then climb as high as I can and look at all the NOTHING. No cities, towns, houses, people…nothing. I like being able to go out into the wilderness and stay for hours and hours without a sign of other human beings. > > More than that, I love to drive all day long. Start at five o’clock in the morning and stop when it starts getting dark. Can’t imagine living in a country so small you couldn’t do that without doubling back… \*\* Not from Texas, but we love to take long and leisurely drives everywhere, too. We found that we had to completely rework our usual travel schedule when we visited the UK. On the one hand, it seemed to take less time to get from one area of interest to another. On the other hand, there is an incredible amount to do and see in a relatively small area, so we had to allow more time in one place. ---
**Author:** ![gex\_gex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/94ad74/32.png) [@gex\_gex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gex_gex)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2003, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/79 "2003-07-14T17:02:28Z")
> [@](#): > > _originally posted by Muffin_ > Snap quiz: > > Alaska is the northern-most state, so what is the second northern-most state? > > When answering, please indicate generally where you live. I’ll post now, then look it up… My guess: Maine. I live in Australia. I was tempted to go for Washington, and I thought about all kinds of unexpected states (Does Kansas own any territory in Canada?), but I figured that since the northern border of Washington is the 48th parallel (right?) it couldn’t be WA, since ID, MT, ND and MN also have the 48th parallel as their northern border. So, I went with the northernmost New England state. Though, considering, it’s possible that Michigan could jut up enough. I’ll have a look at my map… And the answer is: [spoiler]Damn! Maine doesn’t make it as far as the 48th. And Michigan certainly pulls up well short, unless it has some little islands that I’ve missed. It seems that MN is the winner, because it has something called the Red Lake Indian Reservation, which is a non-contiguous chunk north of the 48th.[/spoiler] OK, despite my efforts above, I think have a good grasp of American geography, despite having never been there. I can tell you all of the 50 states, their postal abbreviations, many of their capitals and that Florida is America’s wang. I can’t tell you the purpose of a panhandle (though I know what one is), or why so many states have them. Because I’m from Australia I have a reasonable grasp of the distances involved in America, but some things will trip me up every now and then. I was surprised the first time I found out just how far it was between San Francisco and Los Angeles. I mean, I knew it was a reasonable distance, but I was expecting something like 4-5 hours drive rather than 8-9. What I find incredible about US geography is how isolated some communities can be. If I lived in somewhere like Montana or Wyoming, it’d take me at least a full days drive to get anywhere near a reasonably sized city. I mean, we have those sort of distances in Australia, except you can ignore them here. Although it’d take even longer to get to a reasonably sized city from many places in Australia, those places don’t really have any people in them to care. But sure, Montana might be pretty empty, but there’s still towns with largish populations. In America, you have to care about distance, because there’s somewhere to get to, and something in between. I’d expect my fellow Australians to at least know and have some idea of the location of Seattle, NYC, LA, DC and Chicago, as well as Texas, Florida and Detroit (Eminem comes from there - it’s current). ---
**Author:** ![Exgineer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a88e4f/32.png) [@Exgineer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exgineer)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2003, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672/80 "2003-07-14T17:19:54Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Dawne \* > \*\*Thanks Muffin and OxyMoron, I’ll look out for those things but i don’t think we get much freedom to choose where we go, I’ll be stuck on a coach for hours everyday. Someone said something in another thread about a man who has wild rats on his arms in Toronto, I’ll look out for him too. \*\* Albany isn’t a very big town. If you end up downtown at all, you _will_ see Rockefeller’s Enormously Expensive Boondoggle. It’s impossible to ingore the ugly thing. **Neurotik** is pretty much right, though. You’re lucky you’ll only be here for a day. If you were luckier, you wouldn’t stop here at all. It’s a pretty boring place. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-well-do-other-nations-citizens-know-us-geography/187672.md?page=5)