# How were the pyramids in Egypt built? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 7, 2014, 10:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559 "2014-12-07T10:40:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 30
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/581 "2015-04-24T21:00:41Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > C’mon, guys. These puns are like Niles on a chalkboard. Is that where the geysers came from? ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/582 "2015-04-24T21:00:51Z")
> [@cladking](#): > > Since ramps are debunked (see post #152) and all the evidence says stones were pulled up then it’s time to stop the madness of trying to prove that ramps that never existed were used to the exclusion of real science. Apparently you are using a heretofore unknown ancient definition of the word “debunked”, because simple gainsaying of historical evidence of ramps, to modern ears, sounds like nothing more than denial. Likewise, your use of the term “real science” reflects a discipline that is neither real nor scientific. > [@](#): > > “When I use a word,” Humpty Dumpty said in rather a scornful tone, “it means just what I choose it to mean – neither more nor less.” > > “The question is,” said Alice, “whether you can make words mean so many different things.” > > “The question is,” said Humpty Dumpty, “which is to be master - - that’s all.” > > ~~Lewis Carroll, _Alice Through the Looking Glass_ ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/583 "2015-04-24T21:03:16Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > They didn’t mix left and right glyphs in text. > > Sometimes text was written left to right, sometimes right to left, and the figures always faced the start of the line. > > Also, text could be written either side of a doorway, and the figures always looked at the door. so, its all for the birds! ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/584 "2015-04-24T21:10:42Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > Also, text could be written either side of a doorway, and the figures always looked at the door. I did not know that. Thanks, ---
**Author:** ![cladking](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@cladking](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cladking)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/585 "2015-04-24T21:18:52Z")
> [@XT](#): > > Do you have a cite for this incredible assertion? No, of course you don’t. So far as anyone knows there are no pyramid or any other structure of souch vast weight and height as rthe very first great pyramid. Unless there’s something hiding somewhere this constitutes virtual proof that they never used ramps to build a massive object anywhere on earth before the first great pyramid. And after the great pyramids they never built another pyramid even as large as the first one. Simple fact. > [@](#): > > The ironic part, to me, is that you are attempting to debunk a ramp, one of the simplest but most effective means of moving large weights from a lower elevation to a higher by claiming it would have to spring out of the ground full blown… It doesn’t matter how simple a ramp is any more than it matters how simple it is for men to pull them straight up the side one step at a time or how simple a water operated balance system is. What matters is whatr system did they use. What matters is ramps are debunked and ignoring the debunkment changes nothing. What also matters is whatever system was used was something they knew would work before they started as evidenced conclusively by the very first being a great pyramid. Ramping systems fail at the top and they would have known there were issues with a ramping system before they started. So why was the first pyramid a great pyramid? It’s completely illogical to imagine a technology was born full blown. If it wasn’t technology and just bumpkins toying around with trial and error like Egyptologists believe then where are the trials and errors? How was it possible to start with a great pyramid? ---
**Author:** ![cladking](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@cladking](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cladking)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/586 "2015-04-24T21:21:29Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Just right click your chisel. If that doesn’t work just drag it with your mouse. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/587 "2015-04-24T21:25:30Z")
> [@cladking](#): > > If that doesn’t work just drag it with your mouse. You deserve a little credit for playing along. So how about trying to apply scientific method to your research and work out what you would need to convince someone with stricter standards of proof that your hypothesis holds water. ---
**Author:** ![Latro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@Latro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Latro)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/588 "2015-04-24T21:30:50Z")
> [@cladking](#): > > So far as anyone knows there are no pyramid or any other structure of souch vast weight and height as rthe very first great pyramid. Unless there’s something hiding somewhere this constitutes virtual proof that they never used ramps to build a massive object anywhere on earth before the first great pyramid. And after the great pyramids they never built another pyramid even as large as the first one. > > Simple fact > If it wasn’t technology and just bumpkins toying around with trial and error like Egyptologists believe then where are the trials and errors? How was it possible to start with a great pyramid? I’m rather taken aback by your total ignorance of the existence of earlier pyramids. ---
**Author:** ![cladking](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@cladking](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cladking)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/589 "2015-04-24T21:32:21Z")
> [@Latro](#): > > Here’s one thing I must have missed somewhere, cladking. > Where do you get your ‘ancient language’ texts from? > It’ s not the pyramid texts, is it? 'Cause they’re in plain egyptian and have been translated. I use the glyphs as copied by Sethe and a heiroglyphic dictionary with Gardner’s transcriptions. I use all the ancient writing but especially the Pyramid Texts because the PT are almost all the ancient writing. I primarily use Mercer’s translation but also Sethe’s, Faulkner’s, and Allen’s. There are also oddball translations. I recent years I’ve been studying the Coffin Texts a little even though these are mostly modern language. I’ve also recently started using Egyptological writings about the gods. These writings are physically painful for me but they do contain some keen insights and linguistic information that I don’t know about. I used no Egyptological interpretation other than translation for several years. I just keep reading the PT over and over until it makes sense or I get an idea for further research to solve sticky points. Mostly I feel I have an excellent framework for its understanding. Some passages I believe I understand as well as a slower Egyptian. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/590 "2015-04-24T21:39:59Z")
> [@cladking](#): > > If that doesn’t work just drag it with your mouse. You mean _Ra-mouses_. ---
**Author:** ![cladking](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@cladking](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cladking)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/591 "2015-04-24T22:30:14Z")
> [@Latro](#): > > I’m rather taken aback by your total ignorance of the existence of earlier pyramids. There are no earlier “pyramids”. The tiny little things Egyptologists euphimistically call pyramids to obfuscate the facts have no bearing on the great pyramids. The tiny little things that came later aren’t even relevant. ---
**Author:** ![cladking](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@cladking](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cladking)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/592 "2015-04-24T22:41:34Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > So how about trying to apply scientific method to your research and work out what you would need to convince someone with stricter standards of proof that your hypothesis holds water. My theory could be proven tomorrow (at least by the end of next week) if they would just run a few simple $200 tests and measurements. I can predict things like the exact chemical composition of the ben ben or the water and moon dust in the Osiris Shaft. Of course I can’t expect Egyptologists to give a whit about my theory and I don’t expect them to go out of their way in the least to falsify it. I merely expect them to do their damn jobs and that’s applying modern science and modern techniques to solving these mysteries. This means doing the infrared and ultraviolet imaging. I can predict the results of these tests as well and they will be consistent with my theory, probably. They should be doing microscopic forensics which will tell us the conditions inside the pyramid during construction and subsequent use. They could be doing all sorts of tests that scients would do like excavating the cave in the Tomb of the Birds or resuming excavation of the cave in the Osiris Shaft. There are dozens of tests from barometric studies of the Bent Pyramid to chemical analysis of the ground around the pyramid. There’s a geyser right north of the pyramid they’ll need to dig up eventually. Science is not being done at Giza. While what Lehner is doing is “science” it is not the indicated work and it is not in keeping with the spirit of Petrie who measured everything even if it was nailed down. If he had modern tools and instruments he’d have solved this already. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/593 "2015-04-24T22:49:27Z")
> [@cladking](#): > > This stuff is all in the record and someone else can google it as easily as I can. That is not how this works. You are making the wild claims; you invest the time to provide supporting documentation. For that matter, you have made numerous claims about what other people have said while refusing to provide a link or citation. For all that the other posters can know, you could be inventing straw man arguments, just as you could be inventing all the “explanations” you keep posting. This forum is Great Debates not My Flights of Fancy. If you continue to refuse to support your claims, this thread will be shut down (unless there is a groundswell of calls that it be moved to The BBQ Pit). [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/594 "2015-04-24T23:10:22Z")
> [@cladking](#): > > There are no earlier “pyramids”. > > The tiny little things Egyptologists euphimistically call pyramids to obfuscate the facts have no bearing on the great pyramids. The tiny little things that came later aren’t even relevant. This is wrong, and it really does sound more like all the ideas posted recently by you are like a clock chiming 13 times _ **every hour** _. > **[How did Egyptians build the Great Pyramid?](https://blog.world-mysteries.com/science/how-did-egyptians-build-the-great-pyarmid/)** > [@](#): > > How the massive blocks were raised to the height of the rising pyramid is not understood for certain. Earthen ramps were used at least in the initial stages of construction. Extant ramps have been found at the pyramids of Amenemhat I and Senwosret I at Lisht (see photos below), as well as at several other sites. Traces of disassembled ramps at pyramid sites are even more common. The ramps were made of brick or earth and rubble dressed with brick for strength. They were built up as the pyramid progressed upward, and removed as the pyramid was finished downward. That site BTW is full of new age and “mysterious” explanations for other subjects so the fact they they do acknowledge what is going on among serious researchers is noticeable. In more serious settings we have to check on the evidence found on the ramps by Houdin: [http://emhotep.net/2011/05/16/locations/lower-egypt/giza-plateau-lower-egypt/from-quarry-to-capstone-transporting-the-blocks-and-megaliths-of-the-great-pyramid-3/](http://emhotep.net/2011/05/16/locations/lower-egypt/giza-plateau-lower-egypt/from-quarry-to-capstone-transporting-the-blocks-and-megaliths-of-the-great-pyramid-3/) > [@](#): > > ``` > I started by examining Khafre’s royal causeway in order to find any clues to the existence of the ancient ramp leading from the port to Khufu’s construction site. Then I discovered that this causeway, about ten meters wide, is laid on a perfectly uniform foundation 23 m wide, extending 6.5 m on each side, which is the case neither for Khufu’s royal causeway (10 m wide), nor for Menkaure’s causeway (8 m wide). Over the better part of the south side, very large limestone blocks were even put into place to fill in hollows. > > After walking back up Khafre’s royal causeway to its western end, I stood exactly where the external ramp for the Pyramid of Khufu should have started. From there, I was surprised to discover a sort of large slab floor, made of limestone blocks, pointing towards the Great Pyramid. These blocks have nothing to do with Khafre’s Pyramid (the transport of the blocks needed to construct this pyramid did not require such an infrastructure), from which I deduced that they would probably have served as the foundation for the external ramp of Khufu’s Pyramid. > > Moreover, along its route, this ramp serves several of the quarries on the plateau, which supplied most of the materials for the Great Pyramid. This ramp, currently measuring nearly 500 m with a slope of 8.5%, is ideal for the stresses of moving sledges, even more so for dragging beams loaded onto large sledges on rollers. > > In my view, the conclusion was obvious: the royal funereal causeway connecting the Low and High Temples of the Pyramid of Khafre had been constructed on an ancient ramp that could only have been used on the previous construction project for the Pyramid of Khufu. King Khafre must have reused a route that had served in the construction of his father’s pyramid. > > ``` ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/595 "2015-04-24T23:18:36Z")
> [@cladking](#): > > There are no earlier “pyramids”. > > The tiny little things Egyptologists euphimistically call pyramids to obfuscate the facts have no bearing on the great pyramids. The tiny little things that came later aren’t even relevant. Well, with that I think you’ve jumped the shark fully (hell, you leaped it like Superman). I mean, personally I think you jumped the shark around your 2nd or 3rd post, but others engaged you anyway even as you spun more and more towards the wall of woo. But seriously? You don’t acknowledge any pyramids built before those on the Giza plateau? And you expect to be taken seriously? This is a level of ignorance that goes beyond the mundane into the truly sublime. ---
**Author:** ![cladking](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@cladking](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cladking)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2015, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/596 "2015-04-24T23:37:40Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > That is not how this works. You are making the wild claims; you invest the time to provide supporting documentation. > > For that matter, you have made numerous claims about what other people have said while refusing to provide a link or citation. For all that the other posters can know, you could be inventing straw man arguments, just as you could be inventing all the “explanations” you keep posting. This forum is Great Debates not My Flights of Fancy. > > If you continue to refuse to support your claims, this thread will be shut down (unless there is a groundswell of calls that it be moved to The BBQ Pit). > > [/Moderating] I have offerred to support anything relevant to the argument. I am not going to support statements like “metaphysics is the basis of ancient and modern science” because these are contingent on definitions and perspective. I am not going to get involved is semantical arguments and irrelevancies. Every post I’ve made is support for my argument. I will provide documentation for any specific question but I can’t retype every one of my posts when someone looses the thread. Somehow or other it always seems evidence like water worn canals and vertical lines above water collection devices get lost is a sea of “it mustta been ramps”. Even pictures of ben bens can’t hold a candle to the concept that ramps are the only possible means. I can quote a line writrten by the builders themselves of how they lifted the stones, “the earth is made high under the sky by means of the arms of tefnut”, but this means nothing when perfectly intelligent Egyptologists say they mustta used ramps. What exactly does anyone want documentation for? Please remember if an idea is derived from evidence I can only cite the evidence from which it is derived. This is all my own work and there’s no site on the net that I’m reading it from. There are no Egyptologists who believe in anyt of this so I can cite Allen saying that “sky arcs” are rainbows. I can only tell yoiu that every single timne the concept of rainbows arises that Allen uses “sky arcs” and Mercer and Faulkner use “bows”. Anyone who wants the Straight Dope can try to understand what I’m saying. Maybe I’m wrong, it wouldn’t be the first time. The irony here is I’ve already cited hundreds of pieces of evidence and logic to support my position. ALL of the evidence supports my position. I’ve even shown it couldn’t have been ramps. But ramp proponents have nothing at all except the contention “it mustta been ramps”. How in the world do I compete with this. I’ll check back in. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2015, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/597 "2015-04-25T00:39:00Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > If you continue to refuse to support your claims, this thread will be shut down (unless there is a groundswell of calls that it be moved to The BBQ Pit). “‘Skin me, Brer [TOM],’ sez Brer Rabbit, sezee, ‘snatch out my eyeballs, t’ar out my yeras by de roots, en cut off my legs,’ sezee, ‘but do please, Brer [TOM], don’t fling [THIS THREAD] in dat [BBQ PIT],’ sezee” _Apologies to Joel Chandler Harris_ ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2015, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/598 "2015-04-25T01:58:36Z")
> [@cladking](#): > > I have offerred to support anything relevant to the argument. What you have claimed to have offered and what you have actually provided are light years apart. I am not even that interested in support for your personal fantasies regarding the construction. However, you have repeatedly made silly claims about what Egyptologists have said and, with one brief exception that did not support your claim, you have utterly failed to provide evidence that they have actually said what you attributed to them. ---
**Author:** ![cladking](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@cladking](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cladking)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2015, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/599 "2015-04-25T03:06:56Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > What you have claimed to have offered and what you have actually provided are light years apart. > > I am not even that interested in support for your personal fantasies regarding the construction. However, you have repeatedly made silly claims about what Egyptologists have said and, with one brief exception that did not support your claim, you have utterly failed to provide evidence that they have actually said what you attributed to them. I understand now. I’ve run into this before of course. I guess it should have been expected on a site that’s “fighting ignorance”. Egyptologists are the experts and the scholars and nothing I ever say or prove will change this. As experts and scholars they deserve respect if not people kowtowing to their every pronouncement. My perspective isn’t so very much different but after you get beaten about the head enough times with “ramps”, cultural context", “superstitious builders”, and “tombs” enough times and each time loaded with insult and innuendo it changes the way you talk about things. I don’t really know any Egyptologists very well and don’t read much of their writing but some of their beliefs become very obvious as you get pummeled and study the available literature. One of these things is that every single one of them believes the ancient gods were imaginary and powerful consciousnesses in which the ancient people believed. Of course I don’t have a means of proving no Egyptologist exists who thinks they didn’t believe in imaginary beings but I’m perfectly willing to make exceptions if one wants to come forward. This is, by my definition calling the ancient people “superstitious”. Perhaps this isn’t everyone’s definition but using the word “superstitious” is my short hand way to refer to belief in fantastic things that can’t be proven. This means Egyptoilogists believe the ancient people were superstitious. Maybe some Egyptologist doesn’t believe this but I think such a bewlief would make him stand out from the crowd enough he’d be well known. Egyptologists also believe that the great pyramids were tombs worked on during peak growing season with no crop in the ground. This might not be as universal but it’s a general belief and reflects a poor opinion of the people. They believe these tombs were for dead kings whom the people believed lived forever despite the fact that no direct evidence of any type exists that these were tombs. This is just the fact. I can almost quote everything the people ever said to show no direct evidence but this is beyond the scope of this post or thread. I’ve never been contradicted on this except for many people citing the extensive circumstantial evidence that they are tombs. Egyptologists also promulgate the idea that there is extensive evidence for their beliefs. They actually refer to “cultural context” and a “mountain of evidence” despite the fact the word “ramp” isn’t even attested from the great pyramid building age. Again I can’t cite all the known writing in this post but it is simply factual that the word isn’t attested and no one has ever contested this point. Obviously if they used ramps to build and the word “ramp” isn’t attested then it follows there is no mountain of evidence. The same applies to “cultural context”. If they knew what the people were like and how they thought then they must understand the superstitions they say were universal. Egyptologists should be abble to say when a shm-sceptre was preferable to a nbht-sceptre or how to administer an eye of horus. They can’t. They don’t agree on the nature of the eye of horus and I linked a “book” written on the subject several posts back. Even the most basic terms have no meaning to Egyptologists. It is a simple fact that Egyptologists don’t agree on such details as it applies to the great pyramid building age. Later cultures are well understood because you can just read what they wrote but the pyramid builders aren’t understood. The meaning of words like “ankh” are clear enough but how they arose is a closed book. One Egyptologist thinks it’s a sandal strap (half right in a left handed sort of way) and another thinks it’s a map of the Nile (completely wrong). Indeed, there just isn’t agreement on many details. Modern translations don’t even look much like older translations. Of course no Egyptologist is really going to agree with much of this. They’ll admit they don’t know things like the meaning of the eye of horus but then they’ll tell you it’s because it’s incredibly complicated and the concept meant something different to each Egyptian or locale. I would ask why they even bother studying the book if the most basic terms are insoluble. If nbo sense has bewen made of it to date because as they believe it’s just magic and incantation then whyt study it? Magic doesn’t work, right? So why do they try to make sense of magic? How can they say they understand a culture based on a book of mahgic they themselves never possibly understand and can never make effective. Most Egyptologists say things like the people were made strong by their beliefs. Egyptologists describe these people in very poor terms (IN MY OPINION) and they say things like they were intelligent and sophisticated. If you go googling this is what you’ll see. They’ll say the people were obsessed with death. They believed in magic. They believed in Gods. They believed they needed to make a huge tomb for their dead king who lived eternally and knocked around in the pyramid at night. They say the people endangered themselves and their families by expending vast resources in peak growing season with no crop in the ground. They say that the only means to build pyramids was the simplest possible; ramps. They say they were uneducated. They say they inscribed grammatical errors and misspellings in stone. They imply they were very primitive ans backward and that individual rights were unimportant. They suggest women were subjugated. Do all Egyptologists believe all these things? Pretty much. Of course there’s some individual variation in all groups but there isn’t really any variation to speak of with the major assumptions. Egyptology is essentially a science founded on the assumptions that the Egyptians were superstitious and changeless people who dragged tombs upo ramps. In the last few years they are trying to backpeddle from ramps but each still believes that a muscle based means of lifting stones was used. How am I supposed to show this? No Egyptologist will actually say the ancients were stinky footed bumpkins but then they’ll translate the ancient writing as an entreaty to the gods not to walk in corpse drippings!! Imagine how insulting that would be to these people if they are wrong! Egyptologists descrivbe them in these terms and then call them sophisticated or some such term. This is the state of affairs. Ask an Egyptologist if the ancients believed in magic. Sure someone can say superstition has always been with us and they aren’t sayting anything worse about the Egyptians but this simply isn’t true. They say they were led by priests and were moribound by death and the industry of death. They paint a picture of people who spent their lives thinking about death and they do this because almost everything we know came out of tombs. It is SAMPLE ERROR. They do this because they misinterpret the evidence in the tombs and imagine even “the house of life” (the pyramid) was a tomb. They misinterpret the evidence to say thatr when they weren’t busyt dying to get in a tomb they were working themselves to death to build the tombs. They believe this because dragging 6 1/2 million tons up a ramp is hard work. It would take decades and tens of thousands of men workjing in the desert summer heat. I believe anyone familiar with Egyptology will see the truth in these words. Some of it is remarkable easy to show. That all Egyptologists believe the people were superstitious is apparent. Of course No Egyptologist will agree with the perspective of this post but the fact is it is accurate. Some can be shown and in my opinion all of it is justified. Here’s the state of the art in Egyptology today. This just happened last night I believe. It’s a very sad display. It will make you cringe; [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/8Ziu2ygE_Wc/maxresdefault.jpg "Zahi Hawass Storms out of Debate with Graham Hancock before it Begins") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Ziu2ygE_Wc) ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2015, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559/600 "2015-04-25T03:14:46Z")
[quote=“cladking, post:599, topic:706559”] Here’s the state of the art in Egyptology today. This just happened last night I believe. It’s a very sad display. It will make you cringe; [/QUOTE] Of course it made me cringe, you are defending another recognized crank: Graham Hancock :smack: > **[Graham Hancock](https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Graham_Hancock)** > > Graham Bruce Hancock (2 August 1950–) is a British pseudoarchaeologist and pseudoscientist, most noted for writing a number of books surrounding the Pyramids and Sphinx of Giza, as well as other ancient monuments. He is mostly recently known for... > [@](#): > > Ironically, his writing career started off on a sound note, with a book about AIDS and a follow up, called “Lords of Poverty.” He then set off to find the Ark of the Covenant, which would appear to be tucked away in a little Ethiopian backwater.[1] However, he seemed to believe implicitly that there was an Ark and therefore it could be found. > > Then came his magnum opus - Fingerprints of the Gods. In this tome, he starts off by being amazed by the fact that there exist maps of the world showing bits that hadn’t been discovered yet at the time they were drawn. This is a pretty selective approach, since early maps frequently show areas of land that were not actually there, due to mistakes or misidentification. That applies to the good cartographers - some early mapmakers put land in their maps because they suspected (for no good reason) that there might be land there, or possibly for aesthetic purposes - for example, to make the empty areas look prettier. In short, it is unwise to draw conclusions about what old maps show in unexplored regions without being very careful. > > Hancock shows every sign of not showing such caution. He went off in search of the ancient civilisation which had created these maps, basically calling it Atlantis and stating that the Atlantean ruins are now under the Antarctic ice, thanks to crustal displacement. On top of all this, he aligned the Giza complex to the constellation of Orion as it was some 10,000 years ago, although the BBC program Horizon thought otherwise. They claimed that Hancock had fiddled with the locations of some of the temples to fit in with his own theories, and had even ignored the texts carved on the temples themselves, which explained quite clearly why and when they had been built. Hancock cried foul to the Broadcasting Standards Commission, who politely told him to sod off. At least he never mentioned aliens or shape-changing lizards. > > After another turgid tome on Giza, this time written with Robert Bauval, Hancock released The Mars Mystery. Although he puts forward some interesting theories on what happened to Mars way back when, he spoils it all by claiming the “Face on Mars” (and all the other “structures” in Cydonia) to be real and not a happy circumstance of light and rocks. It looks like debunked ancient aliens proponents, walk like debunked ancient aliens proponents, sound like debunked ancient aliens proponents, but we have to assume that this supports your pyramid water theory. :rolleyes: [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559.md?page=29) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-were-the-pyramids-in-egypt-built/706559.md?page=31)