# How will the Moral Monday movement affect politics in NC & the South? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [February 21, 2014, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900 "2014-02-21T19:08:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/41 "2014-02-26T15:10:52Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Clinton not a liberal was heard from the left for a long time. Do you agree with that though? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/42 "2014-02-26T15:50:24Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > It’s small-l liberals who will support a program that gets miserable or even counterproductive results, and when challenged, respond, “Do you have a better idea? It’s better than nothing!” Usually, it **is.** ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/43 "2014-02-26T16:39:54Z")
> [@](#): > > Quoth **lance strongarm** : > > Liberals generally want to end farm subsidies and other “corporate welfare” and cut Pentagon programs that are nothing but pork for military contractors (or for weapons the Pentagon says it doesn’t even want). Heck, most of the programs that the Pentagon _does_ want are wasteful and don’t accomplish much, too. But you never hear of anyone but liberals calling for their end. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/44 "2014-02-26T19:43:25Z")
Clinton was DLC, aka, not a liberal, never was. The DLC was the big bogeyman of the Kos crowd for years, second only to Karl Rove. And no, ending programs they hated to start with doesn’t count. A person who truly cares about getting value for the taxpayers will cut or end a program that doesn’t work even if they really wanted it to work. When will liberals call for ending Head Start? Did liberals support welfare reform? Will liberals support ending even one of the duplicative jobs training programs that the government runs? Or how about any non-defense portion of the budget that the GAO identified as duplicative of other non-defense programs? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/45 "2014-02-26T19:51:12Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > When will liberals call for ending Head Start? Why would they? That **gets** results. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/46 "2014-02-26T19:57:33Z")
Which dissipate by 4th grade, at best. ---
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/47 "2014-02-26T20:47:04Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Remember the [National Partnership for Reinventing Government](http://govinfo.library.unt.edu/npr/whoweare/history2.html) (at one point called the National Performance Review) headed by Al Gore during the Clinton Administration? > > From the link: Well done. Excellent example. ---
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/48 "2014-02-26T20:48:06Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Which dissipate by 4th grade, at best. Do you have evidence for that claim? ---
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/49 "2014-02-26T20:50:13Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Clinton was DLC, aka, not a liberal, never was. Stop this No True Scotsman game. All you’re doing is proving, at best, that many of the politicians you oppose aren’t liberals. What’s that prove? They still oppose you and your views. So please get back on track and stop worrying about what a certain group you assign a certain label to thinks. You’re just taking the teeth out of your own “liberals!” accusation. It’s a silly game. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/50 "2014-02-26T21:14:25Z")
> [@lance\_strongarm](#): > > Stop this No True Scotsman game. > > All you’re doing is proving, at best, that many of the politicians you oppose aren’t liberals. What’s that prove? They still oppose you and your views. So please get back on track and stop worrying about what a certain group you assign a certain label to thinks. You’re just taking the teeth out of your own “liberals!” accusation. It’s a silly game. Well, that’s just “Dances With Goalposts” **adaher,** you should know to expect it by now. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2014, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/51 "2014-02-27T17:41:48Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > When will liberals call for ending Head Start? Did liberals support welfare reform? Will liberals support ending even one of the duplicative jobs training programs that the government runs? Or how about any non-defense portion of the budget that the GAO identified as duplicative of other non-defense programs? Problem is, folks who you are identifying as liberals are not convinced that these programs are failures. Your own belief in their failure is very strongly influenced by your desire to see programs that benefit the poor as ineffective. Instead of concluding that liberals are principled people who draw different conclusions from the evidence from the ones you draw, you conclude liberals are hypocrites. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2014, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/52 "2014-02-27T19:15:39Z")
Well, they are. They are human, and hypocrisy is about as universal a human failing as can be imagined. Might as well accuse them of having navels. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2014, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/53 "2014-03-01T02:36:05Z")
Liberals want to get rid of navel bases. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2014, 7:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/54 "2014-03-01T07:00:36Z")
All your navel bases are belong to us. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2014, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/55 "2014-03-01T14:33:59Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Problem is, folks who you are identifying as liberals are not convinced that these programs are failures. Your own belief in their failure is very strongly influenced by your desire to see programs that benefit the poor as ineffective. Instead of concluding that liberals are principled people who draw different conclusions from the evidence from the ones you draw, you conclude liberals are hypocrites. The hypocrisy is about the science more than anything else. Studies show a program isn’t working, and all of a sudden science gets discarded in favor of blind moralizing. Liberals turn into faith-based evangelists. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2014, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/56 "2014-03-01T15:05:01Z")
I’m especially ashamed at how liberals and lefties dragged America into George and Dick’s Excellent Military Adventure. You were kind enough not to mention that. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2014, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/57 "2014-03-01T21:12:23Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > The hypocrisy is about the science more than anything else. Studies show a program isn’t working, and all of a sudden science gets discarded in favor of blind moralizing. Liberals turn into faith-based evangelists. Are you claiming that conservatives–he’ll, let’s not generalize, let’s just say YOU–are better at changing their minds about a program when confronted with surprising evidence about its efficacy? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2014, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/58 "2014-03-01T22:04:16Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Are you claiming that conservatives–he’ll, let’s not generalize, let’s just say YOU–are better at changing their minds about a program when confronted with surprising evidence about its efficacy? I’m afraid that’s still too subtle. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2014, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/59 "2014-03-20T20:33:49Z")
[Dozens of Moral Monday protesters arrested in Atlanta.](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/03/18/georgia-moral-monday-_n_4988411.html?utm_hp_ref=politics) > [@](#): > > Thirty-nine people were arrested at the Georgia state capitol in Atlanta Tuesday as a coalition of organizations under the “Moral Mondays” banner urged state legislators to allow Gov. Nathan Deal (R) to expand Medicaid under the Affordable Care Act. > > A bill under consideration by the Georgia state Senate on Tuesday aimed to reinforce the state’s rejection of the Medicaid expansion. According to The New York Times, just as the session started, five people in the Senate gallery shouted and unfurled a banner that read “Medicaid expansion now!” ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2014, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900/60 "2014-03-20T20:59:56Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > The hypocrisy is about the science more than anything else. Studies show a program isn’t working, and all of a sudden science gets discarded in favor of blind moralizing. Liberals turn into faith-based evangelists. You were asked for a citation. You have not brought one. At the moment, you seem to be the one working on faith. Head Start hasn’t been about getting better results in years, anyways. It’s just the state-run preschool program. Parents work, and kids have to go somewhere. They might as well go somewhere where they might learn rather than just a daycare. The program stays because it is less convenient to not exist. If it also helps with schooling, awesome. The liberal position is not shut down everything if it doesn’t fit its original use. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-will-the-moral-monday-movement-affect-politics-in-nc-the-south/681900.md?page=4)