# How would Obama, if elected President, tear this country apart? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 14, 2008, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802 "2008-10-14T00:20:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![ShibbOleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@ShibbOleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShibbOleth)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2008, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/81 "2008-10-29T14:35:53Z")
> [@lucky\_henry](#): > > Perhaps you should do the same. > [http://marcambinder.theatlantic.com/archives/2008/10/responding\_to\_the\_obama\_tax\_ca.php](http://marcambinder.theatlantic.com/archives/2008/10/responding_to_the_obama_tax_ca.php) Do you have a non-biased cite? The data at that link quotes Americans for Tax Reform. > [@](#): > > Americans for Tax Reform is an interest group seeking to reduce the overall level of taxation in the United States, at the federal, state and local level. Its founder and president is Grover Norquist, an influential Republican lobbyist. Norquist is also part of the “Gang of Five”, has ties to Jack Abramoff and big Tobacco. ---
**Author:** ![ShibbOleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@ShibbOleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShibbOleth)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2008, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/82 "2008-10-29T14:37:40Z")
> [@BrightNShiny](#): > > If elected, Obama will push the country to Warp 10, thereby tearing it apart. Nah, he’s going to tear it apart with his bare hands, then use his saliva and tears to glue it back together as a more compassionate nation. He’s like Chuck Norris without the evil badass gene. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2008, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/83 "2008-10-29T14:53:15Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Where would [Dennis Kucinich](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dennis_kucinich) be placed on the British political spectrum? He’d be a typical New Labour type. Slightly right of centre. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2008, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/84 "2008-10-29T14:56:37Z")
> [@BrightNShiny](#): > > If elected, Obama will push the country to Warp 10, thereby tearing it apart. Nonsense. A classic Voyager episode established that this will turn the whole country into mouth-breathing mutant reptiles obsessed with reproduction. Not just the red coloured bits. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2008, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/85 "2008-10-29T15:11:54Z")
I think he’ll be a divisive figure for sure. He has a sort of self-righteous attitude. More domestic terrorism is likely. But as far as actually getting legislation passed, he has to go through Congress, and even though Congress is Democratic I expect overall reason will prevail. During the debates he seemed to have some agressive ideas when it comes to foreign policy, like he’s over-compensating for the notion that Democrats are weak on defense. Hopefully that won’t lead to any foolhardy actions. If Obama is elected I’m sure the black community will overwhelmingly love it. Good for them I say. Hopefully Obama will be an inspiration to them instead of a provider. Hopefully the 1 in 3 (!) incarceration rate for young black men will go WAY down. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2008, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/86 "2008-10-29T15:12:58Z")
> [@Wendell\_Wagner](#): > > tagos writes: > > \> Moderately right of centre, right of the Conservative Party in the UK. > > You know, I’ve heard this claim before, but I’ve never believed it. As far as I can see, there’s no way that the average Democratic congressman is to the right of the average Conservative M. P. Can you give us any sense in which that would be true? Please use examples which are about current plans to change things, not about inertia in the political system. I don’t think, for instance, that the fact that the Conservatives were never able to get rid of the National Health System in the U.K. while so far the Democrats haven’t been able to create one in the U.S. shows that Democrats are to the right of the Conservatives. Start a new thread if you think this is getting too far from the subject of this one. It’s not about individuals it’s about policies. The Conservative Party unapologetically supports the Welfare State and redistributive taxation. They have never tried to get rid of the NHS and have no intention of doing so. That would be political suicide. Currently the Conservatives are to the left of New Labour. Or pretending to be anyway. I don’t think Americans really understand either how God-obsessed your society and politics are and how far outside the industrialised norm when it comes to collective provision. How we look in horror at your callous, devil-take-the-hindmost, attitudes to the ‘losers’ in society. The UK has moved more towards the US in some ways but if the Democrats and Republican parties were transposed to here replacing New Labour and Conservatives the Republicans of the last couple of decades would be a tiny rump party. Third behind the Liberal Democrats. Latest polls put McCain on just 15% to Obama’s 63%. [Poll](http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/oct/17/uselections2008-barackobama1) ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Carrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@Captain\_Carrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Carrot)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2008, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/87 "2008-10-29T15:20:29Z")
> [@control-z](#): > > But as far as actually getting legislation passed, he has to go through Congress, and even though Congress is Democratic I expect overall reason will prevail. As I’ve said before, he has a history of being able to get both sides to compromise and produce a result with which they are at least satisfied, if not happy. I doubt he’ll be substantially less effective at that as a President and not a Senator. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2008, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/88 "2008-10-29T15:21:56Z")
> [@ShibbOleth](#): > > Nah, he’s going to tear it apart with his bare hands, then use his saliva and tears to glue it back together as a more compassionate nation. He’s like Chuck Norris without the evil badass gene. You forgot the beard. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2008, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/89 "2008-10-30T02:39:50Z")
tagos writes: \> I don’t think Americans really understand either how God-obsessed your society \> and politics are and how far outside the industrialised norm when it comes to \> collective provision. How we look in horror at your callous, devil-take-the- \> hindmost, attitudes to the ‘losers’ in society. I don’t think that Brits really understand how false the image of the U.S. is that they get from American TV and movies is. I lived in the U.K. for three years. I just don’t see the U.S. as being that much more God-obsessed than the U.K. Nor do I see Americans as having that much more of a callous attitude towards losers in society. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2008, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/90 "2008-10-30T02:44:50Z")
> [@Wendell\_Wagner](#): > > Nor do I see Americans as having that much more of a callous attitude towards losers in society. Apparently, you missed this recent thread: [I Hate The Homeless](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=488819) ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2008, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/91 "2008-10-30T02:44:52Z")
> [@Wendell\_Wagner](#): > > I lived in the U.K. for three years. I just don’t see the U.S. as being that much more God-obsessed than the U.K. Nor do I see Americans as having that much more of a callous attitude towards losers in society. In the alternate universe you live in, does Obama have a goatee and use an agonizer on people who fail him, too ? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2008, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/92 "2008-10-30T03:28:55Z")
> [@control-z](#): > > I think he’ll be a divisive figure for sure. He has a sort of self-righteous attitude. More domestic terrorism is likely. Will Obama do the terrorism himself, or enlist the aid of his evil minions? Will he just blow up things, or will he turn his enemies over to his terrorist associates? ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2008, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/93 "2008-10-30T03:42:54Z")
> [@control-z](#): > > I think he’ll be a divisive figure for sure. He has a sort of self-righteous attitude. More domestic terrorism is likely. 😕 If a President’s “self-righteous attitude” is a trigger for domestic terrorism, then surely we should have been awash in domestic terror incidents for most of the past eight years? I mean, Bush is notoriously, and somewhat ostentatiously, convinced of his own rightness, not to mention being about as divisive as it’s possible to get, but we haven’t had crazy domestic terror loons being provoked by that to blow stuff up. Or are you arguing that the crazy domestic terror loons would be infuriated by self-righteousness in a liberal president, but not a conservative one? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2008, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/94 "2008-10-30T04:24:50Z")
> [@control-z](#): > > More domestic terrorism is likely. Errmm . . . You mean terrorism **by Americans?** More Timothy McVeighs? Really? Because that’s the only conceivable interpretation of that sentence that isn’t totally full of shit. > [@control-z](#): > > But as far as actually getting legislation passed, he has to go through Congress, and even though Congress is Democratic I expect overall reason will prevail. 😕 I think you’ll find Obama is to the right, not the left, of the center of gravity of the Congressional Democratic Caucuses. > [@control-z](#): > > During the debates he seemed to have some agressive ideas when it comes to foreign policy, like he’s over-compensating for the notion that Democrats are weak on defense. Hopefully that won’t lead to any foolhardy actions. [With McCain, foolhardy actions are all but certain.](http://www.thenation.com/doc/20080324/dreyfuss) ---
**Author:** ![furt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/439d5e/32.png) [@furt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furt)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2008, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/95 "2008-10-30T04:35:29Z")
> [@lee](#): > > I just finished a conversation with an older relative of mine who made this assertion several times that if elected President, Obama would tear this country apart. How would this work? By what mechanism would he tear it apart? What could he do as president to tear it apart so it could not function? I want to understand what this is about, but could get no specifics from the person I talked to other than Obama is so far left he cannot lead and it is shameful he was elected to congress. (Would Keyes really have been more centrist?) > > Can anyone tell he how this is supposed to come to pass? I’ve heard the assertion many times that Bush has torn the country apart. How did this work? By what mechanism did he tear it apart? It can’t possibly be something as simple as “he had policies that significant portions of the nation disliked, and the divisions became acrimonious and hostile,” can it? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2008, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/96 "2008-10-30T04:45:08Z")
> [@furt](#): > > I’ve heard the assertion many times that Bush has torn the country apart. How did this work? By what mechanism did he tear it apart? > > It can’t possibly be something as simple as “he had policies that significant portions of the nation disliked, and the divisions became acrimonious and hostile,” can it? No, it’s that he’s done more than any POTUS since Nixon to bring the government itself into disrepute. More than that, he took one of the greatest opportunities history ever handed to a president to build national confidence and unity, and he took a great big dump all over it and passed out in his own vomit, politically speaking. ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2008, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/97 "2008-10-30T16:30:32Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > 😕 If a President’s “self-righteous attitude” is a trigger for domestic terrorism, then surely we should have been awash in domestic terror incidents for most of the past eight years? I mean, Bush is notoriously, and somewhat ostentatiously, convinced of his own rightness, not to mention being about as divisive as it’s possible to get, but we haven’t had crazy domestic terror loons being provoked by that to blow stuff up. > > Or are you arguing that the crazy domestic terror loons would be infuriated by self-righteousness in a liberal president, but not a conservative one? Maybe so. I don’t remember any plots to kill Bush, but we’ve already had a (brain-dead) plot to kill Obama. ---
**Author:** ![Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troy_mcclure_sf/32/4150_2.png) [@Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Troy_McClure_SF)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2008, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/98 "2008-10-30T17:11:31Z")
_Obama_ will do nothing to tear this country apart. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2008, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/99 "2008-10-30T19:34:39Z")
[As I’ve argued before,](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=9726955&highlight=marginalized+permanently#post9726955) what America needs right now is a divider, **not** a uniter. But I’m not optimistic Obama will be the one to “tear this country apart” the way it needs to be torn apart. ---
**Author:** ![Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e480ec/32.png) [@Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Least_Original_User_Name_Ever)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2008, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802/100 "2008-10-31T02:37:44Z")
> [@control-z](#): > > Maybe so. I don’t remember any plots to kill Bush, but we’ve already had a (brain-dead) plot to kill Obama. There have been more death threats on the president as time progresses. That’s in part to the effectiveness of the Secret Service and in part due to the Internet and the amount of threats that get thrown around. Obama will get more threats than Bush, but I think because the trend has been going that way. Back to the question, the country won’t get torn apart any more than it got torn apart during Bush’s second term. …No, shit. You can make a good argument that it happened. Nevermind. Really, though, I don’t think the country is going to have mass riots in celebration. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/how-would-obama-if-elected-president-tear-this-country-apart/467802.md?page=6)