# Howard Dean for President?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476
**Category:** Politics & Elections
**Created:** [August 17, 2013, 7:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476 "2013-08-17T07:25:55Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)
#### Post date: [August 17, 2013, 7:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/1 "2013-08-17T07:25:55Z")
> **[Howard Dean to headline Iowa event](https://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/159338-howard-dean-to-headline-iowa-event/)**
>
> Howard Dean (D) is heading to Iowa, a decision that raises questions about a possible White House bid.
He recently said he was considering maybe running, and now he’s headed to Iowa. Are Democrats still interested in him?
Seems to me that Dean has a lot to offer. Most notably, he’s the absolute perfect guy to implement ACA. He was a very capable governor. He takes policy seriously. No one can accuse him of being a wimp.
Of course, he ran a very partisan campaign in 2003/early 2004, which made it hard for conservatives like me to consider him. But I’d be open to Dean if we see more of former Governor Dean and less of “YEEEAAAAHHHH, I hate Republicans so damn much!” Dean.
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### Author:  [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)
#### Post date: [August 17, 2013, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/2 "2013-08-17T13:06:50Z")
Howard would be an awesome president. He’s one of the few who seem to realize that the opposition party is a bunch of heartless terrorists who’d blow up the country if it meant they got to be in charge of the rubble. He’d be much more combative than Obama, which is what we really need: someone to stand up to the bastards and call them out for being the pieces of shit that they are.
That being said, he probably has no chance. His time was years ago.
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### Author:  [@etv78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/etv78)
#### Post date: [August 17, 2013, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/3 "2013-08-17T13:20:46Z")
The reason he was so partisan:
1)Running for President
2)Chair of DNC
2 _very_ partisan ventures
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### Author:  [@crucible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crucible)
#### Post date: [August 17, 2013, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/4 "2013-08-17T14:17:19Z")
I agree completely that the ‘strategy’ of trying to be polite to the Republicans has not worked, it only encourages them to be more and more strident and aggressive. I suspect the only thing that would work even worse would be to try to identify them as the treasonous set of scum they are.
Might as well try, though, perhaps an enormous, destructive fight today will be better than a complete war later.
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### Author:  [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)
#### Post date: [August 17, 2013, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/5 "2013-08-17T15:08:45Z")
He’s rhetorically more combative than Obama, but given his actual history of governing, I think he’d be more accomodative than Obama has been. Dean knows when to fight and when to deal. Obama never seems quite sure and sometimes he does both at the same time. He’s also the only President I’ve ever seen who attacks his own deals.
You know what would be awesome? Dean vs. Christie. Two pretty combative dudes.
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### Author:  [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)
#### Post date: [August 17, 2013, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/6 "2013-08-17T15:11:18Z")
That “RRRAAARRGGHHHH!” thing he did in 2004 killed his campaign. :smack:
My dad was a big Dean supporter and would have worked as a staffer had he been the candidate, and also lives in Des Moines and was at that rally, so he knew the back story behind it.
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### Author:  [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)
#### Post date: [August 17, 2013, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/7 "2013-08-17T15:18:21Z")
> [@nearwildheaven](#):
>
> That “RRRAAARRGGHHHH!” thing he did in 2004 killed his campaign.
Yeah, Republicans labelled him as “angry”, which supposedly turned off voters. Seems kind of quaint in light of the Tea Party.
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### Author:  [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)
#### Post date: [August 17, 2013, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/8 "2013-08-17T15:50:16Z")
> [@](#):
>
> He’s rhetorically more combative than Obama, but given his actual history of governing, I think he’d be more accomodative than Obama has been.
So, he’d nominate one of the Koch brothers as his VP, and then immediately resign? Because that’s about the only thing Obama hasn’t done to try to accommodate the Republicans.
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### Author:  [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)
#### Post date: [August 17, 2013, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/9 "2013-08-17T16:32:19Z")
> [@adaher](#):
>
> I think he’d be more accomodative than Obama has been.
> [@Chronos](#):
>
> So, he’d nominate one of the Koch brothers as his VP, and then immediately resign? Because that’s about the only thing Obama hasn’t done to try to accommodate the Republicans.
I’m guessing adaher recently read _World War Z_, in which Dean served as Vice President under a Republican President.
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### Author:  [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)
#### Post date: [August 17, 2013, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/10 "2013-08-17T17:14:25Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#):
>
> I’m guessing adaher recently read _World War Z_, in which Dean served as Vice President under a Republican President.
Wasn’t it Colin Powell? Hell, I’d vote for that ticket.
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### Author:  [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)
#### Post date: [August 17, 2013, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/11 "2013-08-17T18:03:58Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#):
>
> Yeah, Republicans labelled him as “angry”, which supposedly turned off voters. Seems kind of quaint in light of the Tea Party.
I don’t think this would work as well today. Back then the news rooms just played that clip of him screaming over and over and then the TV people all clutched their pearls and tut-tutted. Today, the whole speech would be on YouTube and everyone could see for themselves that it was just an awkward moment from an otherwise normal human being. We’d get a few laughs like with Romney’s Binders of Women remark and then the next day there’d be a new video on YouTube to talk about.
TV news does not have a lock on the conversation any more.
As far as Dean goes - I liked him before, I’d like him now too, I bet.
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### Author:  [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)
#### Post date: [August 17, 2013, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/12 "2013-08-17T18:52:45Z")
> [@nearwildheaven](#):
>
> That “RRRAAARRGGHHHH!” thing he did in 2004 killed his campaign. :smack:
>
> My dad was a big Dean supporter and would have worked as a staffer had he been the candidate, and also lives in Des Moines and was at that rally, so he knew the back story behind it.
You know, when I finally saw the clip my thought was “What is the big fucking deal?” I had listened to Pundits calling a huge ragetastic breakdown. It wasn’t.
That didn’t kill his campaign, a bunch of fucking lies killed it. Well actually a little critical thinking on the part of the voters would have saved it but that is too much to count on.
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### Author:  [@waterj2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/waterj2)
#### Post date: [August 17, 2013, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/13 "2013-08-17T20:28:41Z")
> [@adaher](#):
>
> Most notably, he’s the absolute perfect guy to implement ACA.
He’s currently working for the lobbying firm of McKenna, Long, and Aldridge, who’s health care and pharmaceutical clients are, [he swears](http://swampland.time.com/2013/07/30/howard-dean-defends-his-work-for-lobbying-firm-after-backlash/), in no way related to his [taking to the WSJ editorial page](http://www.newrepublic.com/article/114072/howard-dean-obamacare-payment-board-and-k-street) to [spread lies about IPAB and rationing](http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-07-30/critics-are-wrong-about-the-medicare-payment-board.html).
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### Author:  [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)
#### Post date: [August 18, 2013, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/14 "2013-08-18T02:49:47Z")
What actually killed his campaign was blowing through all his money early.
Dean also allowed himself to get drawn into a pissing match with Dick Gephardt, the other main Iowa contender, which elevated Kerry and Edwards while sinking both Dean and Gephardt.
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### Author:  [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)
#### Post date: [August 18, 2013, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/15 "2013-08-18T02:51:44Z")
> [@waterj2](#):
>
> He’s currently working for the lobbying firm of McKenna, Long, and Aldridge, who’s health care and pharmaceutical clients are, [he swears](http://swampland.time.com/2013/07/30/howard-dean-defends-his-work-for-lobbying-firm-after-backlash/), in no way related to his [taking to the WSJ editorial page](http://www.newrepublic.com/article/114072/howard-dean-obamacare-payment-board-and-k-street) to [spread lies about IPAB and rationing](http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-07-30/critics-are-wrong-about-the-medicare-payment-board.html).
That’s why I think Dean’s time is now. Criticizing government health care is nothing new for him. One of the negatives about him for Democrats in 2004 that Gephardt and Kerry harped on was his frequent criticisms of Medicare while governor of Vermont.
Dean is a staunch supporter of Medicare and the ACA, but he has specific, and due to his nature, caustic criticisms of specific parts of them.
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### Author:  [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)
#### Post date: [September 20, 2013, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/16 "2013-09-20T02:47:02Z")
> [@Zebra](#):
>
> You know, when I finally saw the clip my thought was “What is the big fucking deal?” I had listened to Pundits calling a huge ragetastic breakdown. It wasn’t.
>
> That didn’t kill his campaign, a bunch of fucking lies killed it. Well actually a little critical thinking on the part of the voters would have saved it but that is too much to count on.
I think it was losing 2 or 3 important primaries in a row, and the last one culminated in the Dean Scream. It wasn’t the Scream that killed him; he was going down for the 3rd time at that point. And, he was drowning because others got the votes.
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### Author:  [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2013, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/17 "2013-09-21T03:57:41Z")
> [@adaher](#):
>
> Of course, he ran a very partisan campaign in 2003/early 2004 . . .
There is no other kind of **primary** campaign, and that’s as far as he got.
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### Author:  [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2013, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/18 "2013-09-21T04:06:30Z")
I don’t think Obama’s 2008 primary campaign was very partisan. He posed primarily as a unifying figure while directing most of his fire at Hillary Clinton.
The other reason I make a distinction about Dean’s campaign is that he was much more moderate as a governor than his campaign portrayed him as. You’d never know he was from the “Democratic wing” of the party based just on how he governed. He was a staunch fiscal conservative in Vermont and was always supported by the NRA. I’m sure he would have highlighted those aspects of his career had he won the nomination, but for the primary he went hard left and I think it was actually the wrong strategy for 2004. Most Democrats just wanted to beat Bush and the primary criticism of Dean was that he was too far left to do it. then the actually more liberal, but less fiery Kerry got the nomination instead.
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### Author:  [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)
#### Post date: [September 21, 2013, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/19 "2013-09-21T18:15:15Z")
The idea that Dean’s “I have a scream” speech killed his campaign is simply crap Dean supporters like to tell themselves similar to the Bush family blaming Perot for GWHB’s defeat.
He went into Iowa with easily the largest war chest of anyone in either party, was in first position made repeated missteps that killed his campaign and made it clear he wasn’t ready for prime time and wound up finishing IIRC 4rth or 5th and was so arrogant he didn’t even have a concession speech.
His campaign was already destroyed when he had his meltdown.
That said, I’ll always remember the look on Tom Harkin’s face while Dean was imploding in front of him. “I endorsed that!?”
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### Author:  [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)
#### Post date: [September 22, 2013, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-dean-for-president/666476/20 "2013-09-22T04:47:36Z")
Can someone post a link to the Dean Scream? I have watched in the past what seems to be the “Dean Scream” and was completely underwhelmed. Maybe I saw the wrong clip. Show the full meltdown torpedo.
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