# Howard Schultz considers run; urged against. **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 27, 2019, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511 "2019-01-27T23:58:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/281 "2019-02-07T20:54:01Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > … I’m curious about all you Republican socialism fighters. What do you think? Do you think the super-rich are taxed too heavily? Too lightly? Or did we somehow get it exactly perfect with the latest tax cuts for the super-rich? Or are the super-rich paying too much, and we need to finally give them the tax relief they deserve? I think our tax rates are still a long ways from the point where I might get heartburn over concern that they’re too low. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/282 "2019-02-07T21:01:03Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > It’s not a question of whether the poverty line should be $10M or $50M. It’s a question of whether Evil Economist is right and Vox is full of shit, or Evil Economist is wrong and Vox is correct. I’m good either way, but I would like to know. Whoops 10 million. Point still stands. Ps do you actually read Vox? That would surprise me. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/283 "2019-02-07T21:03:36Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I think our tax rates are still a long ways from the point where I might get heartburn over concern that they’re too low. If you want your tax rate to go down that missing revenue is going to have to come from somewhere. Which means you are also in favor of higher taxes on the rich. ---
**Author:** ![Airbeck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/airbeck/32/6574_2.png) [@Airbeck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airbeck)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/284 "2019-02-07T21:06:17Z")
Deficits bad Taxes also bad Wall money very good Waiting for consistency seems like folly ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/285 "2019-02-07T21:26:04Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > Whoops 10 million. Point still stands. Thank you for clarifying. > [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > Ps do you actually read Vox? That would surprise me. Yes, occasionally. I’m not eagerly devouring every article the instant it’s published. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/286 "2019-02-07T21:28:00Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > If you want your tax rate to go down that missing revenue is going to have to come from somewhere. Which means you are also in favor of higher taxes on the rich. No, there is another option here that you seem to be missing. Think hard about what it might be. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/287 "2019-02-07T21:32:47Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > No, there is another option here that you seem to be missing. Think hard about what it might be. Is it “cut Medicare”? If so, focus on taxes. ---
**Author:** ![Airbeck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/airbeck/32/6574_2.png) [@Airbeck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airbeck)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/288 "2019-02-07T21:34:06Z")
Cut military spending? No wall money? Disband ICE? Am I close? ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/289 "2019-02-07T21:40:21Z")
> [@Airbeck](#): > > Cut military spending? > No wall money? > Disband ICE? > > Am I close? Fewer FBI investigations. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/290 "2019-02-07T21:41:49Z")
> [@Airbeck](#): > > Please. Persons of means. That is now the preferred nomenclature. I’ll go with “food”. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/291 "2019-02-07T21:42:55Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > Is it “cut Medicare”? If so, focus on taxes. I’ll take the unsolicited advice under advisement. The next time you feel tempted to compose a sentence (fragment) with this format (“Which means you are also in favor of \_\_\_\_\_.”) I’d like to urge you to first consider alternative explanations. The question was asked “What do you think?” not whether it was politically feasible or likely to occur. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/292 "2019-02-07T21:52:23Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I’ll take the unsolicited advice under advisement. The next time you feel tempted to compose a sentence (fragment) with this format (“Which means you are also in favor of \_\_\_\_\_.”) I’d like to urge you to first consider alternative explanations. I will also take the unsolicited advice under advisement. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2019, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/293 "2019-02-07T22:49:26Z")
> [@andros](#): > > Regardless of the bracket, whether it begins at $10m or $50m, it’s still a _marginal_ rate. You got that part, right? > > (Also, “poverty line??”) > . I would support a 70% marginal rate on incomes above $10M. But the case many economists would make against it has nothing to do with how comfortable the person so taxed would be. They would say it removes too much incentive for executives and holders of private equity to create wealth for their companies and therefore also for the people who work there, and those who hold stock in the company, and all the businesses those people patronize, etc. I doubt 70% is high enough to be a major problem in that regard. But it’s approaching that point, I think. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2019, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/294 "2019-02-08T00:54:40Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > I would support a 70% marginal rate on incomes above $10M. But the case many economists would make against it has nothing to do with how comfortable the person so taxed would be. They would say it removes too much incentive for executives and holders of private equity to create wealth for their companies and therefore also for the people who work there, and those who hold stock in the company, and all the businesses those people patronize, etc. > > I doubt 70% is high enough to be a major problem in that regard. But it’s approaching that point, I think. A look at history would be illuminating in this regard. As mentioned earlier in the thread, the USA had a marginal tax rate around 70% on earnings above some large number of millions of dollars, for quite a few years. Did executives quit in any noticeable numbers? Did innovation and entrepreneurial activity slacken during those decades? Did Americans of means just stop what they’d been doing and sit on their hands? Or did the USA have an ever-increasing surge of invention and creativity and growth? …Imma gonna say, the latter. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2019, 7:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/295 "2019-02-08T07:26:55Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > A look at history would be illuminating in this regard. As mentioned earlier in the thread, the USA had a marginal tax rate around 70% on earnings above some large number of millions of dollars, for quite a few years. > > Did executives quit in any noticeable numbers? Did innovation and entrepreneurial activity slacken during those decades? Did Americans of means just stop what they’d been doing and sit on their hands? > > Or did the USA have an ever-increasing surge of invention and creativity and growth? > > …Imma gonna say, the latter. Well, I said I didn’t think 70 percent was too high, but that my sense is that it is approaching the “too high” line (that is, if you value capitalistic growth incentives, which is not necessarily the case for everyone). In any case, hardly anyone was paying that 70 percent. My grandfather was a real estate tycoon who used all kinds of perfectly legal tax shelters. > **[The Rich Never Actually Paid 70 Percent](https://www.aier.org/article/the-rich-never-actually-paid-70-percent/)** > > The historical narrative we've been hearing is both simplistic and wrong. It relies upon a confusion between the statutory tax rate (i.e., the number that’s on the statute books) and the effective tax rate (i.e., the percentage of income that people... ---
**Author:** ![Red\_Wiggler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/red_wiggler/32/13190_2.png) [@Red\_Wiggler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Red_Wiggler)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2019, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/296 "2019-02-08T13:49:02Z")
> [@Airbeck](#): > > Please. Persons of means. That is now the preferred nomenclature. “Wealth enhanced.” ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2019, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/297 "2019-02-08T16:34:58Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I think our tax rates are still a long ways from the point where I might get heartburn over concern that they’re too low. So taxes on the super rich are too high, even after the last round of Republicantax cuts for the rich. But they didn’t go far enough. Good to know. I’m sure the Republicans are going to be campaigning on that issue in 2020, just like they did in 2018. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2019, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/298 "2019-02-08T16:37:24Z")
And obviously the “Third Option” is record breaking budget deficits. We can fund tax cuts for the super rich by borrowing more money from China, I’m sure it will work out great. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2019, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/299 "2019-02-08T16:41:39Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > So taxes on the super rich are too high, even after the last round of Republicantax cuts for the rich. But they didn’t go far enough. Good to know. I’m sure the Republicans are going to be campaigning on that issue in 2020, just like they did in 2018. I have no doubt they’re not going to campaign on this issue in 2020, but that wasn’t the question. Again, I was asked “What do you think?” not “What’s a winning campaign strategy?” > [@Lemur866](#): > > And obviously the “Third Option” is record breaking budget deficits. We can fund tax cuts for the super rich by borrowing more money from China, I’m sure it will work out great. Think harder. ---
**Author:** ![Airbeck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/airbeck/32/6574_2.png) [@Airbeck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airbeck)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2019, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/300 "2019-02-08T17:11:01Z")
Let poor kids and senior citizens die in the street by eliminating or severely cutting social security and medicare and programs like WIC? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511.md?page=16)