# Howard Schultz considers run; urged against. **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 27, 2019, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511 "2019-01-27T23:58:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2019, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/61 "2019-01-28T21:59:38Z")
Former Obama aide Bill Burton wrote an op-ed back in 2016 about how a third party candidate would help to elect Trump as President. > **[Reasons to be wary of the dumpster fire that is Trump’s campaign](https://www.sacbee.com/opinion/california-forum/article94018752.html)** > > When I was about 12, I started a dumpster fire. Me and an equally dumb friend – not to name names but … it was Larry Browning, now a successful attorney in Los Angeles – did it in the parking lot of a CVS in Buffalo. Today it was announced that he has joined the Schultz campaign. > ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2019, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/62 "2019-01-28T22:08:24Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > Former Obama aide Bill Burton wrote an op-ed back in 2016 about how a third party candidate would help to elect Trump as President. > [https://www.sacbee.com/opinion/california-forum/article94018752.html](https://www.sacbee.com/opinion/california-forum/article94018752.html) > > Today it was announced that he has joined the Schultz campaign. > [https://twitter.com/costareports/status/1089996862386515969](https://twitter.com/costareports/status/1089996862386515969) Everyone bows to the almighty dollar. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2019, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/63 "2019-01-28T22:42:43Z")
Speaking as someone who wants the present GOP regime to lose and lose big, I’m more sanguine than some of you about this vanity run. Schultz is playing to the people who want a Ross Perot; those people broke for Trump over Clinton two years ago. I know that Democrats hope that they can peel off all but the most partisan diehards from the Trumpster fire, but they may not, really. An anti-racist, budget-balancing boy billionaire will pull voters from Trump that future nominee Senator Ladypants won’t; and that’s probably helpful in a Sen. Ladypants victory over the GOP. ---
**Author:** ![KidCharlemagne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed8c4c/32.png) [@KidCharlemagne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KidCharlemagne)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2019, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/64 "2019-01-28T22:58:49Z")
I hope all this bad press gives him pause. If not, I hope he’s a decent enough person to bow out when he realizes he can’t win. If he spoils the election he’ll be the most hated man on the planet. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2019, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/65 "2019-01-28T23:02:06Z")
> [@KidCharlemagne](#): > > I hope all this bad press gives him pause. If not, I hope he’s a decent enough person to bow out when he realizes he can’t win. If he spoils the election he’ll be the most hated man on the planet. Hated by everyone? Or just people who are against Trump? ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2019, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/66 "2019-01-28T23:05:22Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > Speaking as someone who wants the present GOP regime to lose and lose big, I’m more sanguine than some of you about this vanity run. Schultz is playing to the people who want a Ross Perot; those people broke for Trump over Clinton two years ago. I know that Democrats hope that they can peel off all but the most partisan diehards from the Trumpster fire, but they may not, really. An anti-racist, budget-balancing boy billionaire will pull voters from Trump that future nominee Senator Ladypants won’t; and that’s probably helpful in a Sen. Ladypants victory over the GOP. I think you’ve probably got the right idea here. We should all cheer Schultz on in his campaign. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2019, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/67 "2019-01-28T23:15:46Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > If he thinks he would make a good president, then the motherfucker should run in either the Democratic or Republican primary. If he won’t do that, he’s helping to reelect Trump. Ask me how I feel about motherfuckers who help Trump. > [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > If he thinks he would make a good President, then he presumably also thinks he would make a good Governor or a good Senator. If he succeeds in those offices, he’ll have gained some experience in politics and we’ll have something to judge him by. And if he fails in those offices, we’re better off for having found that out at a lower level than the Presidency. Yes to both. Trump, by the way, is thrilled at the prospect of Schultz running (as a third-party candidate, of course), and is encouraging him in the most effective way he knows: by taunting him to prove he’s Man Enough to do it: > [@](#): > > “Howard Schultz doesn’t have the ‘guts’ to run for President!” Trump tweeted Monday morning. “Watched him on [60 Minutes] last night and I agree with him that he is not the ‘smartest person.’ Besides, America already has that! …” > **[Trump Is Practically Daring Howard Schultz to Run](https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2019/01/trump-is-practically-daring-howard-schultz-to-run)** > > Democrats are worried Schultz could split centrist votes. Trump, it appears, would love nothing more. Trump double-dog (latte) dares him!!! ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2019, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/68 "2019-01-28T23:42:53Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > Hated by everyone? Or just people who are against Trump? That’s everyone except a constantly-shrinking group of US conservatives, pretty much. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2019, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/69 "2019-01-29T00:00:18Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > That’s everyone except a constantly-shrinking group of US conservatives, pretty much. You might be working from a flawed worldview, or a non-standard definition of “constantly-shrinking” if you believe this. In the 2018 elections, Republican candidates in the House received ~51M votes. That is, I believe, the most they’ve ever received in a mid-term election. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2019, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/70 "2019-01-29T01:20:00Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > You might be working from a flawed worldview, or a non-standard definition of “constantly-shrinking” if you believe this. In the 2018 elections, Republican candidates in the House received ~51M votes. That is, I believe, the most they’ve ever received in a mid-term election. Why are you bringing up how many yards the other team got, when what’s important is how many touchdowns they got? ---
**Author:** ![snoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/43a26b/32.png) [@snoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snoe)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2019, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/71 "2019-01-29T01:24:21Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > You might be working from a flawed worldview, or a non-standard definition of “constantly-shrinking” if you believe this. In the 2018 elections, Republican candidates in the House received ~51M votes. That is, I believe, the most they’ve ever received in a mid-term election. 1. How many of those Republican candidates were conservatives, by your definition? Or by the standard definition? Or by the multitude of non-non-standard definitions that exist? And does voting for a Republican make you a conservative, anyway? 2. We have a growing population of voters. How’s the GOP vote **share** in 2018 compare historically to other midterms? 3. Are votes cast a good way to think about whether the population of “conservatives,” absolute or relative, is growing or shrinking? Why or why not? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2019, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/72 "2019-01-29T01:32:35Z")
> [@](#): > > “Howard Schultz doesn’t have the ‘guts’ to run for President!” Trump tweeted Monday morning. “Watched him on [60 Minutes] last night and I agree with him that he is not the ‘smartest person.’ Besides, America already has that! …” Well, yes, but Cecil isn’t running. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2019, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/73 "2019-01-29T03:43:24Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > Schultz wants to fight the deficit by doing anything (including eliminating entitlements) other than raising taxes on billionaires like him. And this is the “moderate centrist” position. I don’t much care about Schultz, I’ve decided. It seems to me that his actual draw will be “Republicans who are embarrassed to vote for Donald”. I really don’t see what he offers to Democrats except a return to the Clintonian status quo. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2019, 6:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/74 "2019-01-29T06:28:23Z")
> [@KidCharlemagne](#): > > I hope all this bad press gives him pause. If not, I hope he’s a decent enough person to bow out when he realizes he can’t win. If he spoils the election he’ll be the most hated man on the planet. This. I can’t believe he’s even considering it, in this cycle of all moments in history. > [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > You might be working from a flawed worldview, or a non-standard definition of “constantly-shrinking” if you believe this. In the 2018 elections, Republican candidates in the House received ~51M votes. That is, I believe, the most they’ve ever received in a mid-term election. Yeah, this is a point that I think far too many observers have missed. In all the special elections leading up to the main event, it really appeared that Republican voters were discouraged and were turning out anemically, while Democrats were fired up; on top of that, there were signs that some college-educated white suburbanites who had reluctantly voted for Trump had switched over to the Democratic side after seeing what a dumpster fire his presidency actually was. But the raw numbers of Republican votes in November were way different than all those expectations set up. Only an incredibly massive turnout from Democrats saved the day and obscured that troubling surge on the Republican side. To give an example of what I’m talking about, the 2018 Democratic candidate for Ohio governor actually got more votes than John Kasich did in the previous gubernatorial election, which was described as a “landslide” for Kasich. But the 2018 GOP nominee blew both of them out of the water. Maybe we’re heading back toward an era like the late 19th century, which still stands as the period of American history with the highest voter turnout? (With the caveat that this excluded women, African Americans, etc.) ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2019, 8:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/75 "2019-01-29T08:17:40Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > You might be working from a flawed worldview, or a non-standard definition of “constantly-shrinking” if you believe this. In the 2018 elections, Republican candidates in the House received ~51M votes. That is, I believe, the most they’ve ever received in a mid-term election. Here’s your silver medal. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2019, 8:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/76 "2019-01-29T08:34:08Z")
David Frum offers his usual anemic take on this: > **[Howard Schultz May Save the Democratic Party From Itself](https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/01/how-howard-schultz-may-save-democratic-party/581443/)** > > To defeat Trump, Democrats will have to appeal not to his fiercest enemies, but to his softest supporters. > [@](#): > > But if you seriously believe that the Trump presidency presents a unique threat to American democracy, you want the safer choice, not the risky one. You want the candidate with the broadest possible appeal, not the most sectarian. Trump will be beaten not by his fiercest enemies, but by his softest supporters. You want to appeal to them, detach them—not chatter on social media about how you’d like to punch their kids in the face. As examples, he brings up a 70% marginal tax rate, medicare for all, and free college tuition. No polling data is cited here. He claims that people are “nodding along” to Schulz, and that a 70% tax claim is disqualifyingly radical, but there’s absolutely no evidence presented for that - it’s just assumed. In reality, some 3/4ths of Americans think the rich should pay higher taxes. 59% support a 70% marginal tax rate (source: [Poll: Large Majority Backs AOC’s 70% Top Marginal Tax Rate](http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/01/poll-large-majority-backs-aocs-70-top-marginal-tax-rate.html)). Meanwhile, I have yet to see any polling data supporting Schulz’s milquetoast bullshit. This kind of take is honestly just shoddy journalism - taking the word of a rich beltway influencer without any real critical thinking. The more I look at the media, the less impressed I am by how much space it gives this kind of shoddy, bullshit centrism. The Atlantic should damn well know better. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2019, 8:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/77 "2019-01-29T08:43:45Z")
Actually, I take it back, there _is_ polling data on what Schulz wants. And it’s _grossly_ unpopular. > **[Howard Schultz Might Reelect Trump Because He Doesn’t Understand Politics](https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/01/howard-schultz-independent-spoiler-reelect-trump.html)** > > The invincible ignorance of an egomaniacal centrist billionaire. > [@](#): > > The center is not what Schultz thinks it is. “Republicans and Democrats alike — who no longer see themselves as part of the far extreme of the far right and the far left — are looking for a home,” he tells the New York Times. What would this center look like? In Schultz’s mind, it would combine his social liberalism with a desire to cut social insurance programs. “We can get the 4 percent growth,” he said last year, “we can go after entitlements, and we can do the right thing — if we have the right people in place.” > > In reality, there is no constituency for cutting these programs in either party. A 2017 Pew survey found 15 percent of Republicans, and 5 percent of Democrats support cuts to Medicare, while 10 percent of Republicans and 3 percent of Democrats support cuts to Social Security. So Frum is talking directly out of his ass here. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2019, 8:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/78 "2019-01-29T08:47:43Z")
I respect Frum. He’s center-right, so if you’re left of center you aren’t going to dig his exact outlook, but I don’t believe The Atlantic (my favorite magazine) should only be left, all the time. The real issue is that a “safer” alternative to Trump may indeed be the, well, safest bet for Democrats. And that can be litigated in the primary. But that’s where Schultz, a longtime Dem, should be taking this pitch. Not to an independent run where he divides the “eject Trump from office” vote. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2019, 9:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/79 "2019-01-29T09:21:34Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > I respect Frum. He’s center-right, so if you’re left of center you aren’t going to dig his exact outlook, but I don’t believe The Atlantic (my favorite magazine) should only be left, all the time. This isn’t about left/right. It’s about the framing being patently absurd. Frum frames it as though the proposed democratic policies are fundamentally unpopular and unappealing to “the center”, while Schulz’s ideas are somehow a popular compromise position that will drag the dems back to sanity. But that isn’t true. It’s exactly backwards. The polling data shows exactly the opposite. Frum is pulling these ideas directly out of his ass. That’s not opinion. That’s fiction, and should be marked as such. > [@](#): > > The real issue is that a “safer” alternative to Trump may indeed be the, well, safest bet for Democrats. That’s the fantasy Frum is pushing, yes. Firstly, that worked really well in 2016. Secondly, there’s no evidence to support that position and plenty of evidence that it’s just straight up false. Frum cites zero evidence throughout his whole article. It’s shite journalism, opinion piece or not. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2019, 9:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511/80 "2019-01-29T09:28:03Z")
> [@ITR\_champion](#): > > Seems to me that in every Presidential election I can remember, there’s chatter about some zillionaire launching an Independent bid, mobilizing the neglected center, and overturning the two-party system and making the establishment fall flat on its face. But the zillionaire never wins, and other than Ross Perot he never even runs. Don’t forget Herman Cain. He didn’t win the primary but he definitely ran. > [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Yes it is more basic, perhaps we should elevate your understanding of the firm. > > That’s like saying the president is accountable to the electoral college. This is what some would call a pedantic understanding, but not a practical understanding. Does the Electoral College have the power to meet several times a year and fire the President if they don’t like what he’s doing? Because in reality the EC is a one-and-done thing, but shareholders have to be kept happy all the time. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/howard-schultz-considers-run-urged-against/828511.md?page=5)