# How's Al Franken's Senate bid going? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 12, 2008, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239 "2008-02-12T01:57:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Max\_Torque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Max\_Torque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_Torque)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/101 "2008-11-05T17:01:54Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > Yep, there’s something to be said for losing decisivly. At least then the message is loud and clear, this wasn’t your night. Nothing personal, kid. Forget it Jake, it’s Chinatown. > > To lose by a razor-thin margin is something else. Just a liiiiitle bit more effort could have put you over the top. If you hadn’t made that one gaffe that one time. If you’d been a tiny bit more inspiring. Too true. That happened to my father-in-law when he ran for a county judge office two years ago. Three-way primary, he came in third by _thirteen votes_. In the run-off, the second-place winner (the incumbent, whose votes he would almost certainly have gained had he beaten her) apparently won nearly all his votes and won by a huge margin, going on to win the general election unopposed. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/102 "2008-11-05T17:03:33Z")
I am sure there will be a recount ,so they get to suffer a bit longer. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/103 "2008-11-05T17:11:08Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > Yep, there’s something to be said for losing decisivly. At least then the message is loud and clear, this wasn’t your night. Nothing personal, kid. Forget it Jake, it’s Chinatown. > > To lose by a razor-thin margin is something else. Just a liiiiitle bit more effort could have put you over the top. If you hadn’t made that one gaffe that one time. If you’d been a tiny bit more inspiring. As Dick Tuck said after getting crushed by Richard Nixon in California, “The people have spoken, the bastards.” ---
**Author:** ![II\_Gyan\_II](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/bbe5ce/32.png) [@II\_Gyan\_II](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/II_Gyan_II)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/104 "2008-11-05T17:56:14Z")
Is it allowed for a candidate to endorse another in this election? ---
**Author:** ![NurseCarmen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5daacb/32.png) [@NurseCarmen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NurseCarmen)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/105 "2008-11-05T17:57:37Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > I can’t believe it is this close. Who did the independent hurt more? The Star Tribune is reporting that their exit poll says if Barkley wasn’t running, 24% would have voted for Coleman, 30% would have voted Franken. So It would appear that he hurt Franken just enough. ---
**Author:** ![Cyberhwk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7993a0/32.png) [@Cyberhwk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyberhwk)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/106 "2008-11-05T18:29:10Z")
CNN has it: 1,210,942 - Coleman 1,210,371 - Franken :eek: ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/107 "2008-11-05T18:35:03Z")
> [@NurseCarmen](#): > > The Star Tribune is reporting that their exit poll says if Barkley wasn’t running, 24% would have voted for Coleman, 30% would have voted Franken. So It would appear that he hurt Franken just enough. Thank you. > [@II\_Gyan\_II](#): > > Is it allowed for a candidate to endorse another in this election? If you mean can Coleman give his votes to one of the others, than no, that is not how it works. ---
**Author:** ![Hampshire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hampshire/32/4887_2.png) [@Hampshire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hampshire)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/108 "2008-11-05T19:16:52Z")
I think two things hurt Al: 1. Endorsement for Coleman by the Star Tribune. Historically the Pioneer Press (St.Paul) would endorse the Republican candidate while the Star Tribune (Minneapolis) would endorse the Democrat candidate. This year for some reason the Star Tribune decided it was giving it’s endorsement to Coleman. I think that was a big hurt. 2. Al’s campaign never addressed his views or ideas. It seemed to be a never ending smear of Coleman. Instead of “Vote for me because…” it was all “Don’t vote for him because…” His position appeared simply to be a rubber stamp vote in the senate for anything and everything Democrat. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/109 "2008-11-05T19:21:45Z")
> [@](#): > > 1. Al’s campaign never addressed his views or ideas. It seemed to be a never ending smear of Coleman. Yup. Especially contrasted with Coleman’s eschewal of negative ads against Franken from his own campaign. Didn’t stop other groups, but it was a breath of fresh air. Almost didn’t work, though - people always say they don’t like negative ads, but they listen to them. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/110 "2008-11-05T19:28:49Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > I am sure there will be a recount ,so they get to suffer a bit longer. Recount in Minnesota is automatically triggered by law when the margin is less than 0.5%. The current margin is 0.006% so easily kicks in the recount. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/111 "2008-11-05T20:06:13Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > Well me missed out not voting for the 3 in back of him didn’'t we. > > Why do you say things like that? Grasping and hanging on to illogic is not becoming for you. Do you think I make this up? Do you think the anchorman at Annapolis wasn’t personally congratulated by President Bush in the commencement and given a gift, or that his classmates didn’t pass around his hat and each put a five dollar bill into it? I’m not saying any of us should aspire to graduate last in our class, but that doesn’t mean that in the academies (where obedience is measured along with classroom grades) that these people who pile up demerits but don’t get kicked out don’t demonstrate some leadership skills as well. Keeping out of trouble is a valuable skill set, and it comes in mighty handy when people are actually trying to kill you. ---
**Author:** ![tds1273](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/df705f/32.png) [@tds1273](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tds1273)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/112 "2008-11-05T20:12:00Z")
Any chance at all that the recount would yield different results? Are there any provisional ballots that could potentially swing it the other way? What would the loss mean for Franken’s political future? Forked or no? Would he have a shot at a second run? Six years is a long ways a way, perhaps he can unseat Bachmann in two years? ---
**Author:** ![NurseCarmen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5daacb/32.png) [@NurseCarmen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NurseCarmen)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/113 "2008-11-05T22:07:37Z")
Bachmann is a congress critter. Franken doesn’t live in her district. The other Senator from Minnesota is a Dem named Amy Klobuchar. So he won’t run against her. The number has been revised down to below 500. And Norm, showing his self served streak, says Franken should drop out. I think he’s afraid of what the recount may yield. There were a lot of first time voters out there for Obama, and they could be a source of a majority of the spoiled ballot. The recounts are done by hand, and not machine. And since the machines are unable to record intent, ballots with an x in an oval or a circled oval, or ink that isn’t compatible with the optical scan machines will come in to play. This isn’t over by a long shot. ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2008, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/114 "2008-11-06T02:55:33Z")
> [@Norm Coleman](#): > > I recognize that because of my margin of victory, Mr. Franken has the right to pursue an official review of the election results. It is up to him whether such a step is worth the tax dollars it would take to conduct. > > Yesterday, voters spoke. We prevailed. That’s with a lead of less than one thousandth of one percent. If there’s to be a recount, it won’t start until November 19. So we’ll have to wait for results on both this one and the race here in Georgia. (Looks like I’ll get to vote against Saxby Chambliss a second time.) ---
**Author:** ![chorpler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chorpler/32/2888_2.png) [@chorpler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chorpler)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2008, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/115 "2008-11-06T03:22:19Z")
Wait, why is Coleman saying that Franken would have to “pursue an official review” and that it’s up to him? I thought it was mandatory because of the closeness of the election. ---
**Author:** ![jshore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b5e925/32.png) [@jshore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jshore)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2008, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/116 "2008-11-06T03:23:47Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > The current margin is 0.006% so easily kicks in the recount. > [@Baldwin](#): > > That’s with a lead of less than one thousandth of one percent. Quibble: ~500 votes out of ~2.4 million cast gives a margin of ~0.02%. I agree with your basic point though that it is exceedingly close and it is very reasonable for Franken to ask for a recount. ---
**Author:** ![pepperlandgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f17d59/32.png) [@pepperlandgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pepperlandgirl)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2008, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/117 "2008-11-06T03:29:57Z")
> [@chorpler](#): > > Wait, why is Coleman saying that Franken would have to “pursue an official review” and that it’s up to him? I thought it was mandatory because of the closeness of the election. I’m pretty sure the reason the Esteemed Senator from Minnesota said that is because he is lying. It’s not up to Franken, and he knows it. But it’s like in football–if you get the snap off on time, there won’t be a review of the previous play. That’s what he’s hoping for. Unfortunately for him, it won’t work. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2008, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/118 "2008-11-06T03:42:14Z")
> [@pepperlandgirl](#): > > I’m pretty sure the reason the Esteemed Senator from Minnesota said that is because he is lying. It’s not up to Franken, and he knows it. But it’s like in football–if you get the snap off on time, there won’t be a review of the previous play. That’s what he’s hoping for. Unfortunately for him, it won’t work. Particularly since our Secretary of State has already made a point of saying the recount is mandatory, that in Minnesota we look at intent - we just did this for a Supreme Court judge (primary election, small count). The recount may take until mid-December. Franken didn’t have much of a political future going into this as an elected official - worth a shot, but he was never a favorite and rode as far as he got on Obama’s coattails. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2008, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/119 "2008-11-06T04:54:48Z")
> [@jshore](#): > > Quibble: ~500 votes out of ~2.4 million cast gives a margin of ~0.02%. I agree with your basic point though that it is exceedingly close and it is very reasonable for Franken to ask for a recount. Maybe I misunderstand the law but I thought it was the margin of victory between the candidates that mattered. From [here](http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/results/main.results/#S)I got: Coleman: 1,211,644 Franken: 1,211,167 1,211,167/1,211,644 = 0.9996 That is a 0.04% difference. Ok…I somehow screwed up my math :smack: But yeah…still easily in recount territory per state law. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2008, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239/120 "2008-11-06T04:58:10Z")
> [@pepperlandgirl](#): > > I’m pretty sure the reason the Esteemed Senator from Minnesota said that is because he is lying. It’s not up to Franken, and he knows it. But it’s like in football–if you get the snap off on time, there won’t be a review of the previous play. That’s what he’s hoping for. Unfortunately for him, it won’t work. I read somewhere (will look for cite if you want) that the recount is automatic under Minnesota law when it is this close. However, the law also provides that the loser (as it stands) can waive the recount and assent to the vote (so he loses). Coleman has, naturally, asked that Franken just accept things as is. Franken, naturally, is not going to do that. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hows-al-frankens-senate-bid-going/437239.md?page=7)