# Huckabee Pardoned Suspected Seattle Shooter. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 1, 2009, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577 "2009-12-01T12:58:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/21 "2009-12-01T15:20:12Z")
Well, since he was a minor when he committed those crimes, I suppose he _should_ have been released when he was 18. That way he could have had another 10 years of armed robbery, raping children, and murdering people. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/22 "2009-12-01T15:22:08Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > I’m having a hard time figuring out the timeline of all his various crimes, but it appears that part of the harsh sentence was related to his threatening the judge in the case, throwing a lock at a bailiff, trying to grab a bailiff’s gun, and hiding a shiv in his sock. Wikipedia says he was reported to have done those things, but I don’t think he was ever charged relating to them (and even if he was, I still don’t think they’re worth giving him 100 years). Agree it’s pretty hard to figure out what exactly he was accused of doing when though, and what ended up leading to the long sentence. Sort of annoying that the national media can be obsessing over this guy for a week, but no one has bothered to actually do real journalism and go figure out the guys actual criminal history. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/23 "2009-12-01T15:32:04Z")
> [@Munch](#): > > For being in office when Clemmons was apprehended and put in prison for 100 years? Why? For the same reason a dog licks itself. As for Huckabee - no big problem for him. Is Fox news going to bring this up over and over and over again? Not likely. Then who is? Nobody. It will be forgotten in the mists of time. Either that, or Fox will “mistakenly” blame Clinton for commuting the shooters sentence a few times, until 65% of their viewership believe it. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/24 "2009-12-01T15:36:02Z")
> [@stolichnaya](#): > > I suspect (perhaps unfairly) that the folks he pardoned had undergone a conversion to Christianity and that played a role in his decisions. Is there any evidence to suggest this? He made many decisions based on religion, such as refusing to sign a bill comcerning insurance company practices because it contained the phrase, “acts of God”, stating words to the effect that, “God shouldn’t be blamed for bad things.” ---
**Author:** ![joebuck20](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/74df32/32.png) [@joebuck20](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joebuck20)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/25 "2009-12-01T15:36:32Z")
> [@Munch](#): > > For being in office when Clemmons was apprehended and put in prison for 100 years? Why? Yeah, but conservatives can still say that Clinton changed the law to make it easier to commute sentences or that a couple of members of the parole board were his appointees. You vastly underestimate the right wing’s ability to twist these things around to make the Democrats look bad. ---
**Author:** ![CaptMurdock](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/captmurdock/32/11736_2.png) [@CaptMurdock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CaptMurdock)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/26 "2009-12-01T15:37:08Z")
21 years after “Willie Horton”… Sometimes the wheel turns slowly…but it turns. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/27 "2009-12-01T15:53:13Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Either that, or Fox will “mistakenly” blame Clinton for commuting the shooters sentence a few times, until 65% of their viewership believe it. i would bet we see this before the week is out. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/28 "2009-12-01T16:02:17Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Either that, or Fox will “mistakenly” blame Clinton for commuting the shooters sentence a few times, until 65% of their viewership believe it. Actually, it is more likely that the NYT and others will repeat “Huckabee pardoned the shooter” over and over without mentioning that [list=A][li]No, he didn’t, and [\*]the guy wasn’t on the street because Huckabee granted a sixteen-year-old clemency, but because two parole boards thought he could be trusted.[/list][/li][quote=Simplicio] Sort of annoying that the national media can be obsessing over this guy for a week, but no one has bothered to actually do real journalism and go figure out the guys actual criminal history. [/quote] I don’t think they want to know. The impression they want to convey is that Huckabee let this dangerous criminal out, who immediately went on a shooting spree. If they start covering the story the way they would if this guy were on death row, or Huckabee had refused the request for clemency, it would harder for the NYT to use this to beat Huckabee over the head. The NYT has to be careful. If they talk too much about the bad stuff this guy did, but was not charged with or convicted of, they are going to look stupid the next time some minor is sentenced to 100+ years for doing the same kinds of stuff. And the NYT starts wringing its hands over how harsh we are to a poor, misunderstood minor who “has made a few mistakes, true - but isn’t everybody worth a second chance? How hard-hearted and merciless Gov. Republican is to refuse this poor boy a chance to prove himself!” And so on, and so on. And on. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Smashy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/2bfe46/32.png) [@Mr\_Smashy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Smashy)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/29 "2009-12-01T16:03:43Z")
He was tried as an adult. So he was an adult wrt the 100+ yr sentence (I think it was actually something like 117 yrs). BTW the guy committed 5 felonies. no question Huckabee’s done politically. If Huckabee hadn’t done what he did, then 4 cops would be alive today that otherwise arent. I’m guessing that his pastor-values intruded on his decisionmaking. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/30 "2009-12-01T16:07:48Z")
The New York Times is the least of Huckabee’s worries. Don’t think that Palin would hesitate for a moment to stick the knife in Huckabee’s back and give it a good twist. The primary voters that Huckabee needs to reach don’t read the NYT (or much else) anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/31 "2009-12-01T16:11:35Z")
[quote=“Shodan, post:28, topic:519577”] [li]the guy wasn’t on the street because Huckabee granted a sixteen-year-old clemency, but because two parole boards thought he could be trusted.[/li][/QUOTE] If Huckabee hadn’t granted clemency, the parole board wouldn’t have entered the picture. Maybe Huckabee didn’t act single-handedly to release Clemmons, but it’s wrong to put all the responsibility on the parole boards, too. ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/32 "2009-12-01T16:12:46Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > When Clemmons was tried and convicted, Bill Clinton was the governor. You don’t think the Republicans will try to blame him? Well, that does it. Bill Clinton will never be elected President again. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/33 "2009-12-01T16:13:22Z")
It’s the right wing media that’s coming down on Huckabee, not the NYT. I heard a lot of Huckabee bashing on right talk radio yesterday. He was already mistrusted on the right for having some semblance of compassion and a conscience. This tears it completely. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/34 "2009-12-01T16:16:31Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > The NYT has to be careful. If they talk too much about the bad stuff this guy did, but was not charged with or convicted of, they are going to look stupid the next time some minor is sentenced to 100+ years for doing the same kinds of stuff. And the NYT starts wringing its hands over how harsh we are to a poor, misunderstood minor who “has made a few mistakes, true - but isn’t everybody worth a second chance? How hard-hearted and merciless Gov. Republican is to refuse this poor boy a chance to prove himself!” It might be worth your while to wait until the NYT actually does something such as you’re fantasizing. I expect Huckabee to be given as much slack by Democrats as Republicans did for Mike Dukakis. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/35 "2009-12-01T16:18:02Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > The primary voters that Huckabee needs to reach don’t read the NYT (or much else) anyway. Oh, they read all of them. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/36 "2009-12-01T16:32:05Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Just as an academic matter, I am really curious what has become of all the people the Huckabee pardoned. How many have committed other crimes? 90%? 5%? > > And I agree, stick a fork in Huckabee. Something people are overlooking is what this is going to do to legitemate pardons, clemency, and the like. Is the baby going out with the bathwater on this one? Is it going to be another three-strikes type clusterfuck that will lead to an iron-clad “once you’re in, you’re in, period, no questions asked” that will swell our prison populations even more? I mean, if a Governor with a direct line to God can get it wrong we certainly can’t trust any other politicians to get it right! -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/37 "2009-12-01T16:41:48Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > It might be worth your while to wait until the NYT actually does something such as you’re fantasizing. I expect Huckabee to be given as much slack by Democrats as Republicans did for Mike Dukakis. I expect Huckabee to be given as much slack by _Republicans_ as they did for Mike Dukakis. I expect the Democrats to harrumph for a bit and then trip over their own feet. I like Huckabee as a person and find him more articulate and polite in expressing his views than many of his particular ilk, able to transcend mere soundbite mode. The fact that I disagree with most of his political positions means I’d never have voted for him even before this, but he’s a nice guy and probably throws a hell of a church barbecue. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/38 "2009-12-01T16:43:29Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > i would bet we see this before the week is out. Naw. They’re all 100% accuracy and shit now. I think it’s because the rest of the world actually paid attention to their last “mistake”. Now I’m going to “accidentally” click Submit Reply. -J ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/39 "2009-12-01T16:43:41Z")
I agree that Huckabee seems to be a good guy. I respect him a lot for refusing to join in on the Reverend Wright pile on in 2008. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2009, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577/40 "2009-12-01T16:47:30Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > I agree that Huckabee seems to be a good guy. I respect him a lot for refusing to join in on the Reverend Wright pile on in 2008. I bet he does a hell of a Kevin Spacey impression at the yearly Church Talent Show, too. -Joe [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huckabee-pardoned-suspected-seattle-shooter/519577.md?page=3)