# Huge Australian feral cats - legitimate? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 6, 2007, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869 "2007-03-06T22:50:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2007, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869/21 "2007-03-07T21:35:59Z")
[QUOTE=frogger the green] Shaq isn’t the result of a band of feral black men living in the hills of LA feeding on visiting tourists, nor is he a human-bigfoot hybrid. [/QUOTE] Ah, but if he _was_, you’d have to admit it’d make basketball a whoooollllleeee lot more interesting! ::Wanders off imaging Shaq biting off the heads of members of the opposing team and feasting on them while he dribbles the ball. :: ---
**Author:** ![Alan\_Smithee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/2acd7d/32.png) [@Alan\_Smithee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alan_Smithee)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2007, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869/22 "2007-03-07T21:45:30Z")
Well, _I’ve_ never seen one get married. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2007, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869/23 "2007-03-07T22:43:46Z")
[QUOTE=Lemur866] But all those photos of dead cats hung up ARE done to deliberately create a false impression. Notice how the supposed giant cat never touches any background object, notice how the place where the ropes attach isn’t included in the photo. There is absolutely no way to tell from the photo how close or how far the dead cat is from the camera. And the reason for that is obvious. Lie the dead cat on a kitchen table next to objects that reveal the scale and it’s easy to tell how big the cat is. Hang the cat in the air, don’t show where the hanging ropes attach, and it’s impossible. The other photos at [http://scienceblogs.com/tetrapodzoology/2007/03/australias\_new\_feral\_mega\_cats.php#more](http://scienceblogs.com/tetrapodzoology/2007/03/australias_new_feral_mega_cats.php#more) don’t seem to show giant cats, but rather regular black cats. There’s nothing I can see in those photos that gives any sense of scale, just cats next to plants. Since you can’t tell how tall the plants are, you can’t tell how big the cats are. And the one where you think you can is a trick. It seems the cat must be gigantic because it’s standing next to a road, photo number 2. But that’s not a road, it’s a path. Look at the scale of the sign. I suppose it could be a giant sign, but the point is that there are no reliable objects near the cat that can give the scale of the cat. [/QUOTE] Besides these excellent points, the animals in these pictures simply don’t seem to be heavily built enough to be leopard size. Because of allometric growth, a feral cat that was the size of a leopard should also be built similarly to a leopard, and these don’t look much different from house cats to me. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2007, 6:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869/24 "2007-03-09T06:50:43Z")
[Here’s a Snopes piece](http://www.snopes.com/photos/animals/bigcat2.asp) on a ginormous domestic kitty that is mindboggingly big, with no feral explaination needed. ---
**Author:** ![Ice\_Wolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/dfb087/32.png) [@Ice\_Wolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ice_Wolf)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2007, 7:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869/25 "2007-03-09T07:05:50Z")
I was starting to think, looking at the photos in the OP link, that all these big feral cats are just in basic black. [We seem to have them in ginger as well.](http://www.stuff.co.nz/northland/3922865a11.html) > [@](#): > > Folklore suggests that a large, black, panther-type animal is roaming Mid- Canterbury. > > Now, a huge ginger feline has been claimed to be in hill country further north, in the Waimakariri Gorge. > > Four hunters said they saw the cat gracefully padding along the hills above the gorge as they jet-boated upriver during the Christmas- New Year break. They could not believe their eyes, so they used the telescopic sights on their rifles to get a better view. > > They described it as a huge ginger cat slipping easily among the rocks and tussock. “It was its tail and the way it moved that gave it away,” one of the hunters said. > > They said the cat was about a metre long and above knee-high to a man. Its tail was about 8cm in diameter and long. They were stunned at its size. > > One man said the sighting was a “once-in-a- lifetime” thing. ---
**Author:** ![mamboman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecb155/32.png) [@mamboman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mamboman)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2007, 7:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869/26 "2007-03-09T07:40:32Z")
[QUOTE=Bosda Di’Chi of Tricor] Hmmm…this post either proves the existence of giant cats in Australia, \*\*or \*\* it supports the Aussies’ legendary love of Fosters. :dubious: 😉😃😛 [/QUOTE] Australians as a general rule, don’t drink Fosters - especially in Lithgow. Legendary love of Tooheys, perhaps. But Fosters is not a common or especially beloved beer here. And I have to say I have seen some enormous feral cats living around Ipswich in Queensland - huge brutes - not leopard size but much much bigger than any housecat I have ever seen. mm ---
**Author:** ![bluezooky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e8c25b/32.png) [@bluezooky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bluezooky)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2007, 7:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869/27 "2007-03-09T07:44:09Z")
“DNA evidence? According to the linked article, [http://abc.net.au/news/australia/vi...10/s1478556.htm](http://abc.net.au/news/australia/vi...10/s1478556.htm), a guy from the “Centre for Fortean Zoology” [alarms should go off] he handled the “tail” and it was 26 inches long. But the news article doesn’t say what the DNA results were, it only includes a claim that hair samples were sent out for DNA testing.” The original claim was this actually being a leopard and not a cat, if there were any DNA results they failed to make the media ---
**Author:** ![Harmonious\_Discord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/74df32/32.png) [@Harmonious\_Discord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harmonious_Discord)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2007, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869/28 "2007-03-09T13:28:42Z")
There are huge cats in the USA also. I saw a couple on farms over the years. One was at the farm of the second wife of my grandpa. Head to butt it was 2.5 feet long, and would attack if you stood between where it was and wanted to be. It was the size of lynx I see in the rehab cages the DNR have. They farms across this country had cats, that big, and they were mostly barn feral cats. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2007, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869/29 "2007-03-09T17:11:57Z")
There’s a couple of issues that aren’t being separated here. Are there instances of exotic big cats that escape from captivity? Yes. Is this common? No. Do escaped exotic big cats form breeding populations? Almost certainly not, because big cat escapes are pretty rare. And in many places we already have native species of big cats. North America has lynx, bobcat, cougar, and (extreeeeeemly rarely north of the Rio Grande) jaguars. In North America if the area would support a breeding population of escaped exotic cats it probably already has a breeding population of native cats. Obviously, this isn’t the case in the UK or Australia, but the UK doesn’t exactly have a lot of wild area, and how many exotic big cats go missing in Australia? Do those exotic big cats interbreed with feral domestic cats? Almost certainly not. This isn’t a case of wolves interbreeding with dogs. The european/african wildcat is the wild ancestor of domestic cats. Wildcats do interbreed with domestic cats because they’re the same species. But wildcats are about the same size as domestic cats. A european wildcat looks like an extra-tough extra-mean tabby. [File:Wildkatze 002.jpg - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Wildkatze_002.jpg). Note that that image shows two cats, you just can’t see the head of one. Or this image: [http://www.fow.org.uk/WP\_Wildcat.htm](http://www.fow.org.uk/WP_Wildcat.htm). This is the kind of cat feral domestic cats would be interbreeding with, and wildcats are about 3 to 6 kg, the same size range as domestic cats, not bigger. Yes, domestic cats will hybridize with exotic species, but this happens only in captivity. And domestic cats won’t hybridize with species that are much larger than domestic cats. Are domestic cats sometimes really large? Sure, for varying definitions of “large”. Some domestic cats like Maine Coon Cats are startlingly large, although long fur can make a cat appear larger than it really is. And cats can be both larger and smaller than people expect…a cat can squeeze themselves into a tiny ball or through a tiny opening, yet stretch out amazingly long. Are eyewitness reports of really large domestic cats generally accurate? No! How do the eyewitnesses get a sense of the scale of the animal? To give a silly example, my home office window looks out at some forestland. The other day someone was walking past my window through the trees and they looked tiny…until I realized that my day to day perception of how far away the trees were and how large the trees were was inaccurate. The trees were larger and farther away than I thought, so when a person walked by them I percieved the person to be smaller than they really were…for a second or two, then my brain readjusted and the trees got bigger. Anyway, the point is that simply seeing an animal far away…especially if you’re looking at them through a scope or binoculars…is bound to give you an inaccurate estimate of the size of the animal. And do people deliberately fake photos of cats to make them appear larger and smaller than they really are? Of course. Every single one of the dead cat photos I’ve seen was arranged in such a way as to deliberately give a false impression of how big the cat was, when it would be easy to take a photo in such a way as to give a reliable sense of scale. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2007, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869/30 "2007-03-09T22:07:18Z")
[QUOTE=Tamerlane] The only possible thing I can think of which would make any logical sense at all, is if local ferals were breeding with larger “wild” felids. Say escaped exotic pets - there has been at least one cross with a caracal and “Savanah Cats” are a similar, deliberate hybrid. [/QUOTE] There are no wild felids in Australia. I don’t know if Aus would let a Savanah cat in? And they are so damn expensive, I doubt if there are many roaming the wild. What also set off my Skeptics alarm is that all the cats are black. :dubious: I have a Maine Coon. He weighs 20#, but looks larger because of the fur. Pretty much they are the largest breed (Savanah cats are taller, longer), and they look nothing at all like the pictured cats.\* Very\* furry. ---
**Author:** ![fiddlesticks](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddlesticks/32/18129_2.png) [@fiddlesticks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fiddlesticks)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2007, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869/31 "2007-03-10T00:10:06Z")
[QUOTE=Harmonious Discord] There are huge cats in the USA also. I saw a couple on farms over the years. One was at the farm of the second wife of my grandpa. Head to butt it was 2.5 feet long, and would attack if you stood between where it was and wanted to be. It was the size of lynx I see in the rehab cages the DNR have. They farms across this country had cats, that big, and they were mostly barn feral cats. [/QUOTE] Back in the 80’s Wisconsin had a rash of “giant black panther” sightings. No one ever snapped a definitive picture of one and I’m sure those sightings were simply “big barn cats” like you say. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2007, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869/32 "2007-03-10T00:31:10Z")
But in Wisconsin some of those sitings could have been cougars. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2007, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869/33 "2007-03-10T13:04:16Z")
_Australian Shooter_ has run articles in the past (2005, IIRC) regarding Big Cats in the bush here. I haven’t personally seen a Big Cat out in the bush, but it wouldn’t surprise me at all if there were some running around out there. ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2007, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869/34 "2007-03-10T13:18:20Z")
> [@](#): > > Huge Australian feral cats - legitimate? Most huge Australian Cats are born out of wedlock. Is that helpful? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Ice\_Wolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/dfb087/32.png) [@Ice\_Wolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ice_Wolf)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2007, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869/35 "2007-03-10T18:24:17Z")
[QUOTE=Bosda Di’Chi of Tricor] Most huge Australian Cats are born out of wedlock. Is that helpful? 🙂 [/QUOTE] 😃 ---
**Author:** ![TheLoadedDog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/35a633/32.png) [@TheLoadedDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheLoadedDog)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2007, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869/36 "2007-03-11T00:08:08Z")
[QUOTE=DrDeth] What also set off my Skeptics alarm is that all the cats are black. :dubious: [/QUOTE] The unfortunate truth here is that I saw a black one. As a Doper, I think I’m clued up enough to change the colour to a tabby cat or something if I wanted to bullshit. More believable. I’ve seen dozens of feral cats (normal size) out in the bush, and there seems to be an over-representation of black ones and ginger ones, with a few tabbies of indeterminate colouring. I don’t recall ever having seen a black and white cat (there’s a name for those, but I forget it), for instance. Never seen a white one either. Or a Siamese. And they are all short-haired cats. ---
**Author:** ![Sigene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df788c/32.png) [@Sigene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sigene)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2007, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869/37 "2007-03-11T00:37:50Z")
While I can’t make a claim as to if the huge cats are real or not; the first picture is a little misleading. If you think that is a road; then it is a huge cat; but once you realize it is a paved foot path the cat shrinks in size tremendously. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/huge-australian-feral-cats-legitimate/394869.md?page=1)