# Hugely Successful TV Shows that had terrible ratings at first; Hit shows that were cancelled **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 7, 2009, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688 "2009-08-07T20:47:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Doug\_Bowe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/df788c/32.png) [@Doug\_Bowe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doug_Bowe)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2009, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/41 "2009-08-08T20:52:01Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > **The Dick Van Dyck Show** was actually canceled due to low ratings after the first season. But it did very well in reruns, so CBS changed its mind and renewed… It didn’t hurt to reschedule Dick Van Dyck right after the Beverly Hillbillies. ---
**Author:** ![Don\_Draper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b2d939/32.png) [@Don\_Draper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_Draper)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2009, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/42 "2009-08-08T21:48:45Z")
> [@Sampiro](#): > > On the flip side, there were also several shows that were cancelled even though they were ratings hits, something that would likely never happen today. The ones that come to mind immediately are _Gilligan’s Island_ (always in the top 20, often in the top 10, but hated by the network brass) and _Beverly Hillbillies_ (which was still going strong in its final season when, to borrow the words of one cast member, “the network cancelled every show that had a tree” and replaced them with detective shows and workplace sitcoms. > Any others that were canceled while popular? If “Cheers” is the de facto example of the first kind of show, then certainly “Twin Peaks” is the archetype for the second. TP debuted amidst a huge of hype, with glowing reviews from pretty much every major critic, a massive devoted cult audience, and fantastic ratings. Then came a huge backlash when it became apparent that there was no grand meaning behind all the weirdness. The series didn’t even last two full years. When it got canned at the end of the second season, the most common reaction was…“Twin Peaks is still on the air?” ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2009, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/43 "2009-08-09T01:21:00Z")
Love on a Rooftop My World and Welcome to It. They were a step over most programs but went after one season. ---
**Author:** ![Markxxx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5daacb/32.png) [@Markxxx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Markxxx)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2009, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/44 "2009-08-09T01:39:36Z")
A lot of “Time slot” hits did quite well in the ratings and were cancelled anyway. That is shows that come after really popular ones but don’t keep enough of the audience. One of the biggest “time slot” hits ever was “A Different World.” This show did quite nicely following _Cobsy_ but tanked once _Cosby_ was off the air _Chicken Soup_ with Jackie Mason and Lynne Redgrave was the highest rated new show but despite a decent audience it lost 35% of the viewers from _Roseanne_, so it got axed. (There were some other issues admittedly like Mason’s big mouth, but had it not lost 1/3 of it’s viewers, it would’ve stayed on the air." NBC produced a number of “time slot” hits at 8:30pm/7:30pm on Thursdays. CBS had them at 8:30pm/7:30pm on Mondays and ABC had a similar situation at 9:30pm/8:30pm on Tuesdays. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2009, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/45 "2009-08-09T03:26:10Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > Sci-fi is not trademarkable. Sy-fy is. And will be as a channel all over the world. That doesn’t even make sense… they trademarked “Oxygen”, for God’s sake. They could have trademarked “Sci-Fi”, and probably did. What this was is the worst sort of corporate suit with a MBA idea. They take something that works, decide that they need to “distinguish the brand”, and name it something that’s widely considered stupid by the majority of their serious watchers… for what? The only thing I can think of, is that by naming it “Sy-Fy”, it divorces it from “Sci-Fi” as an abbreviation for “Science-Fiction”, and rebrands it as something nonsensical, so they can show more pro wrestling or other stupid shows that have fuck-all to do with science fiction. (yes, I have an MBA, and no, I don’t have much respect for the vast majority of my MBA colleagues) ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2009, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/46 "2009-08-09T05:05:38Z")
> [@bump](#): > > That doesn’t even make sense… they trademarked “Oxygen”, for God’s sake. They could have trademarked “Sci-Fi”, and probably did. According to a search of the US Patent and Trademark Office, they did hold a trademark on the Sci-Fi Channel and the logo, but let it lapse. ---
**Author:** ![Rainbowthief](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/4bbf92/32.png) [@Rainbowthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rainbowthief)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2009, 6:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/47 "2009-08-09T06:28:22Z")
> [@Markxxx](#): > > _Chicken Soup_ with Jackie Mason and Lynne Redgrave was the highest rated new show but despite a decent audience it lost 35% of the viewers from _Roseanne_, so it got axed. (There were some other issues admittedly like Mason’s big mouth, but had it not lost 1/3 of it’s viewers, it would’ve stayed on the air." That was the first show that I thought of. Mason made some comments (can’t remember what as it’s been twenty years) that were considered racist by some and ABC suddenly declared its ratings weren’t good enough even though it was a top ten show and a big success with critics. Had they weathered the storm everything would’ve been okay. I went to a predominantly black high school and we talked about the incident in English class. Not one of the thirty or so black students in the class thought Mason said anything racist or offensive and they felt that the press had overblown the incident just to have something to write about. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2009, 7:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/48 "2009-08-09T07:20:47Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > …seriously. I have been waiting for the Sci Fi channel to come to New Zealand for years. . Why? Big fan of crappy “semi-reality shows” and Grade B horror flicks? They rarely show Science Fiction, you know. ---
**Author:** ![gytalf2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ac91a4/32.png) [@gytalf2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gytalf2000)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2009, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/49 "2009-08-10T18:36:43Z")
I may be wrong about this, but I think that I remember reading that “Wonder Woman” was actually pulling in respectable ratings for CBS when it was cancelled in 1979. ABC had aired the pilot in 1975, two episodes in April 1976, and then eleven episodes (all set during World War II) in the 1976-1977 season. ABC decided not to renew the show. CBS picked it up and set it in modern times so that she wouldn’t just be fighting Nazis every week. The theme was “Diana Prince, IADC Agent” (IADC was a government agency like the FBI), and that continued from 1977 to 1979. I don’t think the ratings were spectacular, but they were fairly decent. (Somebody please correct me if I am wrong about this.) ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2009, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/50 "2009-08-10T18:57:01Z")
I read that _St. Elsewhere_ rarely had great ratings and in fact many shows with higher ratings were cancelled. However it was a top show with a certain demographic (college educated professionals over 25 or something like) that many advertisers specifically wanted to reach, thus even though it wasn’t a ratings bonanza it was perfect for ad revenue. ---
**Author:** ![phreesh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9fc29f/32.png) [@phreesh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/phreesh)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2009, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/51 "2009-08-10T18:57:04Z")
I’m surprised nobody has mentioned 'What About Raymond?". Although, it wasn’t cancelled, Ray Romano had just decided he had enough money. Actually, I think Seinfeld might have been number one when it went off the air, as well. Hmmm, maybe this is more common than I think. Was Cheers still pulling in good numbers at the end? The Mary Tyler Moore Show? Newhart? Cosby Show? ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2009, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/52 "2009-08-10T19:07:07Z")
> [@phreesh](#): > > I’m surprised nobody has mentioned 'What About Raymond?". Although, it wasn’t cancelled, Ray Romano had just decided he had enough money. Actually, I think Seinfeld might have been number one when it went off the air, as well. Well those shows weren’t exactly cancelled. They stopped production because the stars/producers were done and no TV channel would be stupid enough to continue Seinfeld without any of the four main characters. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2009, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/53 "2009-08-10T19:23:10Z")
> [@phreesh](#): > > I’m surprised nobody has mentioned 'What About Raymond?". Although, it wasn’t cancelled, Ray Romano had just decided he had enough money. Actually, I think Seinfeld might have been number one when it went off the air, as well. > > Hmmm, maybe this is more common than I think. Was Cheers still pulling in good numbers at the end? The Mary Tyler Moore Show? Newhart? Cosby Show? Idon’t know about MTM, but the others you mention all left when the leads wanted to leave. ---
**Author:** ![TNWPsycho](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/47e85d/32.png) [@TNWPsycho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TNWPsycho)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2009, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/54 "2009-08-10T19:25:22Z")
_Family Guy_ has been cancelled several times only to return stronger than ever. ---
**Author:** ![NDP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ndp/32/55_2.png) [@NDP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NDP)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2009, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/55 "2009-08-10T22:38:45Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Idon’t know about MTM, but the others you mention all left when the leads wanted to leave. “The Mary Tyler Moore Show” left the air voluntarily. It was still getting good ratings and Emmy nods but they felt that after seven years, they had done all they wanted to do and decided to go out on top. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2009, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/56 "2009-08-10T22:52:30Z")
_Sanford & Son_ was also huge when it was cancelled- in the Top 5 IIRC- but Redd Foxx either wanted out of the show altogether or else demanded a contract the network wouldn’t meet. (There was famously no love connection twixt Foxx and NBC.) Demond Wilson apparently wanted out as well since they tried to bring back the show as _Sanford Arms_ but he didn’t participate (the show sank immediately- I think 4 eps were filmed). Foxx (without Wilson) returned a few years later for [Sanford](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0080269/) which lasted one season; it had some moments but in general was nowhere near as good as and never garnered a fraction of the ratings of _Sanford & Son_. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2009, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/57 "2009-08-10T23:00:48Z")
Correction/clarification to above: _Sanford & Son_ did slip in the ratings during its final season, but only _after_ decision was made to cancel it. The ratings slips were due to pre-emptings, changing its timeslot, and occasional hiatus. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2009, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/58 "2009-08-10T23:14:27Z")
Speaking of _Sanford & Son_, the death of Freddie Prinze the same year it was cancelled probably didn’t help. _Chico and the Man_ was a hit show (though it was 20 years after _I Love Lucy_ it was still among the first ever to feature a Spanish speaking main character) and followed _Sanford & Son_ on Friday nights. When Freddie Prinze killed himself the producers of _Chico & the Man_ decided to carry on without him by replacing him with a kid (whose character was named Raul but nicknamed Chico by ‘the Man’ in a really bizarre decision) and never explaining what had happened to Freddie Prinze’s Chico (except kinda sorta in a “special episode” filmed largely in Mexico where it was mentioned he died, but not how). The show gave up the ghost in the next season. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 11:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/59 "2009-08-11T11:07:59Z")
> [@phreesh](#): > > 'What About Raymond?" Everybody loves him. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![jackdavinci](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackdavinci/32/3259_2.png) [@jackdavinci](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jackdavinci)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2009, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688/60 "2009-08-11T13:46:34Z")
> [@ekwynn](#): > > Sampiro, you’re so _right_. What a suckular way to spell Sci-Fi. It does look like Siffy I like to think of it as the syphilis channel 😃 It does seem really lame but I’ve gotten over my outrage fairly quickly. They had several reasons - 1) It’s trademarkable unlike the generic ‘science fiction’ which has various financial benefits - this part makes sense 2) it’s much more specific and easier to find on search engines - this also makes some sense 3) people who might like some of their other content like fantasy, horror, or pseudoscience stuff could theoretically be not checking it out because they assume it’s all space battles - this is kind of silly to me but presumably they have marketing research people that have discovered this The particular choice of “Syfy” feels a little insulting and scary to fans of sci-fi who worry that it will be symbolic of a watering down of both sci-fi content and quality. But I haven’t noticed a major reduction in either or even much of a change at all since the renaming. And I haven’t been able to think of something that’s unique, trademarkable and easily identifiable but better than 'Syfy" so I’ve moved on from my outrage. > [@astorian](#): > > A show can be a huge “hit” and still not make a lot of money for the network. That’s especially true if the viewing demographics don’t suit the advertisers. There’s a lot of things that can be a factor. Demographics is a big one - the right demographics have saved a lot of shows that were poor in overall ratings. As shows get older they get more expensive with cast raises. Sometimes particular shows are just disliked by upper management and so are mistreated, sent to the Friday deathslot or preempted or moved around a lot or just not advertised. Sometimes they are a fine show by themselves but don’t fit well with other shows in the schedule. Also, a lot of times the shows are produced by a company other than the network itself so it doesn’t have as much as a financial incentive to keep it around since they won’t be getting all those DVD and syndication profits. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugely-successful-tv-shows-that-had-terrible-ratings-at-first-hit-shows-that-were-cancelled/505688.md?page=4)