# Hugo Chavez shutting down Radio Caracas Television **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 16, 2007, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263 "2007-05-16T01:03:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/1 "2007-05-16T01:03:40Z")
Story [here.](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/05/13/AR2007051301124.html) Maybe Hugo **is** Castro Lite after all. I didn’t mind when he got Congress to vote him decree powers – that **is** constitutional and precedented in Venezuela, after all, though the wisdom of the clause is debatable. I didn’t mind when he nationalized the oilfields – that’s arguably something the people elected him to do. But as a former journalist I say silencing opposition media is beyond the pale, even for a president who has been visibly embattled by a sometimes criminal opposition. Can anybody offer a defense of this decision? Why did he do it? How will the Venezuelan people feel about it? Will it come back to bite him? How will this affect Venezuela’s relations with other Latin American countries (many of them with left-wing governments of their own)? With non-Latin American countries? (Relations with the U.S. couldn’t get any worse, of course, short of war.) ---
**Author:** ![Sapo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ec9cab/32.png) [@Sapo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sapo)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/2 "2007-05-16T02:09:42Z")
RCTV is just a first step. As the other stations start reaching the end of their licenses and having to renew, there will be a lot of other stations “changing hands”. I am surprised at this. I thought there were others higher in the list. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/3 "2007-05-16T02:32:08Z")
[I told](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=6667498&postcount=12) [you](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7755066&postcount=2) [so:](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=8024399&postcount=6) > [@Kimstu on 12-04-2006](#): > > As I’ve said before, I see Chavez as a potential “Castro Lite”: genuine ambition for increasing social democracy and egalitarian prosperity, combined with vast personal egotism, self-indulgent autocracy, and indifference to the rights of those who oppose him. Chavez is not in the Castro class at present, but IMHO you don’t have to be a neocon or a Bush supporter to have some serious doubts about him. That was mean, though, sorry. I too regret that Chavez is not using his opportunities as a popular leader with ample national resources to develop genuinely liberal social democracy in Venezuela. I never had very high hopes of him, but I would have liked to be proven wrong. ---
**Author:** ![lalenin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/3da27b/32.png) [@lalenin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lalenin)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/4 "2007-05-16T13:34:28Z")
[QUOTE=Kimstu] [I told](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=6667498&postcount=12) [you](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7755066&postcount=2) [so:](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=8024399&postcount=6) That was mean, though, sorry. I too regret that Chavez is not using his opportunities as a popular leader with ample national resources to develop genuinely liberal social democracy in Venezuela. I never had very high hopes of him, but I would have liked to be proven wrong. [/QUOTE] I too never had high hopes for Chavez, and since I am very familiar with the Castro model this move does not surprise me. He’s following the Castro model more or less to the letter but much slower, Chavez has been in power since 1998, so roughly 9 years to start shutting down the opposition media, and he is also talking about shutting down opposition political parties, Castro had done both those things by 1962, 3 years after taking power. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/5 "2007-05-16T14:10:51Z")
[QUOTE=lalenin] . . . and he is also talking about shutting down opposition political parties . . . [/QUOTE] News to me. Cite? ---
**Author:** ![lalenin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/3da27b/32.png) [@lalenin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lalenin)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/6 "2007-05-16T14:32:43Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] News to me. Cite? [/QUOTE] When Chavez won the last election he announced the formation of the Partido Socialista Unido de Venezuela (PSUV), which he says will be an umbrella party for all political parties. He says this is needed to eliminate dissent in his government and to have a common platform in the government. So far this is only a proposal, and he is claiming that membership in the party is not compulsory, but it’s obvious that is where it is headed. Here’s an [article](http://www.venezuelanalysis.com/news.php?newsno=2276) with some quotes that make clear what I’m trying to say: > [@](#): > > "In that light, Chávez criticized the position of certain party leaders who have rejected the idea of a unified party. Chávez said that he did not need the support of the governor of Sucre, Ramón Martínez, calling him “counterrevolutionary” and a “coward,” and told him to join the ranks of the opposition. > > “I don’t accept cowardliness or deceit, Governor. Go to the opposition! I don’t want you here with us. I don’t accept your support. It is you that is a farce, a counterrevolutionary,” he said to the Sucre governor. “Find your place, I don’t consider you with us, I consider you against us!” > > The President also warned the governor of Aragua, Didalco Bolívar, telling him that if he wants to take the same position as Martínez that he can go too. > > “We don’t need him here either,” said Chávez, who then called on the people of those states to convene recall referendums to revoke their mandates, a right afforded to Venezuelans under the 1999 Constitution." ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/7 "2007-05-16T14:35:46Z")
Well maybe the channel should not be supporting coup attempts. If CNN or Fox or in the UK, ITV supported a coup against the democratically elected govt they too would find a less than warm regulatory front moving in their direction. No country on earth would allow a media outlet to incite violence and support coups. RCTV has been an active participant in anti-govt activities. You play with fire and you are going to get burned. [The Revolution will not be televised](http://www.zimmirror.co.zw/sundaymirror/view_news.cfm?storyid=20285&categoryid=7&issueid=682&issuedate=2007-03-04%2012:15:00.0&issue_type=current) > [@](#): > > The documentary outlined the role of a number of privately-owned media houses in trying to whip up anti-Chavez hysteria and support for the military renegades who briefly forced the President out. > One broadcaster in particular, RCTV, played as a pivotal role in the attempted coup as the actions of the few soldiers who spearheaded the action. > Vice Admiral Victor Ramirez Perez, one of the coup leaders, declared on Venevision – one of the anti-Chavez broadcasters – soon after the coup: “We had a deadly weapon – the media.” > In ‘The revolution will not be televised’, shown on the morning after the coup, journalists and military conspirators openly boasted about how they had schemed to get some people onto the streets and court the support of ordinary soldiers. > One of the conspirators is heard saying: “I must thank Venevision and RCTV." > RCTV’s then news director Andres Izarra later admitted they had been ordered to support the coup. > In his own words, the instruction was: “No information on Chavez, his followers, his ministers and all others…” > [@](#): > > At present, Chavez’ administration has declared that the government will not be renewing RCTV’s broadcasting licence though it may continue to be beamed by satellite or by cable. > Other private stations, like Venevision, Globavision and Televen – all fiercely anti-Chavez – will continue to broadcast. [Reporters Without Borders](http://www.rsf.org/article.php3?id_article=20218), which has condemned the move concedes that: > [@](#): > > Along with other news media, it supported the April 2002 coup attempt against President Chávez. [Wiki](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RCTV) > [@](#): > > RCTV has been criticized by Hugo Chávez’s government and supporters for its role in the April 11 Venezuelan coup attempt of 2002 and the December 2, 2002 to February 4, 2003 Venezuelan general strike (during which free advertisements for the opposition were broadcast by privately owned TV stations including RCTV). On the afternoon of April 11, RCTV interrupted a speech made by Chavez to broadcast a shooting that was taking place at an opposition march. Over the next couple of days, the private networks would support Pedro Carmona’s interim government, which dissolved the National Assembly and rewrote the constitution. As the coup began to collapse due to popular pressure to restore the democratically elected president to power, RCTV conducted a news blackout. [Le Monde](http://mondediplo.com/2002/08/10venezuela) > [@](#): > > Venezuela’s press power > > Never even in Latin American history has the media been so directly involved in a political coup. Venezuela’s ’hate media’ controls 95% of the airwaves and has a near-monopoly over newsprint, and it played a major part in the failed attempt to overthrow the president, Hugo Chávez, in April. Although tensions in the country could easily spill into civil war, the media is still directly encouraging dissident elements to overthrow the democratically elected president - if necessary by force. > [@](#): > > On 11 April military and civilian press conferences calling for the president’s resignation marked the next phase. On RCTV, Ortega called on the opposition to march on Miraflores (the presidential palace). At about 4pm, when the scale of the conspiracy was apparent, the authorities gave the order to block the frequencies used by the private channels. Globovisión, CMT and Televen went off air for a few moments before resuming their broadcasts using satellite or cable. All screens broadcast an image that had been edited to show armed counter-demonstrators firing on “the crowd of peaceful demonstrators”. As a result the Bolivarian Circles, the social organisation of Chávez supporters, were blamed for deaths and injuries (8). > > The conspirators, including Carmona, met at the offices of Venevisión. They stayed until 2am to prepare “the next stage”, along with Rafael Poleo (owner of El Nuevo Pais) and Gustavo Cisneros, a key figure in the coup. Cisneros, a multimillionaire of Cuban origin and the owner of Venevisión, runs a media empire - Organización Diego Cisneros. It has 70 outlets in 39 countries (9). Cisneros is a friend of George Bush senior: they play golf together and in 2001 the former US president holidayed in Cisneros’s Venezuelan property. Both are keen on the privatisation of the PDVSA (10). Otto Reich, US assistant secretary of state for Interamerican affairs, admits to having spoken with Cisneros that night (11). Venevision remains in operation. So - in summary - cry me a bleedin’ river. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/8 "2007-05-16T14:40:57Z")
[QUOTE=lalenin] When Chavez won the last election he announced the formation of the Partido Socialista Unido de Venezuela (PSUV), which he says will be an umbrella party for all political parties. He says this is needed to eliminate dissent in his government and to have a common platform in the government. So far this is only a proposal, and he is claiming that membership in the party is not compulsory, but it’s obvious that is where it is headed. Here’s an [article](http://www.venezuelanalysis.com/news.php?newsno=2276) with some quotes that make clear what I’m trying to say: [/QUOTE] He is purely proposing uniting the umbrella of groups that support him into one party. There is nothing there at all about abolishing opposition parties. In fact there is nothing in your cite that supports your interpretation. ---
**Author:** ![lalenin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/3da27b/32.png) [@lalenin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lalenin)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/9 "2007-05-16T14:59:24Z")
[QUOTE=tagos] He is purely proposing uniting the umbrella of groups that support him into one party. There is nothing there at all about abolishing opposition parties. In fact there is nothing in your cite that supports your interpretation. [/QUOTE] What can I say, believe what you want, in a couple of months I’ll be posting a reference to this post just like kimstu did. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/10 "2007-05-16T15:17:52Z")
[QUOTE=lalenin] What can I say, believe what you want, in a couple of months I’ll be posting a reference to this post just like kimstu did. [/QUOTE] It’s not a matter of belief. A cite is meant to support your case. Yours did not. What you imagine might happen in the future has no bearing, even if it turns out to be true. I’m no fan of Chavez but there are many real dictators around that the USA has no problems dealing with so I consider this anti-chavez schitck no more than politically motivated recreational outrage. Chavez wins elections with the votes of people who have not benefitted from the previous plutocratic regime. They can vote him out of power if they wish and there is no indication free elections are on the way out. It was the disloyal opposition that conspired with foreign powers to implement a coup. It’d be cool if the [participatory democracy](http://www.venezuelanalysis.com/articles.php?artno=1626) model was given a chance to work without foreign interference, but that isn’t going to happen. ---
**Author:** ![Sapo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ec9cab/32.png) [@Sapo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sapo)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/11 "2007-05-16T15:49:48Z")
All I am going to say is that I love it when I hear someone defend socialist revolution form the comfort of being away, free to speak his mind with a full belly. It may be true that he has jumped through the hoops to get his agenda “legitimized”. That doesn’t make it right. He won a landslide election, changed the constitution (according to the rules of the old one) on a valid vote, and now the constitution allows him to do all the things he is doing. Fine. He has proven that democracy is not the right government system for uneducated nations. He has practically eliminated all division of powers, he now rules the entire country by decree. He is a democratically elected dictator. People who defend that, are either too far away to suffer the consequences or too ignorant to understand they are getting shafted. ---
**Author:** ![Sapo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ec9cab/32.png) [@Sapo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sapo)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/12 "2007-05-16T15:55:39Z")
[QUOTE=tagos] …No country on earth would allow a media outlet to incite violence and support coups. [/QUOTE] Except, of course, when it is the goverment station that is doing it. El Presidente himself is constantly calling his “circulos” to threaten and intimidate any opposition entity or gathering. But hey, it is all for the revolution so that’s fine. And if people just stop watching the government station, then it is time for “cadenas” (how is that for an ironic name?) when ALL stations are mandated to broadcast his messages. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/13 "2007-05-16T15:58:22Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > I’m no fan of Chavez but there are many real dictators around that the USA has no problems dealing with so I consider this anti-chavez schitck no more than politically motivated recreational outrage. Who here is speaking in favor of any “real dictators”, or saying that we don’t have problems with the US being friendly with them? It’s silly to argue that criticism of Chavez must not be serious or sincere just because there are many political leaders who are a lot worse than Chavez. Yes indeed, there are lots of brutal and oppressive dictators in the world who make Chavez look like Good King Wenceslas by comparison, but this thread doesn’t happen to be about them. And remember, most of the participants in this thread so far are among the more liberal members of the Dope; we’re not just ragging on Chavez because we enjoy insulting left-wingers or something. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/14 "2007-05-16T16:00:55Z")
[QUOTE=tagos] I’m no fan of Chavez but there are many real dictators around that the USA has no problems dealing with so I consider this anti-chavez schitck no more than politically motivated recreational outrage. [/quote] Not on my part, I assure you. I’ve always defended Chavez up to now. But I have a problem with media censorship in any form, even in service of a political agenda I support. [QUOTE=tagos] Chavez wins elections with the votes of people who have not benefitted from the previous plutocratic regime. They can vote him out of power if they wish and there is no indication free elections are on the way out. [/QUOTE] I **hope** so, even now. But if Venezuelan presidential elections turn into a rubber-stamp sham like those in Hussein’s Iraq – how will we even know? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/15 "2007-05-16T16:02:22Z")
[QUOTE=Sapo] . . . then it is time for “cadenas” (how is that for an ironic name?) . . . [/QUOTE] I dunno . . . what’s it mean in English? ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/16 "2007-05-16T16:09:12Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] I **hope** so, even now. But if Venezuelan presidential elections turn into a rubber-stamp sham like those in Hussein’s Iraq – how will we even know? [/QUOTE] The Carter Centre and the various other international bodies who monitor elections will tell us. I have a problem with media censorship. I have a much bigger problem with media owners actively supporting coups against a democratically elected government. This isn’t about censorship, it is about dealing with participation in a coup. IMHO those involved should be tried and thrown in a deep dark hole. They are getting off lightly. ---
**Author:** ![Sapo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ec9cab/32.png) [@Sapo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sapo)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/17 "2007-05-16T16:13:50Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] I dunno . . . what’s it mean in English? [/QUOTE] “chains”. It makes sense because all TV stations are “linked” transmitting the same thing. They used to be something similar to the “State of the Nation” speeches in the US. They were also used for national events or emergencies. It was normally months from one to the next. Now, there is one scheduled every week and unscheduled ones about every other day. ---
**Author:** ![lalenin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/3da27b/32.png) [@lalenin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lalenin)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/18 "2007-05-16T16:37:44Z")
[QUOTE=tagos] This isn’t about censorship, it is about dealing with participation in a coup. IMHO those involved should be tried and thrown in a deep dark hole. They are getting off lightly. [/QUOTE] So it’s that why Radio Caracas was shut down for participating in the coup attempt? Should I ask for a cite? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/19 "2007-05-16T16:44:35Z")
[QUOTE=lalenin] So it’s that why Radio Caracas was shut down for participating in the coup attempt? Should I ask for a cite? [/QUOTE] Multiple cites in post #7. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2007, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263/20 "2007-05-16T17:52:12Z")
> [@](#): > > I didn’t mind when he got Congress to vote him decree powers > [@](#): > > I didn’t mind when he nationalized the oilfields > [@](#): > > But as a former journalist I say silencing opposition media is beyond the pale, even for a president who has been visibly embattled by a sometimes criminal opposition. Have you ever heard the term ‘slippery slope’? Its funny to me that after handwaving aside all the stuff you don’t care about (or that you do care about but think its just peachy to take away the property or rights of large corporations, for instance, because its for the good of the people), you are surprised when an issue you DO care about is suddenly trampled. I’m not surprised myself…either way…but it IS pretty funny. Take comfort though BG…I’m sure tagos is right. Chavez is just misunderstood…or maybe just being playful. In the end, a socialist paradise is right around the corner I expect… -XT [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hugo-chavez-shutting-down-radio-caracas-television/404263.md?page=2)