# Human/chimpanzee hybrids: do you think they've been attempted, or ever will be? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 1, 2010, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526 "2010-06-01T17:36:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![campp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@campp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/campp)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2010, 12:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/21 "2010-06-02T12:32:06Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > So Arizona won’t allow humanzees in the state, even if they _do_ carry citizenship papers at all times? :rolleyes: No, no issue there. They just don’t want them “made” here. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2010, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/22 "2010-06-02T13:07:29Z")
I don’t think we’ll ever see a 50/50 human/chimp hybrid. What scientists will eventually work on is transferring certain specific characteristics from one species to the other. I can definitely see them making humans with the upper-body strength of chimps, or making chimps with higher human brain functions and opposable thumbs. The former would just be stronger humans; the latter, OTOH, would be something a bit more com plex, and I think that after years of legal struggles they will eventually be granted equal rights. ---
**Author:** ![cwthree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de0a6/32.png) [@cwthree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cwthree)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2010, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/23 "2010-06-02T15:58:50Z")
I’d be very surprised if not one person has taken eggs and sperm from the relevant species and mixed them in a petri dish to see if fertilization is possible (and if fertilization occurs, whether the resulting hybrid begins to divide in the manner of a normal fertilized egg). Whether this human-chimp hybrid has rights depends on several things, not the least of which being whether or not it can be implanted into a host and develop through a full-term pregnancy resulting in a live birth. If, for the sake of argument, someone produces a living chimp-human hybrid, I think that the creature’s claim to human rights would depend on its ability to interact with humans like another human. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2010, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/24 "2010-06-02T16:58:18Z")
> [@JoseB](#): > > Maybe we could borrow a term from the webcomic “Schlock Mercenary” (and others) and call them “sophonts” 🙂 That might work if you can provide a nice clear definition of “sophont,” and if it turned out to be appropriate to the issue. > [@JoseB](#): > > Back to the main theme of the thread. In the rest of my post I did address the OP’s second, and more interesting question in some detail. As to the first question, unless someone comes along with some reliable looking cites showing that a humanzee actually has been created, the only honest answer is that we do not know whether it can be done (although it seems most likely to me that our species are not sufficiently closely related for anything close to a 50-50 hybrid to be possible). Incidentally, if it _were_ possible for the species to hybridize naturally, I should have thought the most likely scenario would be that of a male chimp raping a human woman. They _are_ very strong, after all (although I believe I have heard that their penises are very small, and because of the size of human buttocks, might not be able to reach a woman’s vagina very easily). ---
**Author:** ![Darryl\_Lict](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7cd45c/32.png) [@Darryl\_Lict](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darryl_Lict)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2010, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/25 "2010-06-02T18:48:57Z")
[Oliver the humanzee](http://scienceray.com/biology/zoology/oliver-the-chimp-is-he-a-humanzee-half-human-half-ape/)! Well, he sort of looks and walks like a humanzee. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2010, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/26 "2010-06-02T18:51:46Z")
One of these days somebody will be drunk enough to try it, and I don’t mean in a lab! ---
**Author:** ![TimeWinder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bcef8e/32.png) [@TimeWinder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TimeWinder)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2010, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/27 "2010-06-02T19:08:48Z")
> [@Arrendajo](#): > > I don’t think humans and chimps are close enough on the ol’ tree to make a hybrid by natural means. That would be my guess, too: the last common chimp/human ancestor was about four million years ago; I can’t imagine we’re still interfertile with them. Chimps have an extra chromosome compared to us, and they’re demonstrably less likely to be swayed by flowers and chocolate. ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2010, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/28 "2010-06-02T20:46:34Z")
> [@TimeWinder](#): > > That would be my guess, too: the last common chimp/human ancestor was about four million years ago; I can’t imagine we’re still interfertile with them. Chimps have an extra chromosome compared to us, and they’re demonstrably less likely to be swayed by flowers and chocolate. [A dead colobus monkey is your ticket to chimpanzee poon.](http://blogs.ngm.com/blog_central/2009/10/did-early-humans-start-walking-for-sex.html) > [@](#): > > That sometimes happens among living chimpanzees, for instance when a female rewards a male for presenting her with a [tasty gift of colobus monkey](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fYfdlKIon4&feature=related). ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2010, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/29 "2010-06-02T20:50:30Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > Incidentally, if it _were_ possible for the species to hybridize naturally, I should have thought the most likely scenario would be that of a male chimp raping a human woman. They _are_ very strong, after all (although I believe I have heard that their penises are very small, and because of the size of human buttocks, might not be able to reach a woman’s vagina very easily). Nah, I’d be much more inclined to believe that some nasty-assed zoo keeper date-raped a chimpanzee, than that a chimpanzee would get the urge for some human poontang. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2010, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/30 "2010-06-02T21:04:30Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > Nah, I’d be much more inclined to believe that some nasty-assed zoo keeper date-raped a chimpanzee, than that a chimpanzee would get the urge for some human poontang. I don’t know about chimpanzees, and hope never to find out, but primatoloist Birute Galdikas reported witnessing the rape of a human female by an orangutan, and hearing of other such instances she did not personally witness. [Cite.](http://books.google.com/books?id=QmIL1EvL0msC&pg=PA151&lpg=PA151&dq=Birute+Galdikas+orangutan+rape+cook&source=bl&ots=XdtMMmw1dX&sig=vR1jzYPMA0it5ZgOai2tTIES108&hl=en&ei=iMUGTM_1J4SglAf3-8n5Cg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=8&ved=0CC0Q6AEwBw#v=onepage&q&f=false) ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2010, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/31 "2010-06-02T22:16:01Z")
Give a Greek House Fraternity a she-chimp & a keg of cold lager, & an attempt will be made. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2010, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/32 "2010-06-02T23:26:00Z")
I don’t expect that humans can be bred back to bonobos or chimps. I suspect we are well-speciated now, as we’re down a chromosome. But if we could, yeah, sure, human rights. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2010, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/33 "2010-06-02T23:31:59Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > I don’t expect that humans can be bred back to bonobos or chimps. I suspect we are well-speciated now, as we’re down a chromosome. > > But if we could, yeah, sure, human rights. “Bred back to”? Are you saying that humans are descended from chimps or bonobos? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malleus_incus_stapes/32/3293_2.png) [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malleus_Incus_Stapes)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/34 "2010-06-03T00:51:57Z")
> [@JoseB](#): > > And it appears that there was at least one attempt to produce a chimpanzee-human hybrid: Ilya Ivanov, Soviet biologist, apparently tried to perform the experiment. The information comes from a newspaper (the Scotsman, which appears to put a rather sensationalist slant on the story), Wikipedia, and (ahem) “Cracked”, so, take it with as many grains of salt as you wish 😛 Also [Elephants on Acid](http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0156031353/boingboing/). ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/35 "2010-06-03T02:07:55Z")
Speaking as a grad student in biology, I believe the prevailing opinion is that chimps and humans are probably close enough that a hybrid could happen, though maybe not easily. The differing chromosome numbers isn’t a huge deal, as they’re still homologous enough to pair up during meiosis, which in itself isn’t necessary for a viable organism, just a fertile one. I know I’ve heard people say that hybrids have been observed in species pairs that are farther apart than us and humans, but I can’t remember offhand which species they were referring to. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/36 "2010-06-03T02:55:52Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > “Bred back to”? Are you saying that humans are descended from chimps or bonobos? 😕 If humans share a “genus” with anything, it’s probably chimps & bonobos. We are more or less descended from the same thing. Socially, we’re probably closer to baboons, but genetically, proto-bonobo/chimp ancestry is not terribly controversial. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/37 "2010-06-03T03:13:33Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > If humans share a “genus” with anything, it’s probably chimps & bonobos. We are more or less descended from the same thing. Socially, we’re probably closer to baboons, but genetically, proto-bonobo/chimp ancestry is not terribly controversial. I wasn’t asking if you thought humans shared a common ancestor with chimps and bonobos. I asked if you thought that humans were descended from chimps and/or bonobos. ---
**Author:** ![Shirley\_Ujest](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/45deac/32.png) [@Shirley\_Ujest](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shirley_Ujest)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/38 "2010-06-03T14:53:28Z")
Can the Humanzee suck it’s own weenie? Then it can do pron. Profit! ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/39 "2010-06-03T21:52:41Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > I wasn’t asking if you thought humans shared a common ancestor with chimps and bonobos. I asked if you thought that humans were descended from chimps and/or bonobos. For what value of “human,” “chimp,” & “bonobo”? The proto-ancestor was probably not quite the same as any modern representative of the three. Do you think that bonobos & chimps evolved from humans? I said, “bred back,” a bit thoughtlessly & loosely–I tend to see the bonobo as the more “primitive” version of man–I threw “chimp” in there as I expect chimps & bonobos aren’t fully speciated at all. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526/40 "2010-06-03T22:05:49Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > For what value of “human,” “chimp,” & “bonobo”? The proto-ancestor was probably not quite the same as any modern representative of the three. Do you think that bonobos & chimps evolved from humans? No. See? It’s actually possible to answer a yes or no question with a yes or no an dnot have your thumbs fall off. I was asking because there are persons with a sufficiently mistaken understanding of the theory of evolution as to think that humans did in fact evolve from one of the other great ape species. > [@](#): > > I said, “bred back,” a bit thoughtlessly & loosely–I tend to see the bonobo as the more “primitive” version of man–I threw “chimp” in there as I expect chimps & bonobos aren’t fully speciated at all. Why do you see bonobos as more primitive homo sapiens? What do you mean by the term _primitive_? (By the way, I try to avoid rhetorical questions, and I’m not breaking that rule now.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/human-chimpanzee-hybrids-do-you-think-theyve-been-attempted-or-ever-will-be/541526.md?page=3)