# Hunter Biden artwork attracts ethics scrutiny **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [July 8, 2021, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031 "2021-07-08T21:55:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/221 "2021-07-10T15:00:29Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > This isn’t how government ethics is supposed to work. You’re supposed to _eliminate_ the conflict of interest. > > It’s frowned upon (or was, until Trump) to say “yeah there’s a conflict, but deal with it because you can’t prove we’re doing anything wrong.” > > I’m not President and I don’t know how Joe should mitigate it. I assume he has an army of attorneys and advisors who can help him get right, and as a constituent (and Biden voter!) I expect him to do so. Why do you think that what is being done is _not_ what that army of attorneys and advisors told him should be done? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/222 "2021-07-10T15:01:44Z")
I don’t get it. Why are you presuming Hunter would do exactly what his dad tells him? ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/223 "2021-07-10T15:02:00Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > So I ask again – what is the evidence for an actual conflict of interest, as opposed to the potential for a conflict of interest (which will exist as long as human beings have families they love)? To say “potential conflict of interest” is redundant. The rules around conflict of interest mostly deal with eliminating the potential. When it goes from potential to reality, then that’s just graft or bribery. You’d be well-served to read up on it before extending this tangent further. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/224 "2021-07-10T15:03:02Z")
So infanticide, I presume. Seems excessive to me, but YMMV. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/225 "2021-07-10T15:03:42Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > As long as you keep repeating the question, I’m going to keep repeating the answer. Conflicts of interest are supposed to be addressed by eliminating them, not by saying “what can ya do.” What conflict of interest exists that needs to be eliminated? Do you think it is possible to remove _all_ potential conflicts of interest? ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/226 "2021-07-10T15:06:49Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > > [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > > > I think Banksy sold some stuff on the street anonymously for like a hundred bucks one day sometime int he last 20 years; I heard about that. > > When your art sells for millions of dollars, you can afford to sell a piece or two for a hundred bucks for the added publicity and entertainment value of fucking with the art brokers. An excellent non-sequitur that has nothing to do with the discussion. Good job! ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/227 "2021-07-10T15:08:31Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > What conflict of interest exists that needs to be eliminated? The appearance of a situation where someone who is _obviously_ not an established artist, whose name is Biden and has never made a living under his own steam, may have received money in a sham transaction as a favor to his father, who has spent most of his life arranging similar deals for said failson. Obviously there’s going to be a perpetual stink around Hunter no matter what he does, because he’s spent most of his life in jobs he wasn’t qualified for, sitting on boards of companies that were donors or allies of Joe. That stink is never going to come off. But at least… at _least_… a Yale-trained lawyer could attempt to do something that _looks like_ work. Not “I became an artist yesterday and pulled in a half mil today and it’s definitely not because I’m a Biden.” The blind trust is a decent attempt, more than the Trumps ever did, but my god, what a low fucking bar we’ve sunk to. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/228 "2021-07-10T15:10:33Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I don’t get it. Why are you presuming Hunter would do exactly what his dad tells him? I assume the stakes and repercussions are slightly higher when you’re dad’s the president. It could be that Hunter is just a selfish prick who doesn’t care and is inconsiderate of his dad’s wishes. But I doubt that’s the kind of relationship the Biden family has. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/229 "2021-07-10T15:12:26Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > So infanticide, I presume. Seems excessive to me, but YMMV. 😉 There aren’t enough rolleyes in the world for this kind of glib and dishonest crap. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/230 "2021-07-10T15:17:31Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > > [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > > > What conflict of interest exists that needs to be eliminated? > > The appearance of a situation where someone who is _obviously_ not an established artist, whose name is Biden and has never made a living under his own steam, may have received money in a sham transaction as a favor to his father, who has spent most of his life arranging similar deals for said failson. > > Obviously there’s going to be a perpetual stink around Hunter no matter what he does, because he’s spent most of his life in jobs he wasn’t qualified for, sitting on boards of companies that were donors or allies of Joe. That stink is never going to come off. But at least… at _least_… a Yale-trained lawyer could attempt to do something that _looks like_ work. Not “I became an artist yesterday and pulled in a half mil today and it’s definitely not because I’m a Biden.” > > The blind trust is a decent attempt, more than the Trumps ever did, but my god, what a low fucking bar we’ve sunk to. I’m mystified by the raging contempt for Hunter Biden that you display and doubt the characterizations you offer. More raging contempt here: > [@QuickSilver](#): > > I assume the stakes and repercussions are slightly higher when you’re dad’s the president. It could be that Hunter is just a selfish prick who doesn’t care and is inconsiderate of his dad’s wishes. But I doubt that’s the kind of relationship the Biden family has. What the fuck? It’s like listening to people whine about Hillary Clinton all over again. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/231 "2021-07-10T15:18:12Z")
I’m sure his artwork is bad but I doubt it merits ethics scrutiny. Maybe Hunter should be encased in Carbonite for the balance of daddy’s term of office. ---
**Author:** ![SuntanLotion](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suntanlotion/32/16165_2.png) [@SuntanLotion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SuntanLotion)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/232 "2021-07-10T15:25:03Z")
No one got my joke? His age had been stated so often in this thread, I thought it would be obvious. Emojis are important. He’s a private citizen, right? ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/233 "2021-07-10T15:26:22Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > The appearance of a situation where someone who is _obviously_ not an established artist… I’ve already demonstrated the flaw here. All artists are not established, until they are. He’s been dabbling with art since he was a kid and got pretty serious about it years ago as a form of therapy. > [@](#): > > …, whose name is Biden No one in this thread has claimed that his name is a non-issue. It definitely helps get attention to his art, which can then be judged on its merits by those whose opinions drive the pricing of the pieces. I believe that it will be both a help and a hindrance as there will also be people who won’t touch his art because of his name. If he’s any good, he’ll be a primary player much faster. If he’s not, he’ll be a non-entity in the art world in a few years. I’m also of the opinion that Hunter takes advantage of his name at many times. I don’t put that on Joe. > [@](#): > > …and has never made a living under his own steam, may have received money in a sham transaction as a favor to his father,… Do we have any evidence that this has happened? > [@](#): > > … who has spent most of his life arranging similar deals for said failson. He has? ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/234 "2021-07-10T15:30:24Z")
> [@DMC](#): > > Do we have any evidence that this has happened? Again, the point is _that the potential exists_. Good public ethics demands that the conflict be mitigated or removed entirely, not to say “yeah, we could be doing bad stuff, but trust us, we’re not.” ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/235 "2021-07-10T15:30:30Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > To say “potential conflict of interest” is redundant. The rules around conflict of interest mostly deal with eliminating the potential. This is nonsense. Not because it’s wrong, but because it is impossible to eliminate all potential conflicts of interest without eliminating one’s interest in everything. Hunter Biden represents a potential conflict of interest, so does Jill, so does literally everything that Joe Biden has an interest in. You’re going down the rabbit hole of ‘potential’ because… and let’s be clear here… Joe Biden may be have his policy influenced by a person because that person bought a picture his son painted. Are you fucking kidding me? ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/236 "2021-07-10T15:33:54Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > You’re going down the rabbit hole of ‘potential’ because… and let’s be clear here… Joe Biden may be have his policy influenced by a person because that person bought a picture his son painted. Are you fucking kidding me? I’m not kidding anyone. You’re fortunate if you’ve never had to sit through training on this type of issue, but it’s the type of situation that comes almost verbatim in the after-quiz for this type of training. The answer is always “C, do not take the money/gift if a potential conflict exists.” It’s a pretty fucking low bar, and painfully obvious. I used to wonder who was stupid enough to need such classes, but this thread has convinced me of their importance. I think the Trump years have fucked up everyone’s sense of what is normal in this area. ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/237 "2021-07-10T15:34:55Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > Again, the point is _that the potential exists_ . There is potential that Joe Biden was a player in the Comet Ping Pong child sex ring. In fact, here is a picture of Joe Biden eating pizza. He should probably stop with the pizza consumption because the optics just aren’t very good. [![](https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/sites/default/files/imagecache/gallery_img_full/image/image_file/V082510DL-0144edit.jpg?itok=gPTpt787) ](https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/sites/default/files/imagecache/gallery_img_full/image/image_file/V082510DL-0144edit.jpg?itok=gPTpt787) ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/238 "2021-07-10T15:37:31Z")
> [@DMC](#): > > There is potential that Joe Biden was a player in the Comet Ping Pong child sex ring. Dumb and pathetic. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/239 "2021-07-10T15:37:40Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > > [@Cheesesteak](#): > > > > You’re going down the rabbit hole of ‘potential’ because… and let’s be clear here… Joe Biden may be have his policy influenced by a person because that person bought a picture his son painted. Are you fucking kidding me? > > I’m not kidding anyone. You’re fortunate if you’ve never had to sit through training on this type of issue, but it’s the type of situation that comes almost verbatim in the after-quiz for this type of training. The answer is always “C, do not take the money/gift if a potential conflict exists.” And Joe Biden won’t be taking any money. Nor, one assumes, providing any access or allowing any influence (from the anonymous buyers). What’s the problem here? ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2021, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031/240 "2021-07-10T15:40:34Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > And Joe Biden won’t be taking any money. > > What’s the problem here? His son will be taking in a half million for a hobby in which he isn’t trained, and has no previous record of sales. What his son _does_ have experience in is getting jobs at firms that helped out his father in other ways. I don’t know that this was in fact a favor to Biden. It can’t be proven, though I doubt it’s true. But the situation is an apparent gross conflict of interest and shouldn’t occur. Hunter should have no problem getting actual work in whatever it is that Yale-trained lawyer failsons do. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hunter-biden-artwork-attracts-ethics-scrutiny/946031.md?page=13)