# Hypothetical about Child Protective Services **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 13, 2006, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-about-child-protective-services/344201 "2006-02-13T01:54:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![1010011010](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/1/ea666f/32.png) [@1010011010](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/1010011010)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2006, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-about-child-protective-services/344201/1 "2006-02-13T01:54:56Z")
S’pose you know or have strong evidence that physical and sexual abuse is happening to children at a certain address. It happens on an almost daily basis and has been going on for years. What’s located at this address? A public school. What do you suppose the outcome would be if it were reported to CPS? Would animinstrators be removed from providing any services dealing with children until they had completed courses demonstrating their fitness to act as a parent? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Slant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c57346/32.png) [@Mr.Slant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Slant)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2006, 6:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-about-child-protective-services/344201/2 "2006-02-13T06:35:25Z")
If investigators find out that the administration of this school was negligent in letting this happen, there’s a good chance that a healthy number of people will lose their jobs. Really, I can’t imagine the crapstorm this would unleah. PS - If this is _not_ a hypothetical, call CPS and the cops _now_. ---
**Author:** ![Mesquite-oh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a183cd/32.png) [@Mesquite-oh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mesquite-oh)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2006, 6:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-about-child-protective-services/344201/3 "2006-02-13T06:35:27Z")
From what I understand, CPS deals with situations in which the parent, guardian, or family member is being abusive to the child. If a neighbor, teacher, or someone else who is not related to the child or who does not live in the home abuses a child, then the police deal with the situation. CPS could get involved if the parent does not adequately protect the child from this abusive person. What happens to a school adminstrator who gets accused of abusing a child or allowing the abuse of a child? That would probably fall under the district policies or state or local laws. I doubt CPS would have anything to do with it. ---
**Author:** ![wevets](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9a140/32.png) [@wevets](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wevets)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2006, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-about-child-protective-services/344201/4 "2006-02-13T16:54:33Z")
If all you do is report the address, it will be useless to CPS. The school could have anywhere from dozens to hundreds of employees, and they wouldn’t know who to investigate (and it might not even be an employee.) In addition, **chriscya** is correct about jurisdiction, at least here in California, CPS deals with the situation (in collaboration with the police) when family members or guardians abuse children. The police deal with the situation if someone from outside the family is abusing the child. The family is assumed to be supportive in cases of abuse from outside the family unless there’s evidence to the contrary. As a person who has had the unfortunate duty of reporting cases of child abuse to CPS ☹ I can tell you that the form you use to report has spaces for the child’s name, home address, and suspected cause of the abuse, but no place on the form for ‘address where the suspected abuse occurred.’ They’d much rather get information like that directly from the child or family rather than from some outside third reporter. For your second question, no. Merely reporting an incident to CPS causes an _investigation_. No one would be removed from working with children unless allegations of abuse are made to the police, who will arrest those responsible if there is sufficient evidence. CPS has no power to impose training, remediation, or punishment on school employees - if school employees are abusing children the proper recourse is the police and the courts, not CPS. ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2006, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-about-child-protective-services/344201/5 "2006-02-13T18:47:22Z")
> [@chriscya](#): > > From what I understand, CPS deals with situations in which the parent, guardian, or family member is being abusive to the child. > > If a neighbor, teacher, or someone else who is not related to the child or who does not live in the home abuses a child, then the police deal with the situation. CPS could get involved if the parent does not adequately protect the child from this abusive person. > > What happens to a school adminstrator who gets accused of abusing a child or allowing the abuse of a child? That would probably fall under the district policies or state or local laws. I doubt CPS would have anything to do with it. § 63.2-1503. Local departments to establish child-protective services; duties. > [@](#): > > A. Each local department shall establish child-protective services under a departmental coordinator within such department or with one or more adjacent local departments that shall be staffed with qualified personnel pursuant to regulations adopted by the Board. The local department shall be the public agency responsible for receiving and responding to complaints and reports, except that (i) in cases where the reports or complaints are to be made to the court and the judge determines that no local department within a reasonable geographic distance can impartially respond to the report, the court shall assign the report to the court services unit for evaluation; and (ii) **in cases where an employee at a private or state-operated hospital, institution or other facility, or an employee of a school board is suspected of abusing or neglecting a child in such hospital, institution or other facility, or public school, the local department shall request the Department and the relevant private or state-operated hospital, institution or other facility, or school board to assist in conducting a joint investigation in accordance with regulations adopted by the Board, in consultation with the Departments of Education, Health, Medical Assistance Services, Mental Health, Mental Retardation and Substance Abuse Services, Juvenile Justice and Corrections.** (Emphasis added.) [http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+63.2-1503](http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+63.2-1503) Apparently, if a school is involved, it is a mult-jurisdictional thing. And see, [http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+63.2-1511](http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+cod+63.2-1511) (Complaints of abuse and neglect against school personnel; interagency agreement) ---
**Author:** ![wevets](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9a140/32.png) [@wevets](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wevets)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2006, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-about-child-protective-services/344201/6 "2006-02-13T19:04:10Z")
Interesting, apparently in Virginia CPS is responsible for responding to abuse by schools or hospitals. I tried to check California’s code for CPS, but it’s not easy to search for, so take my words above with a grain of salt about whether CPS has jurisdiction. I still would report such an incident directly to the police (like during the commission of any other crime), who can take more direct action, rather than CPS. ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2006, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-about-child-protective-services/344201/7 "2006-02-13T19:37:44Z")
Found [this](http://www.dss.cahwnet.gov/pdf/PUB132.pdf) (pdf) which talks about mandatory reporting. It is less helpful than it could be because it is part of a criminal statute requiring certain people to report child abuse: > [@](#): > > 1. To Whom Do You Report? > The report must be made to a > county welfare department or > probation department (if designated > by the county to receive mandated > reports) or a police or sheriff’s > department, not including a school > district police or security department. > (P.C. 11165.9) > Reports by commercial print and > photographic print processors, are to > be made to the law enforcement > agency having jurisdiction immediately > or as soon as practically possible. > (P.C. 11166(d)). It seems pretty clear that any of the agencies described above must accept a complaint: > [@](#): > > 11165.9. Reports of suspected child abuse or neglect shall be made > by mandated reporters to any police department or sheriff’s > department, not including a school district police or security > department, county probation department, if designated by the county > to receive mandated reports, or the county welfare department.\*\* Any of > those agencies shall accept a report of suspected child abuse or > neglect whether offered by a mandated reporter or another person, or > referred by another agency, even if the agency to whom the report is > being made lacks subject matter or geographical jurisdiction to > investigate the reported case, unless the agency can immediately > electronically transfer the call to an agency with proper > jurisdiction. When an agency takes a report about a case of suspected > child abuse or neglect in which that agency lacks jurisdiction, the > agency shall immediately refer the case by telephone, fax, or > electronic transmission to an agency with proper jurisdiction. > Agencies that are required to receive reports of suspected child > abuse or neglect may not refuse to accept a report of suspected child > abuse or neglect from a mandated reporter or another person unless > otherwise authorized pursuant to this section, and shall maintain a > record of all reports received\*\*. (Emphasis added.) [http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/waisgate?WAISdocID=85889025535+0+0+0&WAISaction=retrieve](http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/waisgate?WAISdocID=85889025535+0+0+0&WAISaction=retrieve) This leaves open the possibility that CPS, Child Welfare, or the county welfare department more generally lacks jurisdiction to investigate a complaint about abuse in a school. But if that’s the case, they still have a duty to promptly get the complaint to the right agency. So it looks like you can report abuse to the police or the welfare agency and let them route it from there. There are also plenty of hotline numbers availabe: [http://www.capcsac.org/crisisnumbers/cps.html](http://www.capcsac.org/crisisnumbers/cps.html) [http://www.childsworld.ca.gov/res/pdf/EmergencyR\_315.pdf](http://www.childsworld.ca.gov/res/pdf/EmergencyR_315.pdf) (pdf) ---
**Author:** ![1010011010](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/1/ea666f/32.png) [@1010011010](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/1010011010)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2006, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-about-child-protective-services/344201/8 "2006-02-14T02:18:32Z")
School officials claim authority in loco parentis… seems like that’d make them fair game for CPS. The case would be analogous to one sibling abusing another while the parent’s neglect and/or lack of supervision allows it to happen. ---
**Author:** ![wevets](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9a140/32.png) [@wevets](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wevets)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2006, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-about-child-protective-services/344201/9 "2006-02-14T16:44:19Z")
> [@1010011010](#): > > School officials claim authority in loco parentis… seems like that’d make them fair game for CPS. The case would be analogous to one sibling abusing another while the parent’s neglect and/or lack of supervision allows it to happen. However, the state recognizes that it has a compelling interest in ensuring that parents have a relationship with their biological children - that’s why children can be taken away and later returned to the same family if the courts and CPS are satisfied that the children will not be in danger, it’s also why courts attempt to ensure both parents can be involved in the raising of children in divorce cases. In a school, the state has no compelling interest in ensuring that a _particular_ teacher or administrator has a relationship with a given child. The only state interest is that the child have _a_ teacher and the school _a_ administrator. Individuals who commit crimes in this situation will not necessarily be afforded an opportunity to return and work with the same children - in fact, I’d wager most courts would think it a bad idea. “in loco parentis” just means “in the place of parents,” not that school employees actually assume all the responsibilities of parents in a legal sense.