# Hypothetical: Conservative media push jury nullification. What happens? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 8, 2009, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-conservative-media-push-jury-nullification-what-happens/495760 "2009-05-08T16:08:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2009, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-conservative-media-push-jury-nullification-what-happens/495760/21 "2009-05-09T00:54:43Z")
Oh, and the OP should include that Hillary is behind it all so that she can jerk Prez Biden around by the strings she is pulling, all so that Hillary can enjoy tea parties with Queen Elizabeth where they discuss their absolute control of the international drug trade while Bill and Phillip go on a “blow jobs around the world” tour. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2009, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-conservative-media-push-jury-nullification-what-happens/495760/22 "2009-05-09T00:55:49Z")
> [@alphaboi867](#): > > The judge can also vacate the jury’s guilty verdict and enter a not guilty verdict into the record if he finds the evidence doesn’t support it. The prosecution can appeal this because they’re only exposing the defendent to the jury’s original verdict, not a 2nd jeopardy. He cannot, _under any circumstances_ vacate a not guilty and substitute a guilty verdict. But he could, if he detected some kind of evidence that members of the jury were going to deliberately ignore evidence or some such thing, declare a mistrial. I’m not sure, but I think this might be done at any point up to the jury delivering a verdict. Any lawyers here know what the options are if during deliberations, one or more jurors complained to the judge that another juror said something like, “I don’t care what the law or the evidence says, I’m voting \_\_\_\_\_”. ---
**Author:** ![Rolken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/df788c/32.png) [@Rolken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rolken)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2009, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-conservative-media-push-jury-nullification-what-happens/495760/23 "2009-05-09T01:46:08Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Jury nullification will never make much difference until all of the above are eliminated from the system. I see. Sounds like a pretty open-and-shut case in practical terms then, good only for getting people out of jury duty. Thanks for the replies. > [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > Oh, and the OP should include that Hillary is behind it all so that she can jerk Prez Biden around by the strings she is pulling, all so that Hillary can enjoy tea parties with Queen Elizabeth where they discuss their absolute control of the international drug trade while Bill and Phillip go on a “blow jobs around the world” tour. Don’t be ridiculous. By this point Hillary has already been inducted into the Illuminati and is busy covering up the alien visits. You don’t really think Dick Cheney wanted to spend more time with his family, do you? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2009, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-conservative-media-push-jury-nullification-what-happens/495760/24 "2009-05-09T04:50:24Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > Often, though, prosecutors and judges were in on the deal. When the officers of the courts started doing their job more diligently, the problems were reduced significantly. Lynchings in the United States didn’t come to an end because of legislative action, the diligence of law enforcement, or the willingness of prosecutors and judges to put lynchers behind bars. Thanks to the efforts of folks like Ida B. Wells and organizations like the NAACP and the Association of Southern Women for the Prevention of Lynching the act of lynching became less and less socially acceptable. Lynching was on the decline in the 1930s which was certainly long before the Feds gained the ability to really do anything meaningful about lynching. Odesio ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2009, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-conservative-media-push-jury-nullification-what-happens/495760/25 "2009-05-10T22:55:58Z")
> [@Captain\_Carrot](#): > > (bolding mine) That would certainly be a neat trick 😃 and about as likely as the OP’s situation. I think Obama discovering Time Travel and going back to run against himself is much more likely that Joe Biden delivering a convincing speech. Or managaing to not say something stupid every time he opens his mouth. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2009, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-conservative-media-push-jury-nullification-what-happens/495760/26 "2009-05-10T23:22:29Z")
> [@Rolken](#): > > It’s 2012, and Obama has just been reelected. A ragtag crew of skinheads decides that the US can’t withstand another four years of socialist fascism and guns him down. In the resulting hysteria, the new President Biden makes a few offhand remarks that spiral out of control into sweeping gun control legislation. (For the sake of the hypothetical, Obama has picked Supreme Court appointees who would overturn the 5-4 DC handgun decision.) > > The conservative media switch to round-the-clock coverage of Glenn Beck crying and Rush Limbaugh screaming. Once Beck’s tears run out (assume that this is possible) somebody gets the bright idea of encouraging the Real America to nullify the new law in court. Lacking any other source of power, this soon becomes the new rallying cry to replace defending torture and cutting social services. > > So, what’s the fallout? They managed to convince 19% of rural Americans that [Obama is a Muslim](http://www.usatoday.com/news/religion/2008-04-01-obama-muslim_N.htm); on a fiercely controversial topic like gun control, can they get enough people aligned behind nullification to cause a real problem and give the law the aura of unenforceability, or is there still a way of filtering them out? My presumption would be that the promotion of jury nullification is as close to constitutionally ironclad as you can get with the trifecta of double jeopardy protection + the right to a jury + free speech, but the right to bear arms seems pretty clear too and yet the DC handgun law was only barely thrown out. Is there any way to stop such a movement? Is it even desirable to be able to stop such a movement? Am I filling this OP with too many questions? You forgot to mention that the ragtag skinheads gather a huge force of followers, heavily armed, who steal nuclear arms from Pakistan, and then take the U.S. Congress and Supreme Court hostage. Then they put a proxy in place of Biden, and get a law passed that allows them to disband all U.S. military and become the new armed forces. Jury nullification (as well as free speech) becomes irrelevant, as they change the Constitution, and all traditional legal notions are abandoned. Except for the conditions that inspired the Third Amendment, which is also rescinded and any skinhead can walk into your house and demand free food and boarding. Then you wake up and go home to have meatloaf with ketchup. And I get a free pet unicorn. So my question is: “What do I feed my new unicorn?” ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2009, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-conservative-media-push-jury-nullification-what-happens/495760/27 "2009-05-11T01:02:26Z")
> [@guizot](#): > > So my question is: “What do I feed my new unicorn?” Virgins. (For some reason, the legends never mention **why** unicorns like virgins.) ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2009, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-conservative-media-push-jury-nullification-what-happens/495760/28 "2009-05-11T03:49:38Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Double jeopardy applies regardless of whether the defendant was acquitted in a jury trial or a bench trial. It’s not about the right to trial by jury, it’s about final resolution of charges. But the DJ clause is what makes it impossible for the prosecution to appeal an acquittal, which is the entire basis for the power of jury nullification. That’s why nullification only works in criminal trials and only in one direction. Whether or not the DJ clause is also applicable to bench trials is irrelevant. ---
**Author:** ![Martiju](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e8c25b/32.png) [@Martiju](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martiju)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2009, 12:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-conservative-media-push-jury-nullification-what-happens/495760/29 "2009-05-11T12:05:38Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Virgins. (For some reason, the legends never mention **why** unicorns like virgins.) Unicorns are, by definition, always horny… ---
**Author:** ![Death\_of\_Rats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a6a055/32.png) [@Death\_of\_Rats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Death_of_Rats)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2009, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-conservative-media-push-jury-nullification-what-happens/495760/30 "2009-05-11T14:25:57Z")
Of course, a Pres. Biden eloquent and beloved enough to get draconian gun controls laws enacted would be more than enough to reinstall the Fairness Doctrine, which would nullify the social impact that talk radio and its TV offspring would provide. When the right-wing have their wack-job ideas challenged directly they tend to a lot less convincing. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2009, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-conservative-media-push-jury-nullification-what-happens/495760/31 "2009-05-11T18:55:37Z")
Mister Biden has guns, you know. And a son named Hunter. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2009, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-conservative-media-push-jury-nullification-what-happens/495760/32 "2009-05-14T17:47:05Z")
> [@42fish](#): > > Like that’s gonna happen. Relax. Maybe enjoy a nice game of solitaire. Kudos for the _Manchurian Candidate_ reference. You beat me to it! ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2009, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-conservative-media-push-jury-nullification-what-happens/495760/33 "2009-05-14T19:49:11Z")
> [@Rolken](#): > > Am I filling this OP with too many questions?] Yes, but that wouldn’t be a problem if you’d answer yourself too, Rumsfeld-style. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hypothetical-conservative-media-push-jury-nullification-what-happens/495760.md?page=1)