# I always thought I was pretty tolerant **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 5, 2004, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-always-thought-i-was-pretty-tolerant/253575 "2004-07-05T00:32:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![B.Serum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/b.serum/32/14266_2.png) [@B.Serum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/B.Serum)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2004, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-always-thought-i-was-pretty-tolerant/253575/21 "2004-07-05T18:39:13Z")
**7 up yours:** I think this fella exceeds the limits of your tolerance not for his right-wing views, but for the hate that carries them. I would bet that if he was putting forth his concerns and values without hate and slander, you would be more receptive to them. The other aspect to appreciate is that accepting someone else’s views is somewhat incompatible with debate (at least, the way most people debate). Most people arrive at their position based on a gut feeling and then search out evidence that supports that position, rather than wait for all relevant evidence is available before formulating an opinion. I think that we humans need a degree of ignorance to be able to go through life. With ignorance, it is easy to have “right” and “wrong” and therefore a reality that has order and structure. The more that we dig for facts, we find more often than not that the things that are most important to us can be very complicated with aspects that are difficult — if not impossible — to reconcile. This ambiguity destroys the little foundation that we rely upon for just getting through life. I don’t belive that liberal = accepting. If anything, I believe that moderate = accepting, because I personally find the far-left people to be fairly closed-minded and strident defenders of their values as much as the far-right folks. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2004, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-always-thought-i-was-pretty-tolerant/253575/22 "2004-07-05T18:50:34Z")
> [@7 up yours](#): > > I’ve been described by my friends as a tree hugging Liberal (meant as a term of endearment) and I believed that I was pretty accepting of other people’s views. > > Then I started attempting to debate with someone with Conservative views, and the conservative views just boggles my mind. I just don’t see how anyone can live their lives by those sets of “rules”. I try to shift the gears in my brain to put myself in their place, but I can’t do it. Am I so overly Liberal that I have contradicted myself into not accepting Conservative views? > > Maybe it is that particular person whom I was debating with that is an ignorant fool and made Conservative views worse than they seem. It really just boggles my mind. > > So much for a tree hugging Liberal! What conservative rules? Did I not get the memo or something? Actually, I’m not a true conservative. For one thing, I am agnostic, so I’m not burdened down with all the religious mumbo-jumbo that seems to have infested conservatism like hookworms. For another, I am pro-choice. However, I do believe in tax reform, smaller government, capitalism and free markets. I am against gay marriage; I’m also against divorce where children are involved unless drugs, alcohol or violence is in the mix. I’m in favor of sealing our borders tight and I support the war in Iraq. I guess all that makes me a moderate. ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2004, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-always-thought-i-was-pretty-tolerant/253575/23 "2004-07-05T19:13:53Z")
> [@](#): > > **Weirddave** said: > [left wing loonie mode] > > Wh00t! 526 more like this, and maybe we can finally get the illegal 2000 election results overturned! > > [/left wing loonie mode] (Please note that tongue is firmly in cheek) Then we’d have to get rid of all those dead democrats that keep voting in Chicago and Philadelphia… and what to do about Mayview State Hospital, where apparently the guy who didn’t even know he lives on earth voted in the election! (No idea who that last guy voted for, just that there were some really out of touch people in that hospital voting.) ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2004, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-always-thought-i-was-pretty-tolerant/253575/24 "2004-07-05T19:18:04Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > I’m not taking potshots at liberals. I’m taking potshots at the left (and at the right). The post I responded to is a perfect example of polarizing, suggesting as it does that conservatives can’t read. Did you interpret that as a call to reconciliation and unity? It suggested that some conservatives don’t read – “some conservatives in my family” were the semiantecedent to “such people.” Your post generalized about the left and the right. And when **rjung** changes his username to **conservative** , I’ll chastise him, too :). Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2004, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-always-thought-i-was-pretty-tolerant/253575/25 "2004-07-05T19:35:15Z")
> [@catsix](#): > > (Please note that tongue is firmly in cheek) > > Then we’d have to get rid of all those dead democrats that keep voting in Chicago and Philadelphia… and what to do about Mayview State Hospital, where apparently the guy who didn’t even know he lives on earth voted in the election! (No idea who that last guy voted for, just that there were some really out of touch people in that hospital voting.) Heard the old joke? Plane crashing, only one parachute, on board George Bush, John Kerry and the late mayor Daley from Chicago, they decide the fair thing to do is vote on who get the parachute and Daley wins the vote 10-1-1. ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2004, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-always-thought-i-was-pretty-tolerant/253575/26 "2004-07-05T19:48:53Z")
Kinda like my old town. The mayor won the election by getting more votes than the population of the town… ---
**Author:** ![Misnomer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/misnomer/32/14897_2.png) [@Misnomer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Misnomer)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2004, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-always-thought-i-was-pretty-tolerant/253575/27 "2004-07-06T03:24:43Z")
> [@Hey you!](#): > > I don’t belive that liberal = accepting. If anything, I believe that moderate = accepting, because I personally find the far-left people to be fairly closed-minded and strident defenders of their values as much as the far-right folks. You know, as much as I’m anti-generalizations, my first reaction to reading this was ‘right on!’ I participate in a local message board where the regulars are mostly conservative (I live in a conservative part of the DC area), and many are closed-minded and strident (good words!). I also quickly discovered that the few left-wingers on the board are just as quick to condemn and jump to conclusions as the right-wingers. (Me, I’m a registered Independent who agrees with some liberal stuff and some conservative stuff…but almost the opposite of **Clothahump** {grin}). A peek at some of the theist vs. atheist threads over in Great Debates just confirms this. But, while I like the idea of being more open-minded than either ‘side’ (;)), I _am_ anti-generalizations, so I’ll make myself feel better by saying: “tsk, tsk!” {grin} ---
**Author:** ![fluiddruid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@fluiddruid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fluiddruid)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2004, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-always-thought-i-was-pretty-tolerant/253575/28 "2004-07-06T03:30:18Z")
> [@Liberal](#): > > Because that’s not what I think. What I said was that sometimes — _sometimes_ — it isn’t knowledge, but arrogance. Knowledge is no panacea. Many of history’s most horrible villains were quite intelligent. In fact, few were not. Fair enough. I simply took your post differently; if I misconstrued your opinion, I apologize. However, I would like to note that intelligence does not equal knowledge. Not to say you can’t be knowledgeable and a complete jerk (selfish, rotten behavior in general). I just think it’s hard to reconcile irrational hatred and stereotyping of groups with actual knowledge or experience with those groups. That’s what I meant, and that’s what we are talking about in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![thirdwarning](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecccb3/32.png) [@thirdwarning](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thirdwarning)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2004, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-always-thought-i-was-pretty-tolerant/253575/29 "2004-07-06T03:44:14Z")
[QUOTE=RTA] I have the same problem with some conservatives in my family; why I even have a relative who it turns out voted for Bush twice in 2000. In Florida! Filling out an absentee ballot for someone who no longer had the cognitive ability to vote for themselves, you see. (And nothing wrong with it because said individual “usually voted for Republicans, back when she could”.) /QUOTE] Probably cancelled out by the woman my husband rides the bus with, who “helps” her brother vote every election, since he’s too developmentally disabled to know what he’s doing. And she makes no bones about the fact that she sees it as a way of getting one more vote for her favorite (read Democratic) candidate. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2004, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-always-thought-i-was-pretty-tolerant/253575/30 "2004-07-06T04:54:04Z")
Recently in a social situation a young woman who is unfamiliar with my political leanings made these two comments during the evening: “Hillary Clinton is a prostitute for power.” “I don’t want Gloria Steinem making choices for me.” The woman is otherwise very endearing and pleasant. Had she not have been a guest of the family and in the presence of her own children, I would have been more assertive in addressing the issues. I would never dream of making snide comments about Bush _in a social situation when I was either a guest or the host._ If I can bite my tongue (for an evening) about a President that I believe has brought disgrace to our country and death to thousands, why can’t she suck it in for a few hours? I run into this situation a lot with _younger_ conservatives. Maybe I just don’t notice it with liberals. BTW, I heard her \*four year old daughter \* call someone “bitch” before the evening was over. Wonder where she picked that up. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2004, 10:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-always-thought-i-was-pretty-tolerant/253575/31 "2004-07-06T10:38:29Z")
> [@fluiddruid](#): > > Fair enough. I simply took your post differently; if I misconstrued your opinion, I apologize. > > However, I would like to note that intelligence does not equal knowledge. Not to say you can’t be knowledgeable and a complete jerk (selfish, rotten behavior in general). I just think it’s hard to reconcile irrational hatred and stereotyping of groups with actual knowledge or experience with those groups. That’s what I meant, and that’s what we are talking about in this thread. Your majesty must be using the royal “we”. In the last few posts alone, I see discussions of mayors with parachutes, proper social behavior, closed-mindedness versus open-mindedness, and the general dangers of generalizing. ---
**Author:** ![fluiddruid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@fluiddruid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fluiddruid)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-always-thought-i-was-pretty-tolerant/253575/32 "2004-07-07T03:53:03Z")
Stop being a jerk, Liberal. Look at the posts before yours. Christ. It’s getting so I can’t even have a _decent discussion_ in the Pit, nowadays! ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-always-thought-i-was-pretty-tolerant/253575/33 "2004-07-07T06:07:55Z")
Oh, damn. And they made the board just for you. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-always-thought-i-was-pretty-tolerant/253575/34 "2004-07-07T13:44:49Z")
7 up yours Did you blow up the guy’s place of business for having conservative views? Did you shoot him in the back for having conservative views? If you didn’t, I’d say you tolerated them pretty well. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-always-thought-i-was-pretty-tolerant/253575.md?page=1)