# I am confused about Alex Jones' lawyer's "mistake" in sending all of Jones' phone contents to the plaintiffs **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [August 4, 2022, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096 "2022-08-04T15:34:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/230 "2022-10-12T23:30:31Z")
Awesome. Glad you recognize the problem. I may suggest commenting on topics with which you have direct experience or a wellspring of knowledge which contributes to the discussion. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/231 "2022-10-12T23:30:50Z")
> [@On another topic](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/973149/7): > > …some of your folk need to get their sh\*t together. So if I don’t believe in your conspiracy theories, it means I am wrong and need to get my sh\*t together? ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/232 "2022-10-12T23:46:03Z")
I believe the lawyer fees would tip it into 1 billion, at the very least. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/233 "2022-10-12T23:48:48Z")
NPR just ran a story on this, and what I didn’t realize earlier is that the $965 million judgement doesn’t include punitive damages, so the total is almost certainly going to be well north of a billion dollars. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/234 "2022-10-12T23:54:46Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > The New York Times article on this says, “This case presented the greatest financial risk to Mr. Jones, because he was found liable of violating Connecticut’s Unfair Trade Practices Act, by using lies about the shooting to sell products on Infowars. There is no cap on punitive damages under that law.” The New York Times is wrong. While state law may not cap punitive damages, the U.S. Supreme Court has imposed some limits. For cases where the verdict includes “substantial” compensatory damages, due process might only support a 1 to 1 ratio. 4 to 1 at the most (IMHO). ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2022, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/235 "2022-10-12T23:54:55Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > NPR just ran a story on this, and what I didn’t realize earlier is that the $965 million judgement doesn’t include punitive damages, so the total is almost certainly going to be well north of a billion dollars. I am pleased it’s a very high amount, but is it possible he could appeal and get the amount lowered? (I know next to nothing about these things.) ---
**Author:** ![lum\_s\_husband](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lum_s_husband/32/3698_2.png) [@lum\_s\_husband](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lum_s_husband)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2022, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/236 "2022-10-13T00:03:52Z")
Appealing a civil judgment typically requires putting up a bond for the full amount of the judgement. Not ideal if you are planning to abscond. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2022, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/237 "2022-10-13T00:38:15Z")
The NYT article didn’t say that there are no caps, period, just that under that law, there are no caps. ---
**Author:** ![Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kolak_of_twilo/32/73_2.png) [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolak_of_Twilo)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2022, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/238 "2022-10-13T01:46:51Z")
[Jones was broadcasting online](https://www.nytimes.com/2022/10/12/us/politics/alex-jones-denounces-verdict.html?unlocked_article_code=C46h3Fi9es-yjHFEYL24yE1yUlPc2FAjDJ_A92gd-wEdyDGOKrnsH4hljYPH8froUHo4n7oCzBGpXxlyhTTd8GiGIxuvUdm9E-7DITG8EjKK078-VnwZxOfBNoZSBV1oUfIy302VBzF5gfX6mw3s1yoFzDHnIDr7Mxywpjf2Uqh2ZkEML7ZgFaxQ9EE2X6LiUSk6tyStvlPdYk1pw3vC04cES4p0XKCifaLomBithuXGCf4KwzMWIkMWDm8Z7GZouMeO7XVdcZDfGH4dldYn_-cN0xGxvArSGvUnqGlk_IJoFTVLt2AL3HTdNRbv0jnKWoSyBK8wuDMl5DZwusWjCJpZo2C_YtkySOE&smid=share-url), showing the reading of the verdict while he mocked it. (gift link to NYT) > Do these people actually think they’re getting any money? Jones is such a piece of shit he was using the verdict as a fundraising tactic as well vowing to fight the verdict in court rather than pay one cent of it. He also stated this was an attempt to > scare us away from questioning Uvalde and what really happened there, or Parkland or any other event…We’re not going away, and we’re not going to stop. What a total piece of garbage. Sadly, I doubt these families will ever see a penny of this money. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2022, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/239 "2022-10-13T01:51:21Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > While state law may not cap punitive damages, the U.S. Supreme Court has imposed some limits. So this could go to appeal at the federal level and be reduced? I wonder why states bother then. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2022, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/240 "2022-10-13T02:03:03Z")
> [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](#): > > Sadly, I doubt these families will ever see a penny of this money. They’ve said repeatedly that they aren’t doing it for the money. They’re doing it to set a precedent for anyone who might try this stunt again. Most of them won’t have Jones’s access to the money of adherents. > [@Atamasama](#): > > I wonder why states bother then. 99.999… percent of cases have no chance of getting before the U.S. Supreme Court. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2022, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/241 "2022-10-13T02:05:06Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > 99.999… percent of cases have no chance of getting before the U.S. Supreme Court. So it’s not a statute or anything. They’d need to appeal it all the way up there. I understand that now. ---
**Author:** ![Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kolak_of_twilo/32/73_2.png) [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolak_of_Twilo)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2022, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/242 "2022-10-13T02:08:40Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > > [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](#): > > > > Sadly, I doubt these families will ever see a penny of this money. > > They’ve said repeatedly that they aren’t doing it for the money. They’re doing it to set a precedent for anyone who might try this stunt again. Most of them won’t have Jones’s access to the money of adherents… Admirable as that may be, without some type of financial penalty, shit stains like Jones have no reason to NOT try a stunt like this again, particularly since he has made MILLIONS off of it. This is a civil penalty, not criminal. Though I would support bringing back drawing and quartering for trash that abuse the 1st Amendment to perpetrate something like this. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2022, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/243 "2022-10-13T02:12:19Z")
> [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](#): > > Admirable as that may be, without some type of financial penalty, shit stains like Jones have no reason to NOT try a stunt like this again, particularly since he has made MILLIONS off of it. I don’t think you understand. They are not looking to pocket money. They are looking to set a precedent that someone who does this will have to _pay_ money. It doesn’t matter if the plaintiffs in this case don’t actually get money. To them what is important is that the next time someone tries this, that person _will_ be facing this precedent of a huge monetary damages award. Jones himself might have the resources to save himself from penury, but the next guy won’t. They will have to take this damage award into consideration before trying what Jones did, _even if Jones isn’t personally harmed in the end_. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2022, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/244 "2022-10-13T02:15:45Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > So it’s not a statute or anything. The U.S. Congress would have no authority to cap damages in state courts. [Some states have enacted statutes setting limits](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-economic_damages_caps#Non-economic_damages_caps_in_American_states) _in certain circumstances_. These statutes have been upheld by some state supreme courts and struck down by other state supreme courts. Actually, I can’t find a U.S. Supreme Court case on this point, so I don’t know what the prior post was talking about. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2022, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/245 "2022-10-13T02:20:32Z")
> [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](#): > > Jones is such a piece of shit he was using the verdict as a fundraising tactic as well vowing to fight the verdict in court rather than pay one cent of it. He also stated this was an attempt to > > > scare us away from questioning Uvalde and what really happened there, or Parkland or any other event…We’re not going away, and we’re not going to stop. > > What a total piece of garbage. Alex Jones is not the only sleazebag who’s built a profitable base of loyal dupes while conspiracy-mongering about tragedies. He’s not even the only resident of Austin, Texas to have done so. Mike Adams of Natural News, who’s long been big on claiming “false flag” operations, is currently spinning [fabrications about Uvalde](https://www.naturalnews.com/2022-05-27-uvalde-massacre-was-a-planned-stand-down-operation.html). ---
**Author:** ![Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kolak_of_twilo/32/73_2.png) [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolak_of_Twilo)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2022, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/246 "2022-10-13T02:21:05Z")
I assure you I completely understand. I question whether or not you do. I don’t expect the parents are looking to get rich off of the death of their children. That would be horrific. But I seriously think you are wrong to think they don’t want to see Jones suffer for what he did. IF in the end he doesn’t see some level of harm for what he has done there is NOTHING to prevent the next guy from doing the same, precedent be damned. Particularly if the precedent has no teeth. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2022, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/247 "2022-10-13T02:30:32Z")
> [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](#): > > That would be horrific. But I seriously think you are wrong to think they don’t want to see Jones suffer for what he did. IF in the end he doesn’t see some level of harm for what he has done there is NOTHING to prevent the next guy from doing the same, precedent be damned. Particularly if the precedent has no teeth. You are wrong about this. They might _want_ Jones _himself_ to suffer, but that’s not the point, and certainly not the most important point they are trying to make. _Even if Jones personally doesn’t suffer, the precedent is still precedent._ Think of the reasons Jones might escape serious suffering: He is rich, he has a massive following who might be willing to pour money into his pockets no matter what he does, he might be able to make legal manoeuvres that frustrate collection of money from him, he might have to fork over some money, but find it quickly replaced by his hordes. _These conditions don’t apply to the next guy._ There’s only one Alex Jones. There might be a small number of people capable of marshaling resources that he can. _But they next guy who does it is very unlikely to be able to do so._ The next guy, if faced with this kind of lawsuit, first of all will (1) have to pay for an army of lawyer, and (2) if he loses, won’t have the ability to resist collection of the judgment, nor the ability to get funds replenished by devoted followers. To the extent that this judgement comes out the other end as a massively large amount (I doubt very much that it’s going to remain at $900 million-plus by the time it’s over), it will present a very important weapon against the next guy, _even if Alex Jones manages to come out relatively unscathed._ Furthermore, any business organization, liek a law firm, or a broadcasting company, or an internet service provider, etc., is going to take this into account before becoming a platform for the next Alex Jones. It’s a big deal even if Jones’s own life doesn’t change at all. ---
**Author:** ![Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kolak_of_twilo/32/73_2.png) [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolak_of_Twilo)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2022, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/248 "2022-10-13T02:44:06Z")
**The point is to see to it that there is no “next Alex Jones”.** That won’t happen if he is able to escape repercussions for what he has done. And a precedent with no teeth is no real precedent. Further, his riches and his following came from having the platform he has had and spreading the lies he has spread. If this were some small time grifter who didn’t have a nationwide following it would be next to impossible for that person to terrorize the families to the extent Jones and his followers have. And if a $ is to be made there are plenty of broadcasters, lawyers and ISPs that would gladly jump onboard. Particularly when there is no real penalty. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2022, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096/249 "2022-10-13T02:53:04Z")
> [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](#): > > That won’t happen if he is able to escape repercussions for what he has done. You don’t seem to understand the impact of precedent on the real world so I will just leave it at what I’ve already said. I’m not going to try repeating myself. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-confused-about-alex-jones-lawyers-mistake-in-sending-all-of-jones-phone-contents-to-the-plaintiffs/969096.md?page=13)