# " I am honored to be sitting next to Barack Obama.." **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 22, 2008, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710 "2008-02-22T12:24:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710/61 "2008-02-23T02:57:27Z")
[QUOTE=Left Hand of Dorkness] I think you’re right; I also think Clinton is a smart enough politician (in some ways smarter than the other Clinton) that she’d know that, and modify her plan accordingly. As divisive a presence as she is on the national stage, everything I hear about her suggests that as a politician she’s a skilled diplomat. It so happens that I think Obama is the more skilled diplomat, and people have less emotion invested in thwarting him. I’ll vote for whichever one y’all Democrats nominate, but I think Obama has a better chance of turning the world toward the way I want it to be. Daniel [/QUOTE] Precisely why he will be the democratic nominee, and with a good bit of faith the next president. I do not think he is too good to be true, I think he’s coming at a time when we need a leader like him. That is why his popularity has gone through the roof. If Hillary had the popularity of Obama, we’d be singing her praises. She doesn’t. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710/62 "2008-02-23T03:00:50Z")
[QUOTE=Phlosphr] If Hillary had the popularity of Obama, we’d be singing her praises. [/QUOTE] Tautology. ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710/63 "2008-02-23T03:03:15Z")
[QUOTE=ElvisL1ves] Tautology. [/QUOTE] True, I should have left that sentence out. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710/64 "2008-02-23T03:08:02Z")
Just out of curiosity, how much of the Obama surge do you think can be attributed to the Oprah Effect? Did she, in effect, give people “permission” to go wild over him in a way they didn’t feel they had before? Would it have had the same effect if she’d endorsed a fellow woman instead of a fellow black? Don’t discount Oprah’s influence; anyone who can get _Anna Karenina_ on the NYT Bestseller List has a huge amount of that. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710/65 "2008-02-23T03:09:02Z")
I’ve been a fan of Barack Obama since before he was a senator, so it’s hard to know when other people found out about him. I figured it would happen sooner or later. ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710/66 "2008-02-23T03:16:07Z")
[QUOTE=ElvisL1ves] Just out of curiosity, how much of the Obama surge do you think can be attributed to the Oprah Effect? Did she, in effect, give people “permission” to go wild over him in a way they didn’t feel they had before? Would it have had the same effect if she’d endorsed a fellow woman instead of a fellow black? Don’t discount Oprah’s influence; anyone who can get _Anna Karenina_ on the NYT Bestseller List has a huge amount of that. [/QUOTE] I don’t think Oprah had too much to do with it. I think it was the large number of Unions, Senators, Legislators, feminist leaders, black leaders, white leaders etc…etc… that got him going. And when people saw that he could not only hold is own against a political institution like the Clintons, but begin to pass them by leaps and bounds…_ **that** _ turned a lot of heads. Oprah opened the doors to stay at home moms, women in a 30-50 demographic, and charitable trusts turning their heads - that’s what I think she did for him. And her Hollywood buddies I’m sure helps. De Niro had an intersting way of introducing Obama - [I liked it.](http://www.boston.com/news/politics/politicalintelligence/2008/02/toughguy_de_nir.html) ---
**Author:** ![storyteller0910](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecae2f/32.png) [@storyteller0910](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/storyteller0910)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710/67 "2008-02-23T03:23:12Z")
[QUOTE=ElvisL1ves] \*Clinton \* was joking, to dissipate as graciously as possible a way-out-of-line question from the moderator. In fact, she did give Obama credit props for his likeability. Obama’s answer was not at all gracious, it was given without looking at her directly, and was immediately followed by his looking down to hide his face while he mentally kicked himself for making such a mean-seeming gaffe. But it is not hard to guess what you’ll choose to believe instead. [/QUOTE] Almost as hard as it was to guess how you’d interpret it, I suppose. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710/68 "2008-02-23T03:38:18Z")
[QUOTE=ElvisL1ves] Tautology. [/QUOTE] Not necessarily. Bill Clinton was pretty dang popular among Democrats, IIRC, and I sure wasn’t singing HIS praises in the early nineties, after 12 years of Republican rule. I was relieved he was elected, happy even, but I didn’t believe then, nor do I believe now, that he’s a good person or one I’d trust. Obama is popular, sure, more popular than Bill ever was. But that’s not why I’m singing his praises. I’m singing them because I believe there are specific good things he can do, and also because, apart from those good things, he seems like a public figure with a strong sense of integrity, which is pretty rare. I mean, McCain is usually held up as a politician with integrity, and look at him. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![kevja](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/aeb1de/32.png) [@kevja](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kevja)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710/69 "2008-02-23T04:08:18Z")
[QUOTE=TWDuke] No, he said she was “likable _enough_,” his emphasis. There’s a difference. Try this out sometime: You’re beautiful, honey. You’re beautiful _enough_, honey.That’s the spirit. Accept that Obama says something negative, it’s a joke or a valid debating point. When Hillary says something negative, it’s an attack. When someone says something negative on Obama’s behalf, he can’t be held responsible. When someone says something about Obama, Hillary’s pulling the strings. When Obama says something gracious, it’s evidence of his character. When Hillary says something gracious, it’s evidence of her evil cunning. [/QUOTE] Sums it all up. When I see Obama on TV, I like him a lot. And not just the speeches. He is great in interviews, and is starting to handle the debates well. I’m voting for him in November. But when I read the threads about Obama on this board, sometimes I want to move to Texas so I can vote for Hillary, again. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 6:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710/70 "2008-02-23T06:46:00Z")
[QUOTE=ElvisL1ves] Just out of curiosity, how much of the Obama surge do you think can be attributed to the Oprah Effect? Did she, in effect, give people “permission” to go wild over him in a way they didn’t feel they had before? Would it have had the same effect if she’d endorsed a fellow woman instead of a fellow black? Don’t discount Oprah’s influence; anyone who can get _Anna Karenina_ on the NYT Bestseller List has a huge amount of that. [/QUOTE] I’ve been aware of Obama since his Senate campaign but really took notice of him after his keynote speech during the '04 Democratic Convention. I posted on this board that same day that he was going to be President someday. He popped off the screen. ---
**Author:** ![Santo\_Rugger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Santo\_Rugger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Santo_Rugger)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 7:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710/71 "2008-02-23T07:37:28Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] I’ve been aware of Obama since his Senate campaign but really took notice of him after his keynote speech during the '04 Democratic Convention. I posted on this board that same day that he was going to be President someday. He popped off the screen. [/QUOTE] :eek: I may have read that, because when Obama anounced he was going to run for President, I felt like I already knew that from here for some reason. I wonder how many/if any other posters said similar things before, say, December of '06. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 7:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710/72 "2008-02-23T07:51:23Z")
[QUOTE=Santo Rugger] :eek: I may have read that, because when Obama anounced he was going to run for President, I felt like I already knew that from here for some reason. I wonder how many/if any other posters said similar things before, say, December of '06. [/QUOTE] I found a couple of threads from right after Obama gave that speech. [Barack Obama](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=268599) [Obama for President](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=268610) So I obviously wasn’t the only person who was impressed. This is my post from that day (from the first linked thread): > [@](#): > > I had only the most vague awareness of who Obama was before tonight. Mostly I just knew him from the soap opera that is the current Illinois senatorial election. I was totally blown away by this guy. I got the same feeling from watching him tonight as I got when I first saw Michael Jordan playing for North Carolina. A sense, that I was seeing a major superstar in the making. I actually got chills down my spine and that’s not something that’s ever happened to me from listening to a politician, not even Clinton. With Clinton I always felt like it was a performance- an extremely skillful performance- but a performance nonetheless. There was a sincerity of passion in Obama tonight that was radiant. He also projected a genuine depth of intellect. Even though I had never seen him speak before, halfway through the speech, the thought…no, not a thought, more like the realization went through my head that this guy’s going to be president. I don’t know when, but he’s going to be president. It was a good feeling. That seems a little gushing to me now, but I haven’t lived to regret it yet. ---
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 8:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710/73 "2008-02-23T08:14:31Z")
I remember reading that post! I hadn’t even heard the man’s name before that, and to be honest I thought you were a bit gushing at the time, too. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Jolly\_Roger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/91b2a8/32.png) [@Jolly\_Roger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jolly_Roger)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 8:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710/74 "2008-02-23T08:27:41Z")
[QUOTE=TWDuke] No, he said she was “likable _enough_,” his emphasis. There’s a difference. Try this out sometime: You’re beautiful, honey. You’re beautiful _enough_, honey.That’s the spirit. Accept that Obama says something negative, it’s a joke or a valid debating point. When Hillary says something negative, it’s an attack. When someone says something negative on Obama’s behalf, he can’t be held responsible. When someone says something about Obama, Hillary’s pulling the strings. When Obama says something gracious, it’s evidence of his character. When Hillary says something gracious, it’s evidence of her evil cunning. [/QUOTE] Not saying her gracious wordsat the end of the debate were in fact part pf a cunning plan (Maybe, maybe, not) accusing someone of plagiarism is andifferent than saying “you’re likable enough” by an on order of magnitude. ---
**Author:** ![Santo\_Rugger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Santo\_Rugger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Santo_Rugger)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 9:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710/75 "2008-02-23T09:09:54Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] I found a couple of threads from right after Obama gave that speech. [Barack Obama](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=268599) [Obama for President](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=268610) So I obviously wasn’t the only person who was impressed. This is my post from that day (from the first linked thread): That seems a little gushing to me now, but I haven’t lived to regret it yet. [/QUOTE] Michael Jordan? I sure hope that Obama does as well for his team as MJ did for his! I spent the last 40 minutes or so split between watching the 2004 keynote speech and reading the two linked threads. Quite a few things really stood out to me. 1. Many people were predicting a successful Obama campaign in '12, '16, or even '20. Nobody had any idea that we would have a chance to become excited about a candidate this soon. 2. Even back then, people were saying he was all talk and no substance. I don’t think those people are paying attention. What I think happens, is Obama gives a powerful example of, say, a father who can’t afford medicine for his son. This makes people think, “wow, I can see myself in that situation, and it would suck.” He then goes on to say how we need to retain jobs so that people don’t lose their health care. He’s addressing two issues that need to be fixed, but the detractors are still dazzled about how they wouldn’t want to be in that dad’s shoes, and missed the next few lines of his speech. 3. Another common line is that he delivers the same ideas and/or ideas as other politicians, he just happens to do so with more skill. Well, duh! Nobody ever criticized Roger Clemens or Randy Johnson for throwing the same old ball as everybody else. The delivery _is_ important. Otherwise, Obama would just be another washed up rich old guy that nobody gives a shit about. 4. I would have quoted my favorite parts of the speech, but I would have just transcribed the last 1/3 of it. 5. Is it just me, or do Obama’s speeches remind anybody else of a cross between Morpheus from the Matrix and Dwayne “The Rock” Johnson? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 9:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710/76 "2008-02-23T09:23:40Z")
[QUOTE=Santo Rugger] 1. Many people were predicting a successful Obama campaign in '12, '16, or even '20. Nobody had any idea that we would have a chance to become excited about a candidate this soon. [/quote] Yup. A lot of us, myself certainly included, bought into conventional political wisdom - he’s too young, Senators don’t get elected President, he’ll be just as good in eight or 12 years as he is now. What we didn’t predict - whether he wins or loses the nomination or the general - is that this turned out that this is Obama’s moment. ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710/77 "2008-02-23T14:38:06Z")
[QUOTE=Marley23] Yup. A lot of us, myself certainly included, bought into conventional political wisdom - he’s too young, Senators don’t get elected President, he’ll be just as good in eight or 12 years as he is now. What we didn’t predict - whether he wins or loses the nomination or the general - is that this turned out that this is Obama’s moment. [/QUOTE] There’s no question this is Obama’s moment. He has passed the point of no return and he knows it, the interesting part of all of this is that maybe someone else would have hoped and planned for a run against Hillary and that’s it…but Obama planned far beyond that, he planned on surpassing her and had a detailed plan on how to walk right into the Oval office. The preparation on his part is extraordinary - and evident when you look at the last 2 months alone. Couple this with the recent NYT article stating people in HRC’s camp is basically dedicating 50% in the campaign and 50% in an exit strategy to elevate HRC in the Senate. ---
**Author:** ![TWDuke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e495f1/32.png) [@TWDuke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TWDuke)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710/78 "2008-02-23T18:36:03Z")
[QUOTE=cricetus] So my question is, can you say all this with a straight face? Can you really equate “you’re likable enough” with repeated lame charges of plagiarism? Can you equate… um… saying “you’re likable enough” (because you got nothing else against him) with saying “Oh, sure, those states don’t count… wait… wait… wait… it’s over… i won?.. they should count!” [/QUOTE] I haven’t equated anything. Can you say with a straight face there’s no evidence that many people are eager to give the most cynical interpretation to neutral or even positive statements by Hillary’s camp? Can you say with a straight face that many people are eager to gloss over anything potentially troublesome said by the Obama camp? If you don’t see evidence of all that in this very thread, I don’t know what use there would be in my digging up more. Or is only Hillary responsible for things said on her behalf? Or do you honestly buy the myth that the Obama campaign is nothing but sunshine and lollipops? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-honored-to-be-sitting-next-to-barack-obama/438710.md?page=3)