# I am NOT society's baby making machine!!! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 2, 2004, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143 "2004-07-02T00:45:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 10:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/21 "2004-07-02T10:52:36Z")
> [@Amazon Floozy Goddess](#): > > I’m just recently married (June 5th). At this point in my life, I don’t want kids. I’m only 24, so yeah, there is a chance I might want them eventually. But, in order to have one, the right conditions would be: > > -Good enough health in order to keep complications to a minimum for both me and baby > > -Enough money to be able to support the baby and still pay bills, food, etc. without worry > > -For me to have some kind of work-from-home job so I could give my child deserved attention; I don’t want a babysitter raising my kid. Just a couple of pointers, my friend: 1. Your fertility will drop off after about 28-30. This does not mean that you should have children immediately - or at all - just be aware that there really is a biological clock, it’s ticking, and the alarm may go off sooner than you expect. 2. If you have baby, you have worry. Nontheless, most muddle through. 3. Work-at-home-doesn’t-need-babysitter - BIG FAT STINKING LIE!!! _Don’t_ believe this! I’ve known numerous women who work from home, with small children. You WILL need a sitter because otherwise the little darling will be driving you to distraction and you’ll never get anything done. Every woman I’ve know who’s done the work from home thing has HAD to get a sitter to keep the tyke occupied while she’s working. _Every single one._ Using a sitter/nanny does NOT mean someone else is raising your kid - your kid still knows who mommy is, don’t worry. However, the notion that one woman raises one child on her own is a modern fallacy. In time past, women shared the child raising burden, taking turns watching groups of kids, babbysitting for sisters, cousins, daughters, friends, etc… _It is perfectly natural to use other adults to help you raise your children._ It is NOT natural to expect a woman to spend 24/7 with her offspring without a break. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/22 "2004-07-02T11:56:31Z")
> [@](#): > > You can’t take away my birth control. You can’t take away my right to work. You can’t take away my right to live my life as I see fit. Then I would think you support the war on terrorism and the liberation of Iraq, because under the terrorists or S.H.'s Iraq women wouldn’t have these rights. That out of the way, The Dr. has to live with him/herself, if there is a moral reason that a Dr objects to a certain medication then he/she should let you know of his/her objections. You are free to get another Dr for any reason you wish. I really don’t see an issue here. Taken to an extreme, would you want to live in a world where Dr’s who know in their hearts that ‘partial birth abortion’ is infantaside, but forced by the state to perform this procedure? ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 11:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/23 "2004-07-02T11:57:54Z")
Yeah, I’ve got to back up Broomstick here. Lady Chance is in software design and currently telecommutes from home. We have the 4 year old in daycare and the newborn (soon!) will go to child care when Lady Chance gets off maternity leave. She’s solid on the believe that, should she have to take care of the kids she could not perform her job adequately. ---
**Author:** ![Podkayne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Podkayne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Podkayne)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/24 "2004-07-02T14:21:53Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Then I would think you support the war on terrorism and the liberation of Iraq, because under the terrorists or S.H.'s Iraq women wouldn’t have these rights. Nice attempt at a hijack. I can’t believe anyone thinks they can get away with such a fatuous argument on these boards. I’m sure then that you’re in favor of committing U.S. resources to attacking _every_ governement in the entire world that denies civil rights to its citizens. Or do you agree with the current administration that we should just go after oil-rich countries that make convenient scapegoats? ---
**Author:** ![Ninja\_Pizza\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f04885/32.png) [@Ninja\_Pizza\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ninja_Pizza_Guy)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/25 "2004-07-02T14:33:28Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > Then I would think you support the war on terrorism and the liberation of Iraq, because under the terrorists or S.H.'s Iraq women wouldn’t have these rights. Uh-huh. And **which** current American administration is having conniptions over providing birth control? ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/26 "2004-07-02T14:34:53Z")
> [@](#): > > **WeirdDave** said: > I somehow got usernames confused and thought this was posted by catsix, who is arguing with me in the circumcision thread that circumcision out to be banned because she thinks it’s bad. A thousand apologies, I messed this one up. So an argument that you otherwise find reasonable because it comes from someone else would automatically be nutjob material if it came from me? I have a severe problem with doctors who refuse to allow me, an adult person of sound mind, to make a choice regarding my own body. I don’t see how this is inconsistent with my belief that other people don’t have an absolute right to make permanent choices about other people’s bodies. But really, if I do talk about my anger at the medical profession for allowing **me** to have **my body** altered as an adult, you’ll think I’m crazy? ---
**Author:** ![Amazon\_Floozy\_Goddess](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/779978/32.png) [@Amazon\_Floozy\_Goddess](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amazon_Floozy_Goddess)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/27 "2004-07-02T14:35:53Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Using a sitter/nanny does NOT mean someone else is raising your kid - your kid still knows who mommy is, don’t worry. However, the notion that one woman raises one child on her own is a modern fallacy. In time past, women shared the child raising burden, taking turns watching groups of kids, babbysitting for sisters, cousins, daughters, friends, etc… _It is perfectly natural to use other adults to help you raise your children._ It is NOT natural to expect a woman to spend 24/7 with her offspring without a break. This doesn’t apply to everyone. A few months after my mom had me, she developed degenerative discs in her back, which was followed up by two types of arthritis. She was (and is to this day) in constant pain, and had to quit her job. She was at home 24/7 with my brother and I while my dad worked. To date she has had 14 back surgeries, plus gallbladder removal and a hysterectomy. Despite her pain she did a wonderful job of raising and looking after us. She is a great mom and was always there when we needed her. Looking back, she’s told me that she does not regret staying home with us. Yes, we had financial trouble, but we were rich in love (sounds corny, but true). My grandma died when my mom was my age, and my dad’s mom lived out-of-province, so she had no help. And she did it. ---
**Author:** ![Mehitabel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8797f3/32.png) [@Mehitabel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mehitabel)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/28 "2004-07-02T14:47:59Z")
> [@Ninja Pizza Guy](#): > > Uh-huh. And **which** current American administration is having conniptions over providing birth control? Well, they’re not crazy about using abortion (a form of the death penalty they don’t support) as a method of birth control, but the Bush administration is and has, based on the success of the Uganda AIDS campaign, [actually advocating condoms](http://www.gaypasg.org/Press%20Clippings/2004/June%202004/bush_backs_condom_use_to_prevent.htm) if you absolutely cannot keep it zipped up: > [@](#): > > udy by the group in 2002 showed that underdeveloped countries need 10 billion condoms a year and were getting only 2.5 billion. > > In fact, although neither the Bush nor the Clinton administration advertised it, the United States has long been the world’s largest supplier of condoms to such countries. In 1990, through the Agency for International Development, it donated 800 million condoms to poor countries. That dropped to a low of 186 million in 1999, in the Clinton administration, then rose to 458 million last year and is on track to reach 550 million this year, said Dr. E. Anne Peterson, the agency’s assistant administrator for global health. > > “We’ve more than doubled condom availability during this administration, primarily for H.I.V.-AIDS,” Dr. Peterson said. “Before, it was a mix of family planning and AIDS, but the big increase is for AIDS prevention.” > > Groups that have consistently criticized Mr. Bush’s AIDS policy seemed nonplused. No one on a 1 p.m. telephone news conference held to denounce the speech had listened to it. I’ll bet. Didn’t want to hijack, just fighting ignorance and all that. ---
**Author:** ![mrklutz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ebca7d/32.png) [@mrklutz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mrklutz)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/29 "2004-07-02T15:12:07Z")
> [@SanibelMan](#): > > I’m curious, since I don’t have any experience with this myself: How do doctors respond to men who want to have vasectomies who haven’t had children? I mean, they’re reversible, but that’s risky and certainly not guaranteed. So do doctors pull the same kind of “we know what you’ll want in 10 years” crap on guys that they do on women who want their tubes tied, or is it never an issue? Yes, in my experience, society assumes that absolutely everyone will want to have children. I approached the subject several times with doctors when I was younger. All of them strongly discouraged me from getting a vasectomy on the grounds that I would change my mind at some point in my life and want children. I didn’t argue too hard because other birth control options were available, and I’d already gotten tired of everyone assuming that I would eventually change my mind and want to spawn. I’ve known since I was a teenager that I do not want children, but very few people seemed to believe that I really knew what I wanted. Now that I’m pushing 40, people finally seem to accept that I really don’t want them and never did. ---
**Author:** ![BlueKangaroo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3d9bf3/32.png) [@BlueKangaroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlueKangaroo)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/30 "2004-07-02T16:58:49Z")
First, thanks to **elfbabe** for posting a link to this article. Second, **astro** , I _did_ do something with my hair, and it might have helped in catching Mr. Kangaroo. However, we still have no intention of providing you with any kinderoos, nor any joeys. 😉 Now then. It has been pointed out that I can get a new doctor if I encounter this for myself. This is all well and good, and it is in fact what I intend to do if I am faced with a stituation like this. However, it could be a lot easier said than done. Insurance companies often assign a PCP to a person, and in some cases, it takes nearly an act of Og to change it. No, this isn’t always the case, but I’d hate to find myself fighting a war on two fronts. Also, I feel that perhaps I was not clear enough on everything I objected to. In the end, I hate that a doctor or pharmacist would force their morality on me and object strongly to it. Conversely, I don’t want to commit the same crime, of forcing him or her to conform to my morality. It can be a slippery slope. But it also can be very simple: You don’t have to provide me with hormonal birth control. I don’t have to give you my money. I don’t have to keep my mouth shut about my objections to your potential patients. These patients can then choose for themselves if they want to see you. My biggest concern is that I don’t want an outspoken minority to influence all of healthcare, or worse to besome an outspoken majority and possibly make these types of birth control illegal. ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/31 "2004-07-02T17:04:14Z")
> [@catsix](#): > > So an argument that you otherwise find reasonable because it comes from someone else would automatically be nutjob material if it came from me? > > I have a severe problem with doctors who refuse to allow me, an adult person of sound mind, to make a choice regarding my own body. I don’t see how this is inconsistent with my belief that other people don’t have an absolute right to make permanent choices about other people’s bodies. > > But really, if I do talk about my anger at the medical profession for allowing **me** to have **my body** altered as an adult, you’ll think I’m crazy? As I said, i confused you with someone else, but now you’ve gone right ahead and done what I was talking about. In this case, it is _wrong_ for someone else to make a determination about your right to be sterilized or use birth control. In the other thread it is _right_ for someone else (like you) to determine what procedures a parent can have done for their child. (Even though you keep ignoring it, it is a parent’s legal duty and right to determine what is done to their kid. You just can’t seem to wrap your brain around the FACT that children are not emancipated, and I notice you haven’t responded at all to Malthus’ repeted question about his situation) Hypocrite. ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/32 "2004-07-02T17:09:11Z")
You’re digging pretty hard to find a contradiction there. In both cases I think that the ultimate decision regarding permanent alteration of a person’s body in a case where that body is functioning normally should be made by that person, when that person is legally an adult. They’re very consistent positions. Of course, with the way _you_ painted things, it’d be perfectly acceptable for parents to decide to sterilize their children at birth. ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/33 "2004-07-02T17:26:42Z")
> [@catsix](#): > > Of course, with the way _you_ painted things, it’d be perfectly acceptable for parents to decide to sterilize their children at birth. Damn! I am found out! My secret “sterilize the children” adjenda is revealed! Oh, woe is me! ---
**Author:** ![Tiggrkitty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tiggrkitty/32/17966_2.png) [@Tiggrkitty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tiggrkitty)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/34 "2004-07-02T17:33:41Z")
> [@Katriona](#): > > I’ve never been denied my pills, but I’ve been having a bitch of a time finding a doctor who will give me a damn tubal. Apparently since I’m ‘only’ 35,’ I’m too young to know what I ‘really’ want. Boy do I know this one. For three years my doctor kept trying to get me off the pill and my reply was always, “when do you plan on tying my tubes?” When I turned 27, he asked again and I said the exact same thing. I do not want children, regardless of who I am with. Either tie the tubes or write out the prescription. His comment was rather amusing. He said he had talked to several of his colleagues and none of them would touch a tube on someone my age, and the fact that I have never been pregnant to start with. We discussed other forms of birth control but I stood my ground. My argument was simply this, "it is not like you are removing my ovaries or uterus. _IF_ I were to change my mind I could always a) have them untied, b) go invitro OR c) adopt. At twenty seven I had my tubes tied, that was almost two decades ago, and I have not regreted that decision one bit. It is possible to have a tubal at a young age without having children. You just have to find the right doctor and be firm in your conviction. ---
**Author:** ![Elza\_B](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Elza\_B](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elza_B)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/35 "2004-07-02T17:37:55Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Just a couple of pointers, my friend: > > 1. Your fertility will drop off after about 28-30. This does not mean that you should have children immediately - or at all - just be aware that there really is a biological clock, it’s ticking, and the alarm may go off sooner than you expect. > > 2. If you have baby, you have worry. Nontheless, most muddle through. > > 3. Work-at-home-doesn’t-need-babysitter - BIG FAT STINKING LIE!!! _Don’t_ believe this! I’ve known numerous women who work from home, with small children. You WILL need a sitter because otherwise the little darling will be driving you to distraction and you’ll never get anything done. Every woman I’ve know who’s done the work from home thing has HAD to get a sitter to keep the tyke occupied while she’s working. _Every single one._ > > Using a sitter/nanny does NOT mean someone else is raising your kid - your kid still knows who mommy is, don’t worry. However, the notion that one woman raises one child on her own is a modern fallacy. In time past, women shared the child raising burden, taking turns watching groups of kids, babbysitting for sisters, cousins, daughters, friends, etc… _It is perfectly natural to use other adults to help you raise your children._ It is NOT natural to expect a woman to spend 24/7 with her offspring without a break. Thank you, thank you, thank you. That’s one of my serious pet peeves. In essence, my brother and I are being told “Your mother didn’t raise you because you were at baby-sitters.” Umm, no. My mother, for all of her faults and problems, RAISED us while working a full-time job, maintaining a house, and keeping up with various outside activities and friends. My brother and I grew up happy, healthy (I have a few health issues, but nothing that stemmed from daycare), and successful. And you know what? Aside from the one baby-sitter who is still a family friend, I don’t remember any of their names. And when we have children in a year or two, unless we win the lottery or my fiance greatly increases his income, my children will be in daycare, for two reasons: I LIKE my work - I am happy and successful, and I enjoy what I do, and two, because we can’t afford to be a one-income household unless we win the lottery or I sell my childrens’ book and become the next JK Rowling, and if someone was going to stay home, it would be mr avabeth because I will make more money shortly. We have no qualms about that. We plan on being VERY involved in our childrens’ lives, and raising the same happy and healthy kids that my parents did. Back to the OP - as far as BC, my insurance company refuses to pay for my birth control that’s prescribed for a VERY SEVERE case of endometriosis without authorization from my doctor. And even then, they will only pay for one pack a month, instead of the continuous three months worth that I need - so I end up paying out of pocket anyway. So wait a second - you won’t pay for me to control a serious medical condition properly, nor will you pay for us to control our own fertility and NOT have a child that we can’t afford, but you’re perfectly willing to pay for labor, delivery, and prenatal care of a child that we’re not ready for. I mean, what the fuck? And I’ve never come across a pharmacist who’s refused my BC pills, but I did asked to be transferred to another OB-GYN when the one I was seeing refused to prescribe the BC pills because I was unmarried and he didn’t think there were enough symptoms to look into a possible medical condition like endometriosis (which has since been diagnosed, and which has since been treated). I was young at the time, so I didn’t think there was anything wrong with it. I simply requested to be transferred to a doctor that would prescribe them (I wasn’t having sex at the time, I just knew that the pills helped me have a lighter period and not be curled up in the fetal position for three days a month, throwing up). Should it happen again today, I would probably speak out. Ava ---
**Author:** ![sperfur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9adbd/32.png) [@sperfur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sperfur)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/36 "2004-07-02T17:48:05Z")
> [@Katriona](#): > > I’ve never been denied my pills, but I’ve been having a bitch of a time finding a doctor who will give me a damn tubal. Apparently since I’m ‘only’ 35,’ I’m too young to know what I ‘really’ want. I was only 23 when I had mine, and I didn’t have any kids! No arguments, just asked me if I was sure and told me I should think if it as irreversable. Have you checked into a female GYN? ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/37 "2004-07-02T17:51:03Z")
> [@Katriona](#): > > I’ve never been denied my pills, but I’ve been having a bitch of a time finding a doctor who will give me a damn tubal. Apparently since I’m ‘only’ 35,’ I’m too young to know what I ‘really’ want. Could be worse. After I was born (1968) my mother wanted her tubes tied (draw whatever cause and effect conclusions you want) and was informed by her doctor that in Ohio it was illegal for any woman to be sterilized regardless of her age unless she had four living children. Men on the other hand could be sterilized at any time with no living child requirement. Mom informs me that this was the moment she became irrevocably pro-choice. > [@A Monkey With A Gun](#): > > I haven’t read the article, so I don’t know what it entails, but if I was a doctor I’d have a problem prescribing a birth control method that would hurt the patients fertility later on. But it wouldn’t be your responsibility as a doctor to worry about her future fertility beyond advising her of the possibility of infertility. That attitude is socondescending toward women, as if they are incapable of deciding for themselves whether to take the medical risk. ---
**Author:** ![sperfur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9adbd/32.png) [@sperfur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sperfur)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/38 "2004-07-02T18:01:13Z")
> [@Mehitabel](#): > > Well, they’re not crazy about using abortion ( **a form of the death penalty they don’t support** ) as a method of birth control… > Didn’t want to hijack, just fighting ignorance and all that. bolding mine Ummm, if you were really _fighting ignorance_, you wouldn’t have interjected your opinion into this statement as fact. ---
**Author:** ![Podkayne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Podkayne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Podkayne)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/39 "2004-07-02T18:02:42Z")
> [@BlueKangaroo](#): > > Now then. It has been pointed out that I can get a new doctor if I encounter this for myself. This is all well and good, and it is in fact what I intend to do if I am faced with a stituation like this. However, it could be a lot easier said than done. Insurance companies often assign a PCP to a person, and in some cases, it takes nearly an act of Og to change it. No, this isn’t always the case, but I’d hate to find myself fighting a war on two fronts. Not to mention women in smaller towns or rural areas who have very few OB/GYNs to choose from. What if the only pharmacy in your town decides not to dispense hormonal birth control, and the next town over is an hour’s drive away? Despite the Free Market, a trend of this sort could really limit birth control options for many women. ---
**Author:** ![Coelacanth\_Soup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Coelacanth\_Soup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coelacanth_Soup)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2004, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143/40 "2004-07-02T18:21:19Z")
> [@](#): > > Not to mention women in smaller towns or rural areas who have very few OB/GYNs to choose from. What if the only pharmacy in your town decides not to dispense hormonal birth control, and the next town over is an hour’s drive away? > > Despite the Free Market, a trend of this sort could really limit birth control options for many women. Too bad. It is not OK to force someone to do something that they find morally reprehensable just so life will be more convienient and inexpensive for you. We have to respect other people’s moral values and choices. I’m really sorry if that makes life difficult for some people but we can’t start forcing people to violate their moral values just to make life a little easier for certain other people. We have people here claiming outrage that a doctor would try to force a woman to do something with her body and her life because of the doctor’s moral views, and then they turn right around and argue that the doctor should do something with his body and his life in order to conform to the patient’s moral views. Do you not see the irony? And if you don’t trust your doctor’s judgement in the first place why would you even want that doctor performing a medical procedure on you? Especially if it were a procedure that the doctor didn’t want to perform in the first place. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-not-societys-baby-making-machine/253143.md?page=3)