# I am pissed off at failure of S.3816 (the anti-outsourcing bill) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 5, 2010, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167 "2010-10-05T19:42:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![ratatoskK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ratatoskk/32/2987_2.png) [@ratatoskK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ratatoskK)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2010, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/1 "2010-10-05T19:42:49Z")
I can’t believe that the entire country is not up in arms because this anti-outsourcing bill failed to pass. [Here is a brief article](http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/29/us/politics/29cong.html?scp=1&sq=outsourcing%20jobs%20bill&st=cse) and [here is a more in-depth description.](http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-s3816/show) I’m recovering from surgery and don’t have the energy to rant on and on about it, but I really an just flabbergasted that people don’t realize how outsourcing is ruining our economy. There are people who will NEVER get their jobs back unless they move to some third-world environment or become maids. ---
**Author:** ![purplehorseshoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/purplehorseshoe/32/2996_2.png) [@purplehorseshoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehorseshoe)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2010, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/2 "2010-10-05T19:49:36Z")
Huh. To be honest, it’s the first I’ve heard of it. ---
**Author:** ![descamisado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e480ec/32.png) [@descamisado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/descamisado)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2010, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/3 "2010-10-05T19:55:27Z")
I’ve heard about this bill. For the Republicans to unanimously block this bill and accuse the Democrats of political grandstanding is the height of . . . well, political grandstanding. Anybody who is willing to still believe that the Republican is the party of other than “No!” or have any of this country’s and any of their constituents’ interests at heart have got to have their fingers in the ears, hands over their eyes and smoke-filled asses. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2010, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/4 "2010-10-05T20:28:35Z")
Word on the street is that Republicans didn’t vote on this bill because it was written in such a way to penalize **all** companies who have bases off-shore, not just those who manufacture goods elsewhere for sale here. It does make sense to object to businesses that produce things off shore for distribution in the countries where things are made to be lumped in with those who are off shoring manufacturing simply to raise profit margins. Obviously there are companies who do both things, but the overlap is probably not 100% ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2010, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/5 "2010-10-05T20:54:12Z")
Paging **Le Jacquelope** … ---
**Author:** ![Chessic\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7c8e57/32.png) [@Chessic\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chessic_Sense)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2010, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/6 "2010-10-05T20:59:22Z")
> [@ratatoskK](#): > > I’m recovering from surgery and don’t have the energy to rant on and on about it, but I really an just flabbergasted that people don’t realize how outsourcing is ruining our economy. There are people who will NEVER get their jobs back unless they move to some third-world environment or become maids. So move to a third-world environment, become a maid, or actually become…y’know…useful to the country. Then you’ll have a job. What’s the problem? ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2010, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/7 "2010-10-05T21:07:13Z")
> [@ratatoskK](#): > > I can’t believe that the entire country is not up in arms because this anti-outsourcing bill failed to pass. > > [Here is a brief article](http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/29/us/politics/29cong.html?scp=1&sq=outsourcing%20jobs%20bill&st=cse) and [here is a more in-depth description.](http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-s3816/show) > > I’m recovering from surgery and don’t have the energy to rant on and on about it, but I really an just flabbergasted that people don’t realize how outsourcing is ruining our economy. There are people who will NEVER get their jobs back unless they move to some third-world environment or become maids. You’re not entitled to a job. If your job is sent overseas, learn something more valuable, like how to clean houses. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2010, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/8 "2010-10-05T21:15:33Z")
> [@elfkin477](#): > > Word on the street is that Republicans didn’t vote on this bill because it was written in such a way to penalize **all** companies who have bases off-shore, not just those who manufacture goods elsewhere for sale here. Really? Quoting from the first link in the OP: > [@](#): > > “This is about as pure a political exercise as you can get,” Mr. McConnell said in a floor speech. He added, “The way to get U.S. businesses to produce more here isn’t to tax them even further, it’s to stop punishing them with our high corporate tax rate.” Which sounds like the Republicans want to give a gift to all U.S. corporations, whether they outsource or not. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2010, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/9 "2010-10-05T21:53:32Z")
You know what would be great for making companies want to keep employing people in the U.S.? Universal, government-sponsored, single-payer health care. We’re getting killed in the global market because our companies have to take on a huge additional burden that those in other countries don’t. ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2010, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/10 "2010-10-05T22:18:53Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > > [@ratatoskK](#): > > > > I can’t believe that the entire country is not up in arms because this anti-outsourcing bill failed to pass. > > > > [Here is a brief article](http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/29/us/politics/29cong.html?scp=1&sq=outsourcing%20jobs%20bill&st=cse) and [here is a more in-depth description.](http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-s3816/show) > > > > I’m recovering from surgery and don’t have the energy to rant on and on about it, but I really an just flabbergasted that people don’t realize how outsourcing is ruining our economy. There are people who will NEVER get their jobs back unless they move to some third-world environment or become maids. > > You’re not entitled to a job. If your job is sent overseas, learn something more valuable, like how to clean houses. Sorry. Those jobs are all taken by illegal immigrants. ---
**Author:** ![Walmarticus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Walmarticus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walmarticus)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/11 "2010-10-06T00:19:26Z")
I can’t even begin to imagine how outsourcing is ruining our economy. I can’t even begin to imagine how to begin imagining how outsourcing is ruining our economy. ---
**Author:** ![sleeping](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/839c29/32.png) [@sleeping](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sleeping)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/12 "2010-10-06T02:13:49Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > You know what would be great for making companies want to keep employing people in the U.S.? Universal, government-sponsored, single-payer health care. We’re getting killed in the global market because our companies have to take on a huge additional burden that those in other countries don’t. Yep. It’s been the major problem for business profits for a long time. > [@](#): > > NYT, 2004: > A relentless rise in the cost of employee health insurance has become a significant factor in the employment slump, as the labor market adds only a trickle of new jobs each month despite nearly three years of uninterrupted economic growth… employers big and small…remain reluctant to hire full-time employees because health insurance, which now costs the nation’s employers an average of about $3,000 a year for each worker, has become one of the fastest-growing costs… Health premiums are sapping corporate balance sheets even more than the rising cost of energy. > > [The Nation, 2004](http://www.thenation.com/print/article/single-payer-good-business): > Canada has had a single-payer system for more than thirty years. (Australia, Denmark, Finland, Iceland, Sweden and Taiwan also have one.) American executives who have run Canadian subsidiaries see it as a business boon. Take General Motors. In 2003 its costs of building a midsize car in Canada were $1,400 less than building the identical car in the United States (the comparable figures for DaimlerChrysler and Ford were $1,300 and $1,200). Such savings are no mystery. Canadian companies pay far less in taxes for health coverage for everyone than the premiums they would pay under the US system to provide their employees with comparable benefits. Wonder why that never came up during the healthcare debates? Dang librul media. ---
**Author:** ![Balthisar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/balthisar/32/2825_2.png) [@Balthisar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balthisar)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/13 "2010-10-06T13:15:03Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > You know what would be great for making companies want to keep employing people in the U.S.? Universal, government-sponsored, single-payer health care. We’re getting killed in the global market because our companies have to take on a huge additional burden that those in other countries don’t. We’re not getting killed. We’re still the world’s largest economy. And I don’t think health care has anything to do with manufacturing low cost consumer goods in Mexico, China, Thailand, etc. If that were the case, we’d be pissed at the Canadians 'cos “They took er jerbs!” > [@Walmarticus](#): > > I can’t even begin to imagine how outsourcing is ruining our economy. I can’t even begin to imagine how to begin imagining how outsourcing is ruining our economy. The economy is a measure of production, not a measure of jobs. “Our” economy is recovering, and a lot of that is _because_ we’re able to outsource. Do note, though, that “our” economy really is global, and no one at any level can be self-sufficient and also grow. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/14 "2010-10-06T13:30:58Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > You’re not entitled to a job. If your job is sent overseas, learn something more valuable, like how to clean houses. Yay Republicans! Country first! Rah rah! It’s all about jobs. Americans need jobs. Unless you bitch about Republicans wanting to ship your job to Rangoon in which case, fuck you, go sell oranges on the freeway. I’m sure glad the Republicans have all our best interests in their hearts. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/15 "2010-10-06T13:38:03Z")
> [@Balthisar](#): > > > [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > > > You know what would be great for making companies want to keep employing people in the U.S.? Universal, government-sponsored, single-payer health care. We’re getting killed in the global market because our companies have to take on a huge additional burden that those in other countries don’t. > > We’re not getting killed. We’re still the world’s largest economy. This is pretty funny. Is dysfunction in the system completely invisible until we’re not? “We’re fine we’re fine we’re fine ohhhh shit we’re fucked we’re fucked we’re fucked!” ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/16 "2010-10-06T13:46:05Z")
Dysfunction in the system =/= getting killed. [QUOTE=elfkin] Word on the street is that Republicans didn’t vote on this bill because it was written in such a way to penalize all companies who have bases off-shore, not just those who manufacture goods elsewhere for sale here… [/QUOTE] What street is that, exactly? ---
**Author:** ![Binarydrone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3da27b/32.png) [@Binarydrone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Binarydrone)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/17 "2010-10-06T15:09:23Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Dysfunction in the system =/= getting killed. > > [QUOTE=elfkin] > Word on the street is that Republicans didn’t vote on this bill because it was written in such a way to penalize all companies who have bases off-shore, not just those who manufacture goods elsewhere for sale here… What street is that, exactly? [/QUOTE] Wall Street, naturally. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/18 "2010-10-06T15:17:07Z")
> [@Balthisar](#): > > We’re not getting killed. We’re still the world’s largest economy. Okay, let me rephrase this in a way you can understand: Companies that wish to employ primarily U.S. residents cannot remain competitive on a global market with companies that employ primarily residents of countries where the government carries the burden of providing health care. It doesn’t matter how much money the companies \*based \*here are making if people in the U.S. can’t get jobs working for them. The average person in the U.S. with health insurance through their employer doesn’t understand just how expensive it is. Talk to someone who’s lost their job during the recession, and I’ll bet they can tell you how ridiculous their COBRA payments were (or are). Thing is, that’s exactly what your plan cost all along–your employer was just subsidizing most of it. ETA: Imagine adding $5,000 or more per year to everyone’s salary if you employ someone in the U.S. That’s what health care does. ---
**Author:** ![Binarydrone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3da27b/32.png) [@Binarydrone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Binarydrone)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/19 "2010-10-06T15:20:42Z")
The problem with outsourcing is really a problem of human nature. What I think happened is that you had some middle manager sell this stupid fucking idea somewhere and then it caught on and now we have a bunch of people that feel like they have to defend it because if they admit that it is stupid and doesn’t really work all that well then they also have to fess up and admit that they are were wrong. What this is really about is subjugation. See, you had this emerging class of workers (IT, for the most part) that had skills that were in high demand and who didn’t buy into the whole busyness man, pinstripe, executive haircut #4 Caucasian silverback gorilla hype. So hey hey! Fuck you, off goes your job to India. Those of you that survive the “right sizing” will be grateful to be here and put your khaki on like good drones. Never mind that when you factor in all of the training and correcting fuckups and culture gaps and the like that the whole thing is a terrible cock up. To say nothing of the fact that it pisses consumers off. The important thing is that bob the middle manager has a figure that looks good on his quarterly spread sheet and that these uppity little people are reminded of who the boss is. ---
**Author:** ![Walmarticus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Walmarticus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walmarticus)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2010, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167/20 "2010-10-06T15:33:03Z")
> [@Binarydrone](#): > > The problem with outsourcing is really a problem of human nature. What I think happened is that you had some middle manager sell this stupid fucking idea somewhere and then it caught on and now we have a bunch of people that feel like they have to defend it because if they admit that it is stupid and doesn’t really work all that well then they also have to fess up and admit that they are were wrong. > > What this is really about is subjugation. See, you had this emerging class of workers (IT, for the most part) that had skills that were in high demand and who didn’t buy into the whole busyness man, pinstripe, executive haircut #4 Caucasian silverback gorilla hype. So hey hey! Fuck you, off goes your job to India. Those of you that survive the “right sizing” will be grateful to be here and put your khaki on like good drones. > > Never mind that when you factor in all of the training and correcting fuckups and culture gaps and the like that the whole thing is a terrible cock up. To say nothing of the fact that it pisses consumers off. The important thing is that bob the middle manager has a figure that looks good on his quarterly spread sheet and that these uppity little people are reminded of who the boss is. It’s an interesting (crazy) theory. I still find it more plausible that foreigners will work cheaper. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-am-pissed-off-at-failure-of-s-3816-the-anti-outsourcing-bill/556167.md?page=2)